Norvil

I appreciate that I am probably going to open a huge can of worms her but here goes.
There seems to be a lot of criticism here and other places about Norvil and Les Emery, presumably Fair Spares as he traded originally.
He has been in business for a long while now, cannot find exactly but am sure he was about in the 80's.
If he and his products are so bad how is he still able to trade?
Are there any people out there that can vouch for his products, i.e. complete motors/ bikes etc.
Why do we never hear anything from him on the forum justifying some of the criticism.

I have no gripes with them, but haven't bought anything from them for many years, no real reason, buy most of my spares now and historically from RGM and Andover Norton.

I realise that the likes of Colorado Norton who are exceptional, seem to go the extra mile with quality and preperation.
I also and like and respect the dialogue with Mat and the likes of Jim Comstock, Don Pender, Fullauto, Joe Seifert, Andy Chain, etc. Especially when new products are being developed.

Customer service seems to be at the front of their business models, as it should be and even if and when criticised they are here to justify and or explain their reasons for doing such things.

Lots of points here, plenty of room to wander off topic, I appreciate but I am interested in the above, as I am sure of others. If I have missed anyone out I do apologise!

Peter

I'm not sure about quality of Norvil products but...
About 5 or 6 years ago I ordered a number of parts from Norvil. When they arrived in Australia I noticed a couple of parts weren't what I ordered.
I contacted Normal by email to attempt to get the problem fixed.
After a couple of exchanges. which pointed to it apparently being my fault/problem - then I got a strange tirade of abuse from Les Emery
Still can't believe he treats paying customers that way
Anyway - I for one won't be spending a red cent there again
Cheers
Rob

If he and his products are so bad how is he still able to trade?

Click to expand...

He has the biggest ad budget to pull the punters in. The company accounts the NOC got view of when they were considering a purchase did not look healthy, there was a large chunk of shareholders funds tied up that would only be accessible if the parts stock was sold close to the book value in a company sale situation, highly unlikely.

Are there any people out there that can vouch for his products, i.e. complete motors/ bikes etc.

Click to expand...

Not many but there are a few who have had no issues, luck of the draw. They must not have bought the gearbox outer covers with the gear labels back to front or the floating front discs that wear out the centre in a few 1000 miles. Being sacked as distributor for AN tells you all you need to know.

Why do we never hear anything from him on the forum justifying some of the criticism.

Click to expand...

Not sure you have phrased that right, he never posts on forums that is correct but why would he post justifying the criticism if he did post.

You can almost be sure to be ripped off by Les - its his nature. Many years ago we bought 7 "brand new" Commandos in good faith, they all had 1971 documents being two Roadsters, two Norvil proddy racers, one Interstate, one Fastback and a High Rider. They all had the wrong tachos/speedos from Taiwan, switchgear and wiring loom not correct for the year, 1973 frames - a whole lot was not fitting the 1971 papers but my boss liked the looks and did not complain. I had to rebuild all of them within the first 300 mls as the cams were wearing away - buttersoft they were. The crankcases were knackered used ones, found lots of glasbeads still in the corners when tearing the engines down - heads the same, the list is endless.... When complaining about the cams I was told that I used the wrong oil and made mistakes when running the bikes in. We did not make an oilchange as the odometer showed around 80 miles on each bike when delivered (with oil in the tanks). So the bikes were run in 80 miles by him and on his choice of oil. Of course we did not get a refund.
Ask around a bit - I am sure you will find a lot more answers.
Cheers

Hi Commando, my point is that I have seen posts from some of the suppliers mentioned justifying or explaining criticism. Worded badly perhaps but sometimes criticism is unfair and can be justified or explained.

Yes Peter, can of worms......

I think a search on this and forums reveals more than you need to know about Mr Emery, who has been 'serving' the Norton world since before Fairspares as the NOC 'Spares Secretary'.

My first meeting with him was in '75, at his home in Rugely! I rode there on a Yellow Fastback I was then told to paint Blue! I wanted some small parts and mentioned I was building a race motor MkIII cases and new FAG Superblends....I was told to drop them in the bin and use the much cheaper and 'better' solution of one of 'his' rollers and a ball race, because 'race motors don't need supeblends' and the ball race was the only proper way to do it! How throwing parts away and buying more was cheaper I had some difficulty comprehending.

Mrs Emery even got in on the act when a couple of years later at a race meeting I was explaning how I had repaired my Luca Rita electronics box, only to be told I had no idea what I was doing, despite racing a bike with the repaired ignition that weekend!

Various court cases, not least the use of the 'Norvil' name itself is another clue. The obfuscation of trading via different names on ebay etc, is another clue to the fact that Mr Emery has difficulty trading on his 'good name'. I know it goes on and on, I searched for myself at one point. Before I pinned down who exactly Norton bits was I had bought two completey useless gearbox mounting bolts, wrong size and badly finished...they are in the bin somewhere!

