Light show...or not

[TonyA]

You definitely have a cross wire in a block somewhere. If foot brake is powering the head/tail lights then all the current is going through that brake switch, not good as it is probably only rated a little above the 21W of the bulb. The battery tender lead should go directly to battery so that might point you to the block with crossed wires.

My question also , How is the battery Tender hooked up ? Through the Norton charging plug by rear shock ? This must go through a fuse (optimate/clocks fuse) to get to the battery. Don't forget the fuse built in to the charger cable too , they can go open and gives a flashing red light.

 

[Stephen_Spencer]

Thanks guys. Tony, I’ve put the seat and tail back on and will take an image of the rear end of the ECU when I get a moment.

Reading Richards ’Throttle Control’ manual was quite informative. He explains the relationship between the ECU and the various sensors. He states that the Throttle Stop Screw does not adjust idle. Not sure whether this contradicts the 1/8th turn adjustment you mention or are we talking about a different adjustment? Pardon my (very) limited knowledge in this area. He also notes some interesting aspects to starting the bike.

Reluctant to adjust anything currently as the bike remains rideable and is due service. That said, not 100% confident that the young mechanic at my dealership will understand how to make these adjustments. We shall see.

 

[TonyA]

Thanks guys. Tony, I’ve put the seat and tail back on and will take an image of the rear end of the ECU when I get a moment.

Reading Richards ’Throttle Control’ manual was quite informative. He explains the relationship between the ECU and the various sensors. He states that the Throttle Stop Screw does not adjust idle. Not sure whether this contradicts the 1/8th turn adjustment you mention or are we talking about a different adjustment? Pardon my (very) limited knowledge in this area. He also notes some interesting aspects to starting the bike.

Reluctant to adjust anything currently as the bike remains rideable and is due service. That said, not 100% confident that the young mechanic at my dealership will understand how to make these adjustments. We shall see.

Same adjustment. There is a very small range of throttle valve opening which the ECU and IAM can operate well . When Throttle open too much it will idle too fast , when too closed it can be too low. If you could verify your throttle valve position voltage at closed you can change and set back if needed. I remember reading that Norton we’re having the throttle valves set with x amount of air flow when closed .

 

[Voodooo]

Well I guess I joined this club too.
today I wanted to take my commando out.
went to start it and guess what?
A dead battery.
my bike has the Shorai battery and it’s always on a trickle charger. I’m sick of these batteries.
when I finally got it started the headlight, tail light, gauge lights and horn didn’t work.
checked all the fuses and relays. Nothing.

removed the tank and headlight, checked all the wiring, checked the switch and horn. Nothing.

checked and tested the bulbs. Nothing.
got fed up with it and put it back together and what the hell...
all the lights and horn work.
but once again the battery is dead.
Even with it displaying 12.3 volts it still strains to start

once I got the bike started, the damn horn, tail light, gauge lights and headlight dont work again. The digital display works as does the turn signals and brake light. Just no high or low beam headlight or gauge lights or horn.
I don’t drink but I’m considering it.

 

[Stephen_Spencer]

In my experience 12.3v is quite low and simply would not start my bike. After about two years (I think) my last Lead Acid battery dropped to 12.6v and struggled to start the bike, so I changed to Shorai Lithium. I leave my voltmeter on the clocks and she goes up to 13.0-13.1v each time and starts first time. This big ol‘ lump clearly needs a good strength battery to start regularly. I always keep her on the trickle charger. That said, I have no doubt others have significantly different experiences, which seems to be the nature of this bike.

 

[Voodooo]

In my experience 12.3v is quite low and simply would not start my bike. After about two years (I think) my last Lead Acid battery dropped to 12.6v and struggled to start the bike, so I changed to Shorai Lithium. I leave my voltmeter on the clocks and she goes up to 13.0-13.1v each time and starts first time. This big ol‘ lump clearly needs a good strength battery to start regularly. I always keep her on the trickle charger. That said, I have no doubt others have significantly different experiences, which seems to be the nature of this bike.

I always let the headlight warm the battery before cranking it over.
I just replaced my Shorai battery on my Dominator and it fires right now.
now my commando is straining.
I always keep my bikes on the Shorai charger 365 days a year.
My triumph and Ducati sit for weeks or even month not on a charger and fire up every time.

 

[MxMartin]

I always let the headlight warm the battery before cranking it over.
I just replaced my Shorai battery on my Dominator and it fires right now.
now my commando is straining.
I always keep my bikes on the Shorai charger 365 days a year.
My triumph and Ducati sit for weeks or even month not on a charger and fire up every time.

