"Inverted" Shift Pattern

Thanks for everyon'es input. I can see a little of myself in almost every entry. As I tell the rare person that I "allow" to ride the CDo, "In a panic situation, merely squeeze and press everything." I'd rather they (or I) had to ratchet through the gears after making a panic stop than tangling with one of the idiotic drivers we have around here. I agree with Ashley about the Norton's gearbox; as a motorcycle mag so poetically wrote during a road test from the time, "It's like shifting a box full of warm butter" but, as for the brain just knowing which bike I'm on, well, that's another matter entirely. As I'm in the process of selling 'most everything else I own, it's soon to be a moot point. Anyway, I like the race pattern best!
I worked in a motorcycle salvage yard in the early '80's, and I thought it was very cool that the late '60's Yamaha enduros (DT-1/RT-1) had a splined nub of a shaft on the right-hand side where you could move the shifter to. Too bad the Japs weren't the ones to have to convert, but that would detract somewhat from what makes our bikes unique.
My son's friend wanted to know why it was on the "wrong" side and "upside-down". "For racing, obviously! Just think; it's easier to stomp down for the next higher gear, especially when you're dragging your left foot as you exit turn 4."

I reverse the camplate in BSA Unit Singles which is simple and on my T120R the gear lever will be reversed using rearsets as it a lot easier on a T120 than a Commando.

Ugh, almost crashed hopping on SV650 after Peel flat tire d/t unintended dn shift that slid rear out w/o traction on lowering throttle to make a turn. Pleased me no end to know that my deepest neurons are Norton pattered even though twice the mileage then on SuVee. Peel had reverse faced 1dn3up shifter for a few weeks but after having toe-foot snatched under bike during a low RH accelerating turn > put back the extra mass of over head shifter linkage and got new soles on boot. In drag race tapping with WOT kill button 'dn' shifts is rather quicker surer than toggling up with less ankle muscle speed.

About 8 months ago I finished fitting the 6 speed TTI box to my Seeley 850, and found that the shift pattern was reversed. I still have the replacement selector drum to fit, but having to change it has really pissed me off. I would never try to ride the bike with the gear change one down and five up, and if raced I it that way, could say goodbye to the motor. The race change is critical, you cannot afford t o stuff around looking for gears when you are trying to do a number on another competitor. Usually you can reverse the gear change by swapping t he linkage around. The TTI box is loo long, and interferes with the connecting rod of the linkage, if you fiddle it. I was not aware that there were two types of selector drum, when I ordered the TTI box, I simply assumed they would all be race pattern, Norton type. Bruce Verdon will just have to wait until I regain some enthusiasm. to get his old selector drum back,

I have to reorient myself with each bike before I ride it to remind myself of shifter, brakes and switches. I have the Norton. The Vincent shifts the same, right side with first up. Earlier Triumphs shift on right side, but down for first. Later Triumphs are left shift, down for first like modern machines. I used to have a tank-shift Harley with left foot clutch, not bad since it's like a car. The most screwed up I ever got was on an Indian with right tank shift, left hand throttle and left foot clutch that engaged backwards by pushing on the lever with the ball of my foot instead of disengaging it. Fortunately nobody posted a video on youtube of me flailing all my limbs trying to ride it the first time.

Alan, this ITT shifting is an un-solved issue on Ms Peel. I pinged ITT to make 'her's' reverse CCW shift with hope just a backwards facing lever will work. Do ya think I'm thinking clearly on this? Before I realized I could snag a ITT I'd almost welded 3 mounting pegs around the AMC-Qualfe outer cover to put a lever pivot on it with linkage to the shift shaft. I also asked ITT if a N indicator switch could be added.

No too long after I got the P!! dragster on the road a close friend needed someone to drive his Big Red Indian Chief home a 150 miles away, from out of woods on sandy ruts off road then highway and city roads with LH throttle and tank shifter and LF deadman clutch, while stoned on Florida weed. The THC slowed thoughts enough I just talked=thought each action to body and it worked a treat till got the hang of it - with strict attention not to let it tip to LH while in gear while stopped. By time I go to his home I was familiar enough with it to try some off road hot dogging, kicking rear out some on grass and sandy places and running it off street into side ditch to leap a jump a few feet high landing in level-ish grass lot to slow down and go back out the way I came. Neat sensation I'll never forget feeling the suspension ocsillating while airborne and landing rather softly even though it plus my weight almost 1000 lb. Them Indians are dang impressive rides and I could well see myself takening up a racer type Indian instead of Norton, especially after seeing one out corner sharper further over than 125cc in the tights!!! The 125cc looked planted and stable as can be while the Indian was bouncing-twisting on it leaf springer fork and hard tail frame but dam sure holding any dang line pilot wanted, amazing to me to see. Then I went over to the Barrel of death for more Indian antics to rub it in deeper.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Oi7NvRDjRU[/video]

