Wiring tips n tricks...?

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I fully agree with poster Nickguzzi, that sticky tape should not be used when making a wiring loom.
The result will be that the entire loom will become a sticky mess over time, that attracts dirt etc.

Also, where many home made wiring looms fall short is that inadequate crimping tools are used.
Good quality crimping tools are fairly expensive, but the result will be worth the costs.
Also, soldered connections are best avoided, in particular in vibraton prone areas,
this is why soldered connections are rarely used in the aviation industry.

Those who complain about the quality of Lucas electrics should take a close look at Italian bikes.
Lucas stuff looks like masterpieces of engineering compared to CEV or Magneti Marelli stuff.
However, I think that we can't put the blame entirily on the manufacturers of the electrical equipment for producing poor quality stuff.
These suppliers were under constant pressure from the motor industry to make their products as cheap as possible,
and that's why we have to put up with carburators made of zinc, and marginal electrical equipment etc.
In the British motorcycle industry, the bean counters always won from the technicians, we still suffer today from the result.
 
Peter R said:
Re; “Those who complain about the quality of Lucas electrics should take a close look at Italian bikes.
Lucas stuff looks like masterpieces of engineering compared to CEV or Magneti /Marelli stuff.
However, I think that we can't put the blame entirely on the manufacturers of the electrical equipment for producing poor quality stuff.
These suppliers were under constant pressure from the motor industry to make their products as cheap as possible, and that's why we have to put up with carburettors made of zinc, and marginal electrical equipment etc.
In the British motorcycle industry, the bean counters always won from the technicians, we still suffer today from the result." quote]

To ad my two cents worth to the above, I have found that most bikes & cars made in the 1960s did not have corrosion resistance copper wiring, and that over a period of time the copper will go black which puts an enormous amount of resistance on the current flowing through them- sometimes cutting the voltage by as much as half :!:
Most people wouldn’t eat food that is past its use by date –yet expect bikes with 40, 50 year old wiring to work as fresh as the day the bike left the factory.
The house insurance industry will no longer insure a house in the UK anymore, that has not got new electrical wiring if more than 25 years old. Even one well known Classic bike racer had his house roof burnt off when a boiler caught fire that required several fire appliances to bring it under control, luckily he got the whole family out in time as everyone was asleep in bed that early in the morning.
I have never owned a Moto Guzzi except for a brief ride on a Le Mans, and I understand that at one time you could go into a Guzzi dealer and obtain a single wire to replace the one in the harness –there was method in their madness :!:
The number of times I have obtained an old bike with a flywheel magneto that took several kicks to start which turned into a one kick affair when I replaced the wire to the coil in the harness with a new one has to be seen to be believed :!: :)
Click to expand...
 
I had mentioned this before but......
It is a common mod on the TL1000 (and most likely other Japanese motorcycles) to use a relay in the coil circuit.
On that bike the positive to the coils is live (ignition key on) and the ECU switches the coil via the negative (Negative earth bike)
The simple mod uses a relay with wire runs to the battery positive (fused) and coil positives , to a earth/ground and the original coil positive wires are used to activate the relay when the ignition is turned on giving a direct power feed from the battery to the coils avoiding the long path via the standard loom.
It gives better starting etc.

I wonder if this theory could be used with a Commando ?
 
I have done my own wiring harnesses on four of my vintage british machines all with turn signals.
I have found that if your ignition switch is more centrally located rather than "up front" you'll end up with less wiring in the head light bucket.
Use two main grounds ,one to frame,one to engine.

Use the frame ground to bring all component grounds to it. It becomes a common ground for the entire bike

I use negative grounding

I use a Wassel 3 phase high output alternator, Pazon ignition, Podronics regulator or Boyer Powerbox

I use a simple Harley Davidson 3 position switch.

Keep your ignition circuit totally separate from your high beam,low beam,rear running light.

Fuse the ignition circuit and the lighting circuit

I use crimp connectors and pull test them.

Make a simple wiring diagram to follow.........Skip
 
Once again, thanks guys. Some great tips have been put forward here.

I will be using block connectors where possible, and where not, all bullets will be Japanese style crimp on jobs.

I use this woven sheathing that expands when pushed together, making it very easy to thread over wires, then contracts again when you let go. I then 'seal' each end with a short length of heat shrink sleeving. It makes for a very neat and robust job.

