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Shorai batteries

Discussion in 'Norton Motorcycles (Modern)' started by Fast Eddie, Dec 15, 2017.

  1. TonyA

    TonyA VIP MEMBER

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    Jan 16, 2015
    MXMartin has done some good troubleshooting . A few more steps and I think were on to something .
     
  2. Kid Thunder

    Kid Thunder

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2018
    Just be careful not to completely discharge it. If you do it will never come back! My EBR came with one. The bike developed a current draw more than normal with key off. Went to start it in spring & it was deader than dead. It was on a Battery Tender charger all winter. They made good for it. But you can't revive a completely dead Shorai like a lead battery.
     
    Britfan60 likes this.
  3. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

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    Oct 4, 2013
    Yes, I killed one that way once too! But I have since read somewhere on t’internet that they can revived somehow...?
     
  4. speirmoor

    speirmoor VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    Ive been researching it. Long story short, you give the battery 12V from a regular lead acid charger slowly and if you can get it to 2V switch back to the Shorai charger. I'm days away from trying this as I'm not near the bike at present so wont be able to report success/failure for a while
     
  5. MxMartin

    MxMartin

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2017
    I really only managed to get to resolve two things...

    1. My initial current drain of 40mA whilst parked was due to fitting a USB port which was either dodgy (made in China) or naturally required a drain in order to provide the 5V output.... either way I removed it and my drain dropped to 19mA.

    2. I disconnected various parts of the harness and it was most definitely the supply to the ecu which was taking the full 19mA, once unplugged my drain was 0mA.

    The Shorai charger that I use has kept my battery in tip-top condition in the 'store' mode and although the manual says it maintains the lithium battery at around the 50-60% charge in that mode it is sufficient to start the bike from cold so I have given up worrying about the current drain. The battery has been on store for this Winter and today my 961 started up for 1st time since Octoberwithout hesitation :)
     
    Fast Eddie likes this.
  6. speirmoor

    speirmoor VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    Good work Martin. Yes I was good on "Store" mode also until I forgot to set it after moving the bike.
    Can the supply to the ECU be isolated from the Clocks does anyone know ?
     
  7. MxMartin

    MxMartin

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2017
    The one point I must make if using a dedicated lithium charger is that my particular one (Shorai) detects loss of mains power supply and shuts down but doesn't return to trickle charge once mains power is reinstated. I live in rural Lincolnshire where we get regular breaks in power and so I do need to check the charger periodically to make sure it is still doing it's job!
     
  8. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Reading thru all of this and other threads on Li batteries has me asking if they are worth the trouble.
    I don't think any of the big manufacturers are supplying new bikes with Li batteries, even on extra cost R model sportbikes for which the weight number is all important.
    If they could knock off five or six pounds just by using a different battery, they would, provided that battery choice did not create extra warranty issues.
    So it seems that adding a Li battery at this time is just adding another potential failure point.
    There are more than enough of those already!

    Glen
     
  9. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    I don’t think Shorai batteries have caused any problems to 961 owners on here’s Glen.

    They may well handle other problems, like power drainage, less well than a big lead battery, but that’s hardly the batteries fault.

    Having said that, I’m not even sure they do handle the other problems less well. Regular battery life on 961s seems short.

    I’ve got one on mine and it’s been utterly trouble free. I haven’t even put it on a charge yet, and I’ve only managed to do 900 miles on it in a year.

    Given where the battery is mounted on these bikes, way up high, I personally like the weight reduction.

    I’ve got Shorai batteries on all of my bikes.
     
  10. BritTwit

    BritTwit VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2009
    Glen,

    For the time being, I agree.
    To me, 10lb saving isn't worth the potential hassles.
    I don't want to do the R&D on these batteries for the motorcycle companies.
    We're already doing R&D for Norton on our 961's.
    When Honda adopts Lithium cells for their bikes, it'll be time for me to switch.
     
  11. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    What am I missing? What hassles?
     
  12. Claudio

    Claudio

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    Dec 3, 2018
    I have been using a Li battery for two years on a Guzzi and it goes very well!
     
  13. MxMartin

    MxMartin

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2017
    My Shorai has behaved itself, packs a punch and has been on the 961 for almost 12mth so I could be a convert if it continues ....
     
  14. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    I count four dead young Shorai plus two dead 18 month old Ballistics in this thread alone.
    How many batteries are in this thread in total, maybe a dozen or so?
    Very poor results !
    When I bought the Ballistic Li battery, the blurb claimed up to ten times the life of a lead acid.
    Seems to be the other way about.
    And then there's the need for a dedicated charger and special charging rituals etc.
    That's why the big boys can't be bothered with them.
    Maybe one day soon ...

    Glen
     
  15. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    I seem to mainly read about batteries being hammered by current losses Glen.

    Either way, I’m currently running 4 Shorias, the oldest is 6 years old.

    I bought the dedicated charger but all I have used it for is ensuring batteries are fully charged before fitting them when they’re new! I’ve not put any of them on a charger yet after fitting them.

    So, based on my own experience, I’m sticking with them.

    And I’ve already factored in the 3kg I’ll save on the Superlight !

    Not sure I’d be brave enough to trust one on the EVG though...?
     
  16. dougmatson

    dougmatson

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2011
    I have them in four bikes from an KTM1190 Adventure to my 75' Commando and they have been great. Shoria actually used me to test which battery to use in a 75' Commando then gave me a discount for doing so. Make sure your charging system is in good shape and I woulds not use them in a bike that has not been upgraded to a modern system. When talking to the tech at the factory he told me that you can charge them just fine on a Battery Tender charger, Lithium type(off the record). Thats what I use and they are fine if you follow some rules, don't let them sit discharged, on newer bikes with parasitic charges leave them on a charger if the bike is going to sit for awhile. If you do discharge them and use a battery tender and make sure the batter has more than 3 V in it or the B T will not charge, so boost the Volts with a regular charger until you see about 5 to 10 volts then switch over to the Battery Tender charger. Don't ever leave them on a trickle charger that will kill them.
     
  17. speirmoor

    speirmoor VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2010
    I had a totally dead Shorai and did almost exactly what you said with a Shumacher charger and the thing came back to life. Surprisingly the voltage came up to 12V pretty rapidly (less than an hour). I then switched to the Shorai charger and in 3hrs it was at 14v and still charging.
     
    dougmatson likes this.
  18. Welshrugby

    Welshrugby

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    I had some starting issues several weeks back now that all cleared up and the bike has been starting and running well. However last weekend its started cutting out on me a bit and I had to crank it several times to get it started. Finally I twigged what was happening and it wasn't the fault of the bike, the cable from my heated grip on the accelerator side was pressing against the red kill switch button. Before I became aware this, I probably tried to start the bike between 7-8 times but that was enough to completely drain the battery. I pretty much keep it on trickle charge most of the time and only have it not on charge when I charge the other bike for a couple of days. Would a shorai battery last any longer if charged or would it also rapidly depleat if I was to suffer more starting difficulties
     
  19. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

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    Oct 4, 2013
    You sure about your problem solving there WR? If my kill switch is I the engine won’t turn over...

    Shorai batteries are known to give more cranking power, turning the engine over faster. But I’m not sure they’ll turn the engine fine over for longer than a good lead acid battery.
     
  20. Welshrugby

    Welshrugby

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2018
    The cable was slighlty pressing on it when in the stopped position at junctions. Going to have to check it out better this weekend, I think the new heated grip may be slipping a bit and causing other issues like a high idle. Not the bikes fault, convinced it is of my doing but just surprised the battery can drain so quickly
     

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