That rider made it look easy; he's had some practice. Notice the right hand throttle, left hand timing advance (quick twist from retard after starting), no syncho with a 3-speed bang box gearbox. Police preferred a left hand throttle (so they could draw their pistol while riding?) but easy to change throttle and shifter from one side to the other. After restoring and owning it for 15 years, I traded my Indian for a Laverda RGS 1000 which has all the modern refinements to ride in today's traffic.[img][/img]

The first two bikes I ever owned were WD Indian Scouts. with the LH foot operated clutch, LH throttle, RH advance and retard, and RH manual gear shift . You could also adjust the main jet on the left side while riding them. You get used to them, and I know if I rode one today, I wouldn't have a problem. My first high performance bikes were 650cc Triumphs fitted with race cams and high comp, and twin carbs. Because they were on the road they did not have rear sets, so the gear change was one down, 3 up. When I raced the 500cc Triton with the close box, it naturally had rear set footrests, so the gear lever was simply adjusted for length and reversed, and became one up 3 down.
In the old days all race starts involved pushing your bike from the left hand side. I used to try to lift the bars , and push and run like hell. Your backside hits the seat, and you instantly give the bike full throttle, and keep it open while you step over. As you put your right foot down you step on the gear lever and effect a race change, and keep the bike wicked up right around the first corner, if it is close enough to the start. What I found is that most guys will back off for the first corner in a race, I always went around it at full race speed. I blitzed the whole field off the grid at the start of races, many times. The advantage didn't last for long, the bigger bikes always caught me at the end of the back straight , about a mile from the start after a series of tight bends , I needed 6 gears.
The direction the gear change works on a race bike is very important , old habits die hard , and a wrong change in the heat of battle is very costly.

This is how you do it:
( I think this photo is very funny, the guys would get upset when I did that, and sometimes make mistakes. )

In the old days all race starts involved pushing your bike from the left hand side. I used to try to lift the bars , and push and run like hell. Your backside hits the seat, and you instantly give the bike full throttle, and keep it open while you step over. As you put your right foot down you step on the gear lever and effect a race change, and keep the bike wicked up right around the first corner, if it is close enough to the start. What I found is that most guys will back off for the first corner in a race, I always went around it at full race speed. I blitzed the whole field off the grid at the start of races, many times. The advantage didn't last for long, the bigger bikes always caught me at the end of the back straight , about a mile from the start after a series of tight bends , I needed 6 gears.

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that is so cool to read Alan it left me jumping in my rocker pumping my legs to help get ya going! The only short term racing I did was little hydro planes where they have big timer you must not cross start before it ticks to zero, it takes a while of roostering nose high plowing before these hydro got on a plane so what happens is everyone is doing various size circles trying to be full bogey at the line with everyone converging from many angles crossing wakes and blown around by wind gusts as they are barely in the water most the time but slam down or though water with distinct impacts on such light craft.

Btw I ain't that big a dude but the Indian was pretty light and easy to handle at all speeds though did press it to a sort of hinging state I could feel could get out of hand about time I ran out of lean which was enough for me. 80 mph is about as fast as I took it as was more pleasant tooling along throbbing. One distinct feature that struck me as utilitarian lawn mower was the exposed V belt drive generator.

I really liked the engineering in the Indians. The primary case was through bolted, and the rest was very sound. Performance w as nothing , but the bikes were re liable. The first one was given to me. I used to see it in the back of a factory as I rode to school on the train each day for about three years . I went there and offered to buy it, however the guy gave it to me. In those d a ys bikes cost little, nobody wa nted them. I bought a second indian 500 with bits missing for two pounds, and thought I'd been cheated. I was offered a 1200 Indian with sidecar for 12 pounds, but thought it was too dear. Another for 35 pounds (in about 1963) , beautifully restored, however by then I'd owned Triumph 650, who would want such a slug ? I saw a cop on one in The Great Gatsby movie , the other night . What a lovely thing they really were ? I never liked Harleys as much. My first Indian had stood outside for probably te n years . I charged the battery added some petrol,started it, got it registered, and rode it for two years. Didn't even have an oil change, however one of the old tyres did blow out when I blew it up too much. I had a beautiful childhood.