I have dissmanteld the stock harness and will re-use wires so I can maintain standard colours for the circuits I have.

My harness will be simple though, I am really set on uber simplicity!

I'll be keeping the ign separate from all other items and fusing both, thereby helping to minimise the risk of an ign circuit blown fuse etc.

I've got Tri-spark and Crane coil from Matt, 3 phase alternator, combined regulator unit, LED rear light, LED instrument lights and Shorai battery.

I've binned most of the stock stuff, inc all switches! I've got a single Tommeselli handle bar switch cluster on the left hand bar that does everything. Not other switches or ign key etc. on the bike, well, apart from the brake light switch, but even that's not stock, its a micro switch built into the front Brembo master cylinder and lever assembly (from Matt again).

The one departure from uber simplicity that I am considering is the use of a relay for the headlight, as recommended by many of you chaps. Could someone tell me which is the relay to use here? I'm a bit of a Luddite with such matters and really haven't got a clue!
 
I'm going with cable lacing on most Ms Peel.
https://www.google.com/#q=cable+lacing

Wiring tips n tricks...?
 
Ah man stop with bashing Lord Lucas whose stuff was and is as good as it gets, so what ya really belly aching about is the political/bankster situation imposed on people so they couldn't afford better while ya bet ya bottom UK pound the Crown and its military and aviation got the gooder stuff. I've as much or more electrical breakdowns on my Japan 2000 modern cycle with now know life spans of various vitals. During the length of time the tach has worked it show 25K+ as of this weekend.
http://www.lucasaerospace.eu/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucas_Industries
 
If you are crimping the Jap spade or bullet connectors, one thing I have found is that the tabs that wraps around the wire & insulation ( the furthest one away from the connector ) is too long, I use plies to cut them shorter so there is no excess overlap. :idea:
 
I buy all my wire from places that carry marine supplies (i.e. West Marine). The wire is tinned and usually has finer strands per gauge size. This makes for a more flexible wire and carries current better.
 
Deets55 is quite correct, marine wire is the right way to go on an English bike. Marine wire is oil resistant. A distinct advantage on an our bikes. Ran a lucas alternator for a year and when I took it off the wire leads just snapped.
 
Eddie

I use this woven sheathing that expands when pushed together, making it very easy to thread over wires, then contracts again when you let go. I then 'seal' each end with a short length of heat shrink sleeving.
Click to expand...

I've used that too and it produces a great result. You can "break-out" wires from the main loom by poking through the web. The only thing I'd add is to use the adhesive heat-shrink. It really grips well.

The one departure from uber simplicity that I am considering is the use of a relay for the headlight, as recommended by many of you chaps. Could someone tell me which is the relay to use here?
Click to expand...

I have used the Vehicle Wiring Products R20B relay on a couple of bikes with complete success.

Their thin wall wire is also ideal as it takes up much less room than the usual stuff.

David
 
hobot said:
Ah man stop with bashing Lord Lucas whose stuff was and is as good as it gets, so what ya really belly aching about is the political/bankster situation imposed on people so they couldn't afford better while ya bet ya bottom UK pound the Crown and its military and aviation got the gooder stuff. I've as much or more electrical breakdowns on my Japan 2000 modern cycle with now know life spans of various vitals. During the length of time the tach has worked it show 25K+ as of this weekend.
http://www.lucasaerospace.eu/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucas_Industries
Click to expand...
Good on ya mate. You are probably right. We in NZ sometimes think we are dished up with the crap left over after the bigger economy's have had their share.
I must admit I haven't had many electrical problems with either commando apart from the wires to the Boyer pickup.
I'm not happy with the quality of head lamps available for the commando though. I have very bright lights [ as witnessed by our El Presidente when following him in the daylight one time ] due to the relays etc but the focus on the H4 Hella and the Wagner is shite. I don't need to look into the eyes of the possums in the tress when I'm riding. I would prefer more on the road and verges.
Does anyone know of a better 7Inch h/lamp manufacturer. BTW what I have got is better than any other I have seen.
 
pdl999 said:
Eddie

I use this woven sheathing that expands when pushed together, making it very easy to thread over wires, then contracts again when you let go. I then 'seal' each end with a short length of heat shrink sleeving.
Click to expand...