He is clearly 'Marmite' because I have seen him defended, but have assumed for myself that those defenders are actually defending their own decisions!

I suggest someone locks this thread and nips the potential a very long list of similar anecdotes in the bud!

Thought that was the idea of a forum Steve
I just find it difficult to comprehend that if he is that bad he still trades in what is a relatively compact market where everybody knows everybody. I was aware of the trademark court case.

I have delt with Les for very many years , most of the time with no problems , but after a few, more recent problems , similar to those previously covered , I no longer have anything to do with him . There are others around now that are much more pleasant to do business with so I spend my hard earned with them .

Hi Commando, my point is that I have seen posts from some of the suppliers mentioned justifying or explaining criticism. Worded badly perhaps but sometimes criticism is unfair and can be justified or explained.

Click to expand...

All suppliers can have bad days even the best, but based on the sheer number of Norvil complaints they are simply a supplier to be avoided. I have avoided Norvil since I met Les in the 80's and took an instant dislike. Using RGM, Andover Norton and Mick Hemmings for all these years since I have not needed to question my original decision, either there have been no issues or they have been immediately rectified when identified.

I am one of his unhappy and resentful customers. In my case, Les Emery never apologized or admitted responsibility for the mistakes made by him or his staff, nor did he offer a discount, despite the fact that I had to invest many hours and money to rectify poor workmanship. His assertion that his team´s oversight of an obvious fault was the customer´s fault by providing a part which needed repair, was top of ignorance for me.
I won´t make a general comment on quality of the parts he supplies, but I will never entrust him with professional work again.

Really glad I have read all these views as there's most defo a common thread....Avoid at your peril!!!

Totally concur with "don't use them." I have several similar anecdotes which all include Norvil assuring me that I must have done something wrong if something they sold me didn't fit/work properly. In once case, I then contacted the actual manufacturer of the product concerned who agreed there was an issue and ultimately redesigned the product/supplied me with a new version at no cost. Norvil provided no assistance at all.

peter12 said:

Thought that was the idea of a forum Steve
I just find it difficult to comprehend that if he is that bad he still trades in what is a relatively compact market where everybody knows everybody. I was aware of the trademark court case.

Click to expand...

I think the point is that a lot of us fail to comprehend why he is still able to trade. I would suggest that as this forum shows, there is a continuing feed of first timers! And that some of the rest do things by force of habit!

My real point was that searching previous threads here and elsewhere would have gained the same or similar stories of woe.

Certainly new to the mighty Norton Marque, but not the rebuild of classic British iron.
That why I for one take the trouble to spend a fair bit of time researching forum like this, to see what is good and bad before spending my hard earned cash.
God know what we did before tinternet

Malc

Even the big names in Nortondom go wrong on occasion. But, for instance, Hemmings and AN, both
took care of the problem . I was inconvenienced but that was all.
That is the difference. Big difference.

+1 to that!

WEAL Norton said:

we bought 7 "brand new" Commandos .

Click to expand...

To think I was moaning about them putting £20 worth of Wassell carburettor jets in "Genuine Norton Spares" bags!

Put it this way I absolutely love my commando but if the only spares available were from norvil I'd have to stop riding it, or buy a Honda or become a monk, seriously if you buy from him check the item extremely carefully and expect it to be the wrong part,and it will be your fault for ordering the wrong part,and don't even think about getting your money back, luckily there are a choice of dealers out there , cheers

I was restoring a one owner original 650SS many years ago and visited Norvil for advice and spares namely for the head. L E asked me what year it was and the engine number which I duely provided and he immediately stated that I had all the wrong parts fitted and that it should be a high pressure oil system and I had the low pressure system which is c**p. I stated that this was an untouched totally original bike and he became very argumentative. I left his premises feeling totally deflated and in a sense annoyed by his obnoxious manner. Later I researched more into my 650SS and it transpired that my bike was manufactured during the transition period that Norton changed from low to high pressure systems or from 3 to 6 start oil pumps so my machine was correct. I have maintained and kept the low pressure system and it has never given me any problems. I for one will never use Norvil as there are far more knowledgeable and polite suppliers out there to deal with.

I seem to b the exception but I have bought parts from Norvil for years without any problems, I have also used RGM with no issues. I have had a couple of faulty parts from Norvil and they replaced them with no fuss or charge. I live a long way away from any Norton parts supplier - other than Madass who is almost a next door neighbor - so it is important to me that parts ordered and supplied are correct otherwise weeks of time can be lost. I have restored 7 Commandos as well as other classics in the last decade and they are all still on the road with no major problems.