Scott, one thing i've noticed about the Shorai charger is that the multi-pin plug that goes directly into the battery has a tendency for the pins to not make a good contact so I have to remove tank and give the plug a good wiggle to clean the contacts. Whether this is due to condensation or vibration I don't know. Currently my charger will keep the bike in 'store' mode but it refuses to 'charge' it so I'm reverting back to the regular trickle charger to get a 100% charge until I can be arsed to take the tank off again.

 

[Voodooo]

Scott, one thing i've noticed about the Shorai charger is that the multi-pin plug that goes directly into the battery has a tendency for the pins to not make a good contact so I have to remove tank and give the plug a good wiggle to clean the contacts. Whether this is due to condensation or vibration I don't know. Currently my charger will keep the bike in 'store' mode but it refuses to 'charge' it so I'm reverting back to the regular trickle charger to get a 100% charge until I can be arsed to take the tank off again.

I know what you mean.
but unfortunately that’s not my batteries case.
When I installed my Shorai batteries I zip tie the plug in place. when I removed the tank to check the wiring, the plug was still tightly in place.

the lights started working again. So I took it for a spin, and just my luck, 10 miles away from home they went out again. Not to mention passed a cop and it was sunset on a cloudy day.
I was able to safely make it home and sure as shit the headlight came back on. ill dig deeper. I did notice when I tug on the wiring from the switch it came back on once. Perhaps it’s in the switch control.

 

[TonyA]

I know I have said this already . Use the Deltran Battery Tender designed for the Lithium Iron batteries . Bin the Shorai charger , there I said it !

 

[MxMartin]

...when I removed the tank to check the wiring, the plug was still tightly in place.

Scott, my multi-pin plug is snug and tight and doesn't vibrate out but it needs to be pulled out and back in a few times to clean the pin contacts otherwise my charger does odd things like refuse to charge!

 

[MxMartin]

I know I have said this already . Use the Deltran Battery Tender designed for the Lithium Iron batteries . Bin the Shorai charger , there I said it !

Tony, if it simply connects to the battery +/- then it isn't capable of maintaining each cell independently, which is what the Shorai multi-pin plug does.... allegedly !

I use my optimate occasionally to charge the Li up and that too works fine.

 

[italia]

Scott, sorry about your Shorai troubles - hope it's just a connection issue. From personal experience and anecdotal stories, I would never leave a lithium battery on a battery tender or charger full time. Lithium batteries, whether they be in phones or for powersports vehicles, do not like to sit at 100% for any significant length of time. I charge mine one day per week for 18 hours on a timer. And frankly, I like the Deltran Battery Tender Plus better than Shorai's own charger for the 5 Shorai batteries I have owned, which have all exceeded 4 years of service.

 

[Fast Eddie]

Scott, sorry about your Shorai troubles - hope it's just a connection issue. From personal experience and anecdotal stories, I would never leave a lithium battery on a battery tender or charger full time. Lithium batteries, whether they be in phones or for powersports vehicles, do not like to sit at 100% for any significant length of time. I charge mine one day per week for 18 hours on a timer. And frankly, I like the Deltran Battery Tender Plus better than Shorai's own charger for the 5 Shorai batteries I have owned, which have all exceeded 4 years of service.

I guess that’s why the Shoria tender doesn’t keep the battery at 100% ?

 

[Britfan60]

I'm hoping I'm as lucky as Voodoo. Poof. Lights reappear. Hey Voodoo.....wish you had tried the rear brake pedal while they were out. Sucks taking the tank off a few times for one little issue. Or big issue. And my damned tank is full. I may buzz around the neighborhood to see what happens. I dare not it a major road or highway. Anybody know how I can obtain an 1157 bulb socket that I can adapt to this tail light.......or the complete assembly?

 

[Voodooo]

I'm hoping I'm as lucky as Voodoo. Poof. Lights reappear. Hey Voodoo.....wish you had tried the rear brake pedal while they were out. Sucks taking the tank off a few times for one little issue. Or big issue. And my damned tank is full. I may buzz around the neighborhood to see what happens. I dare not it a major road or highway. Anybody know how I can obtain an 1157 bulb socket that I can adapt to this tail light.......or the complete assembly?

My brake light worked with the hand lever and foot pedal. I strongly believe it’s my handle bar switch. I’ll test it this weekend.
luckily I have a new spare handle bar light / horn switch assembly.