I've used that too and it produces a great result. You can "break-out" wires from the main loom by poking through the web. The only thing I'd add is to use the adhesive heat-shrink. It really grips well.

The one departure from uber simplicity that I am considering is the use of a relay for the headlight, as recommended by many of you chaps. Could someone tell me which is the relay to use here?
Click to expand...

I have used the Vehicle Wiring Products R20B relay on a couple of bikes with complete success.

Their thin wall wire is also ideal as it takes up much less room than the usual stuff.

David
Click to expand...

Thanks David. I'm just a tad shocked at how ridiculously cheap the R20B relays are !!
 
The Cibie Z beam was a great bike headlamp. Excellent penetration and very even lateral spread. The light is noticeably whiter too.
Unfortunately no longer available unless you stumble on some NOS. Or get a decent second hand one. A few places still list them, but no stock when I inquired.
I have been looking for 7" headlamps for a friends Land Rover. The recent LED lamps are looking reasonably capable these days, even if the price is likely to induce a sharp intake of breath. For a while we pondered the possibility of fitting a bi-xenon HID, but it all seemed like a bit of an expensive bind.

UK Vehicle wiring harnesses were originally wrapped to exclude oxygen in the event of a short minimising the possibility of fire, a risk hopefully diminished these days - as is the use of double cotton covered insulation or DCC wire. The wrapped harness may just be capable of providing minimum function should the worst happen.
The two alternatives proposed on here, while looking nice and trick do not offer this facility.

ps. The most common supplier of wiring harness in uk was Ripaults, not Lucas. Looks like they were taken over by a Dutch firm, and said to be "examining their market position".
 
nickguzzi said:
The Cibie Z beam was a great bike headlamp. Excellent penetration and very even lateral spread. The light is noticeably whiter too.
Unfortunately no longer available unless you stumble on some NOS. Or get a decent second hand one. A few places still list them, but no stock when I inquired.
I have been looking for 7" headlamps for a friends Land Rover.
Click to expand...

I recently bought a NOS Hella lamp, but I've yet to install it. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 1518938933 This guy accepts a standard H4-style bulb, and has provisions for a running light; something missing on today's modern headlamp assemblies. At $23 USD, I thought it'd be worth the gamble.

Nathan
 
kerinorton said:
hobot said:
Ah man stop with bashing Lord Lucas whose stuff was and is as good as it gets, so what ya really belly aching about is the political/bankster situation imposed on people so they couldn't afford better while ya bet ya bottom UK pound the Crown and its military and aviation got the gooder stuff. I've as much or more electrical breakdowns on my Japan 2000 modern cycle with now know life spans of various vitals. During the length of time the tach has worked it show 25K+ as of this weekend.
http://www.lucasaerospace.eu/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucas_Industries
Click to expand...
Good on ya mate. You are probably right. We in NZ sometimes think we are dished up with the crap left over after the bigger economy's have had their share.
I must admit I haven't had many electrical problems with either commando apart from the wires to the Boyer pickup.
I'm not happy with the quality of head lamps available for the commando though. I have very bright lights [ as witnessed by our El Presidente when following him in the daylight one time ] due to the relays etc but the focus on the H4 Hella and the Wagner is shite. I don't need to look into the eyes of the possums in the tress when I'm riding. I would prefer more on the road and verges.
Does anyone know of a better 7Inch h/lamp manufacturer. BTW what I have got is better than any other I have seen.
Click to expand...

Here is a positive plug for ol Jo [ Prince of Darkness ] We have a local mechanic who used to work on the Lotus racing team in the early 70's . He told me the Lucas mechanical fuel injection used on the Lotus was very reliable.
 
Use quality connectors, solder everything and use shrink tape at the ends, where most breakage occurs. Also be sure to have plenty or grounds.
 
Heat shrink comes in at least two wall thicknesses, standard and double thickness. Most auto parts stores carry both. If heat shrink tubing is used as the harness cover, the thick stuff is naturally more durable than the thin.

Glen
 
I would never recommend solder on any motorcycle electrical connections. Crimp only. Solder turns the wire into a solid wire and vibration will cause it to fracture. The fracture is usually not visible as it occurs inside the insulation. No auto or motorcycle manufacture solders wired connection. They are crimped and strain relieved.
 
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