Gosh acetrel back in them days the coins had some valuable metal in them so likely your figuring was correct. When I had the P!! I learned to do kill button clutchless shifts, just touched the big chrome button same time as toe tap holding on to WOT. Well not so WOT in 1st two gears on street tire or just sat in place fogged by smoke and ears and chest ringing from open pipes. With that kind of response it was not hard to go through 4th and only move a bike length w/o any brake applied. Power to wt. wise its most potent thing that's thrilled me > Peel best power pales compared by like 20+hp. Gave a ride to a friend on tail end of seat and showed off its power - jerked his loose strapped helmet off and him barely hanging on tail light and me. I'm trying to figure out a lever for Peel that has folding peg end for the inevitable on my learning curves.

Hobot, I find that a race change by standing on the lever on full throttle, with the commando engine is relatively stress free compared with my old 500cc short stroke Triton or my alcohol fuelled 250cc Suzuki two stroke. The long stroke engine gives a much nicer bike. I did find though that the standard gearbox is useless in a racer. It took a heap of revs to change down, and it was difficult to be smooth. The 4 speed CR box is great, but useless in a clutch start. Incidentally, today I started working on the TTI 6 speeder. I should have the bike going again this wee k, and I'll video it so you can get a look at it. You should find it interesting .

Alan even though I've only been on one real track I've gotten to experience the tight heats of crazy fast in tights for miles and miles so had to work around the rpm-power acceleration drops on each shift - which meant I ran rpms into mid redline to shift and to carry scary speed going into turns as them moderns are dang rocxkets - coming out of turns. Past Peel sure could of used two more gears but really had to think though my style and conditions for next Peel, which should have dragster like power to wt. compared to tire traction so picked a granny low with big jump to 2nd and wide gaps to 4th. Creeping and stunts in 1st, standing starts in 2nd slipping clutch or feathering throttle as tire requires. One reason I like riding corner crippled Trixie, beside the practice catching crashes or timid avoidance is keeping the shifter reflexes attuned to RH 1up/3dn.

Hobot, I would not even attempt to race a bike if first gear was not up, and the rest down. I ride mainly by instinct and habit, and any moves I make while racing involve instantaneous decisions. If the gear change is in the wrong direction, you have to come unstuck sometime and you could lose a motor. As it is I always have enough trouble keeping count of my gear changes around circuits so that at any particular point I am always in the same gear as on every other lap, and going at the maximum. I know I sound like a silly old fool, however I had a very hard apprenticeship, and some very big crashes. This stuff is all about self-discipline, however you must always keep your sense of humour.

Here we go guys. Let's pull Dunstall out of his country estate, dust off the cobwebs, and ask him how many of these he actually sold

Well I'm sure he sold at least one, as I have a set on my bike. It has been somewhat modified with a rear disk master cylinder mounted on the right side. I hate to admit it but I struggle with my new MacAir laptop and haven't been able to post pictures with it as I'm a long time PC windows guy.

Its a real shame US reg's made such a complex mess in the later Commandos shifter to work around. Alan I've been looking at the various air and electric shifters to add cost and complexity to Peels shifting too.

Until recently my other bike was a Ducati Monster and since it had a rod type shift linkage it was very easy to flip the gearbox lever over to make it one up five down GP pattern, I much preferred this to the stock setup....anyway, a good option on many modern bikes to make switching back and forth to a Commando easier. There is a good article on the pros and cons at http://www.sportrider.com/tips/146_0809 ... t_pattern/

I love that article, Bluto. Especially the bit about 'the Big Mistake'. I don't often ride road bikes, but just after moving to Benalla 13 years ago I had an RD250LC Yamaha with the left hand wrong way up gear change. I got a real giggle out of changing down instead of braking for corners. Fortunately I'm still quick enough to save myself. You cannot afford to do that on a race bike at full noise . In my mind, during a race I always step on the lever to change up (usually without backing off), and I pull back for corners . The extremely quick positive gear change is of critical importance, especially when you've got somebody lined up for the lightning fast passing move. The other thing is to always count your gear changes so that you know the bike will respond at all times, and not bog down.
Interesting too, that most guys sit up while braking for corners. If you are ever in the lead in a race and getting hard pressed, it can sometimes be useful to stay down on the tank (once) while braking. If the opposition is riding to your lead by watching you, they will sometimes overcook the corner if you do that.

The other thing is to always count your gear changes so that you know the bike will respond at all times, and not bog down.
Interesting too, that most guys sit up while braking for corners. If you are ever in the lead in a race and getting hard pressed, it can sometimes be useful to stay down on the tank (once) while braking. If the opposition is riding to your lead by watching you, they will sometimes overcook the corner if you do that.

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Lots of wisdom in there Alan, thanks. Before I learned to ride I would follow those I thought knew what they were doing and figured if their bike could then mine too, but found out you can follow them off the edge, so don't pay much attention but to where they are going to be committed too when passing in a flash.

I've got a bit of a police hang up - all my life, so contemplating a brake light cut out switch that switches soapy water down just before max brake point.