 

[Voodooo]

Scott, sorry about your Shorai troubles - hope it's just a connection issue. From personal experience and anecdotal stories, I would never leave a lithium battery on a battery tender or charger full time. Lithium batteries, whether they be in phones or for powersports vehicles, do not like to sit at 100% for any significant length of time. I charge mine one day per week for 18 hours on a timer. And frankly, I like the Deltran Battery Tender Plus better than Shorai's own charger for the 5 Shorai batteries I have owned, which have all exceeded 4 years of service.

Shorai recommendation is to leave it on storage all the time. And even doing so it’s only 12 volts and not enough to start my commando.
I turn the key on, watch the gauge cluster voltage display until it’s atleast 12.5+ volts after the headlight warms up the battery.
then almost every time with the bike sitting for weeks, it’s click click click click. With a weak attempt to crank. After a couple tries she’ll finally start.
Since putting a new and improved Shorai in my Dominator I can leave it off the charger for days or even a week (that’s as long as it sat so far off the charger) and it’ll crank very strong and start on the first try. With the old version Shorai I used to have in my Domi that was the same results as my commando. Weak sauce.

 

[Voodooo]

Went for a nice 70 mile ride. Upon return, do an inspection. Brake light doesn't come on from front brake lever. All else works.
Go into the headlight bucket to check connection to the switch. Its fine. Open it, put a little dialectric grease, close it up and adjust beam height. All fine.
Remove tail light. One of the copper tabs isnt making contact with the bulb. Clean tabs, inspect bulb, dielectric grease on the connections.
Had the ignition switch on for about 10 minutes. So....all of a sudden, the headlight doesn't work, the tail light doesn't work, the rear brake light works but the headlight comes on when I hit the rear brake. Dials and digital display doesnt light up. Digital display is functioning fine. Usually when the batter is low, it freezes up. Back on the tender overnight, still have the problem. Bike fires up immediately.
This is a real shit show. Any ideas? Asking before I check all my fuses. AND my Yuasa is on its fifth season and I do believe the voltage is a little lower than normal.

Went for a nice 70 mile ride. Upon return, do an inspection. Brake light doesn't come on from front brake lever. All else works.
Go into the headlight bucket to check connection to the switch. Its fine. Open it, put a little dialectric grease, close it up and adjust beam height. All fine.
Remove tail light. One of the copper tabs isnt making contact with the bulb. Clean tabs, inspect bulb, dielectric grease on the connections.
Had the ignition switch on for about 10 minutes. So....all of a sudden, the headlight doesn't work, the tail light doesn't work, the rear brake light works but the headlight comes on when I hit the rear brake. Dials and digital display doesnt light up. Digital display is functioning fine. Usually when the batter is low, it freezes up. Back on the tender overnight, still have the problem. Bike fires up immediately.
This is a real shit show. Any ideas? Asking before I check all my fuses. AND my Yuasa is on its fifth season and I do believe the voltage is a little lower than normal.

Well I found my lighting issue. Remove your tank again and check the wires / terminals going into this relay plug connector. The green wire on mine was hardly making contact. And while you’re in there swap them with better quality relays.
This fixed my headlight / tail light / gauge lights / and horn. All is good now.

 

[Britfan60]

Well I found my lighting issue. Remove your tank again and check the wires / terminals going into this relay plug connector. The green wire on mine was hardly making contact. And while you’re in there swap them with better quality relays.
This fixed my headlight / tail light / gauge lights / and horn. All is good now. View attachment 19050

Thanks. My 2013 only has one relay under the tank. Not 2. When I hit the rear brake, I'm hearing a relay under the rear cowl. Thats when the headlight comes on with the brake light. I'll check them again. Are all the relays under the cowl the same and are they the same as the relay under the tank? What upgrade do you recommend?

 

[Voodooo]

Thanks. My 2013 only has one relay under the tank. Not 2. When I hit the rear brake, I'm hearing a relay under the rear cowl. Thats when the headlight comes on with the brake light. I'll check them again. Are all the relays under the cowl the same and are they the same as the relay under the tank? What upgrade do you recommend?

Yes. All are the same relay. I replaced mine with cole hersee brand because that’s what I use on vehicles I repair / service and I have them on hand. Plus I had good luck with them.

 

[Britfan60]

Yes. All are the same relay. I replaced mine with cole hersee brand because that’s what I use on vehicles I repair / service and I have them on hand. Plus I had good luck with them.

Thank you for that. Seems to make sense.