TRITON, at last...

I'd love to have one of those featherbed model 50s. I think you will enjoy riding your Triton when done, featherbeds tend to feel very precise to me. My one with the Commando engine does vibrate quite a lot, it would be interesting if the Triton cuts that down.
 
Cookie said:
... featherbeds tend to feel very precise to me. My one with the Commando engine does vibrate quite a lot, it would be interesting if the Triton cuts that down.
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It's widely agreed that the unit Bonnie engines are far smoother than Commandos.
 
grandpaul said:
Cookie said:
... featherbeds tend to feel very precise to me. My one with the Commando engine does vibrate quite a lot, it would be interesting if the Triton cuts that down.
Click to expand...

It's widely agreed that the unit Bonnie engines are far smoother than Commandos.
Click to expand...

Could that be from a marked difference in power output? Or could it be that Commando motors were not balanced to be solidly mounted? I have seen a couple of "Featherlastic" conversions and they look pretty cool, although it seems they would be a bit heavier than the Trigg frame.
 
Well, there's also no argument that the Commando lump outweighs the unit Triumph.

HP output is similar, although the Norton delivers more torque.
 
I've never had my engine apart, the folks that put it in the featherbed frame rebuilt it. I am assumeing they did some balance work as it is not all that bad, but my first bike was a G15CSR and that bike was quite a bit smoother. Folks say the heavy Matchless frame on the G15 damped the Atlas. I use the term smoother lightly here as the Atlas motor always did shake.
 
Cookie said:
I've never had my engine apart, the folks that put it in the featherbed frame rebuilt it. I am assumeing they did some balance work as it is not all that bad, but my first bike was a G15CSR and that bike was quite a bit smoother. Folks say the heavy Matchless frame on the G15 damped the Atlas. I use the term smoother lightly here as the Atlas motor always did shake.
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The Hybrids actually used a special lightweight frame, developed by Matchless and Reynolds specifically for desert racing and using Reynolds 531 alloy.
Commando motors and Atlas motors are balanced differently to make up for the different mounts. If you put a commando motor in a featherbed or matchless frame, you need the atlas balance factor. Around 80% as opposed to 52%

I've been reading up on the hybrids, and the N/G15s (and AJS '33') came about because the featherbed frame would break at the headstock when desert raced, and the 650/750 matchless motors breaking when ridden hard (3 main bearings were NOT better than 2). By putting the reliable Atlas motor in the light, sturdy Matchless frame, the desert racers proved to be winners, until the rise of the big 2-strokes in the late 60s. The P11 series was killed in late '68 because it was no longer competitive, and the Commando was selling like hotcakes. The atlas motors in the matchless frames, whether the G80 or G85, kept the same balance factor as the featherbed.
 
I think the G15 may not have had the lightweight tubing, mine had huge sidecar lugs. The later ones certainly did though.
 
I've still got a G15CS frame (with a '62 TR6SS lump laying loosely in it); I wonder if it's going to eventually be worth the hassle to de-rake it (it was previously chopped)?
 
These bikes are quickly going the way of old Indians. Folks will now rebuild an Indian frame that would have been rubbish a few years back. All those are somewhat rare now as they were never plentiful.
 
Alloy 750 kit.

I used one of those alloy 750 kits. They will cause you some problems. The liners are very thin and the lips on the top of the liners are too small. Eventually the liners will be pushed down a bit. This pinches the top of the liner in and will ruin the pistons. You can solve this problem by making new liners with a bigger lip on the top. I machined an old set of yamaha 650 liners for his purpose. Then I had another probem. The exhaust tappet block started moving. Really an alloy block needs to have alloy tappet blocks so that they won't come loose. I think Tridents use alloy tappet blocks. At that point I gave up on these cylinders and used a Morgo Kit instead.

When you find these barrels at swap meets used you will see that they all have this problem of the liners being forced down. It is a major problem. It will eventually ruin at least one of the pistons.

Also you have to realize you need less torque on the smaller head bolts to create even pressure on the gasket.

I did manage to put about 10,000 miles on those barrels, but they were a lot of trouble. When the tappet blocks moved I got tired of them. I never really noticed any difference in performance with the iron barrels, which I bought for about $40.00. I have an cylinder head temperature gauge on the bike and it didn't seem any hotter running with the iron barrels.

I was able to use .0025 piston clearance with Forged pistons in the Alloy barrel. I use .006 in the iron morgo barrel. If you want to ride the bike a lot I suggest you use a Morgo or Routt barrel. Or convert to T140 stuff. Or if you want to spend a lot get a Nicasil barrel.
 
I spent last weekend at the Norton Rally. I rode 850 miles with my friend who rides a 69 Norton 750. We had plenty of time to compare acceleration and speed of these bikes. His bike has PW3 cams, a Dunstall 2-1-2 exhaust. He has standard compression pistons. His engine is in good condition with fresh pistons and rings. I was riding a completely stock Triumph 650. My bike runs well, but the pistons have over 50,000 miles on them. It has new rings and a head with new guides. Both bikes are in resonable shape. I am pretty sure the Triumph has more power than the Norton though. My bike was carrying more weigh too. I have some other Triumphs with some mods done to them and they have way more power than my old 650. I think that Triumphs are faster than Nortons. I think that a tuned 650 Bonneville motor was pretty hard to beat in the 60s. That contributed to the popularity of Tritons. Earlier Triumphs had poor forks, the frames were not as good as the Norton ones either. Probably lots of Triumphs were written off in accidents leaving good engines to fit into Featherbeds frames that were vacated by worn out guttless Norton singles.
 
Well, my frame is a '66 650SS (code 18 stamp), and my engine is (coincidentally) a '66 T120R; so it's all '66, 650.

Lets see...

Norton = Sports Special (SS)

Triumph = Bonneville (T120R)

Maybe I'll call it a Triton Sports Special / TSS

Whatever, it ought to be able to keep up with the crowd I ride with for the most part (not on the superslab)
 
Paul, I don't know how you can have so many different things going on. I guess my add gets the best of me most of the time. Do you have progress pics? You could probably have "Triton special" tank decals made up for pretty cheap.

Tim
 
This is a "back burner" project.

It's been dismantled from the mockup, and the parts are all back on the shelves they came off of. Rear wheel assembly got put on the rolling project bike that I'm selling (although I may get that one running to recoup more of my investment and perhaps squeeze out some profit). Such is life in my garage!

My painter makes all my decals super-thin, so that they cover with clear into near-zero raised profile after curing. He'll be able to knock out a set overnight, when the time comes.
 
Update:

Scored a Lyta 'glass tank on e-bay (not the Sprint style, but featherbed compatible), and an e-bay deal on one of those hydraulic clutch conversions that have a tiny slave cylinder with a stub of cable attached to the piston. You screw the slave into the clutch cable abutment at the tranny cover and that's all there is to it! Sounds like a nice trick bit for this bike.

TRITON, at last...


Webby(03) is going to send me a template of his unit conversion plates so I can finally get a set made, so that's progress.

Since I'm doing a client overhaul on a 750 Bonnie, I'm going to hustle things up and get the engine for this bike done at the same time.
 
Got out the calculator and determined that my current stack of play money would support ordering a set of Convertas from Unity at near the same cost to build a set, with much less hassle and zero effort (...and probably less time).

...small steps....
 
Keep the info and pictures coming Paul. I envy triton owners. Have wanted to put one together for 10 years, but I haven't found a decent frame with a title.
 
My friend Mark had paid for a Featherbed frame that seemed to take WAY too long to arrive and he kept getting the run-around from the seller, so he ended up buying a different frame. Well, about a week after the different frame arrived, the first one showed up on his doorstep! He knew he could work a trade with me for some of the bits he needed for his project, and we worked a nice trade. Basically, I got a very nice Slimline frame for under $600.

The title will be a couple hundred dollars and a couple of days' time back and forth from our local tax collector's office to get the paperwork in order.
 
That's a heck of a deal. I don't even know if one can acquire a title in Illinois anymore. they have gotten really stupid on laws in this state and no longer accept paperwork from title services.
 
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