Gear change Grrrrrrrrrremlins!!

Stephen_Spencer

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Mmmmmmmmm! Sat patiently waiting for the new gear change rod, after receiving a sales order number three weeks ago. Decided to check with Marie by email yesterday as I had not received the item. Got one back with a Tracking Number - it shipped today; due to my update request obviously. Guess there are still ‘wrinkles’ in the new systems. Always ask for a Tracking Number I guess, if one is no provided.
 
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Mmmmmmmmm! Sat patiently waiting for the new gear change rod, after receiving a sales order number three weeks ago. Decided to check with Marie by email yesterday as I had not received the item. Got one back with a Tracking Number - it shipped today; due to my update request obviously. Guess there are still ‘wrinkles’ in the new systems. Always ask for a Tracking Number I guess, if one is no provided.
and have the design/ materials been improved , we wonder???
 

Fast Eddie

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and have the design/ materials been improved , we wonder???

22675266-307A-4A20-8804-5E17ED24585B.jpeg
 

Stephen_Spencer

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I think we all know the answer to that!

The initial response from Marie was so quick my plan was to wait for the new item and use positioning of the broken rod to guide fitting of the new (not necessary I know), as gear change had been sweet as a nut until the rod broke. As I’m now going to have to wait for international post I’m gonna whip the broken one off and try a fix. I’ll let you know how I go.

Oh, and I’m also taking up ballet lessons:)!
 
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Stephen_Spencer

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OK guys, I’m part way through a fix (temporary or permanent - not decided yet).

As the picture shows I purchased some stainless steel tubing, ID 9.5mm; the only size I could find in my local area. Used a 10mm carbide tip drill and keeping it cool slowly expanded the ID to 10mm - who knew stainless steel was so hard! Removed the locknuts and placed the angled ball joint and push rod into the tubing. Interference fit to the ball joint shaft, firm push fit to the push rod.

981018F6-F874-4125-BF69-B48FC9BFF766.jpeg


Looks good (maybe better than the adj nuts on the original) but of course it still needs welding to both ends of the SS pipe, which will make it look like a bodge (which it is of course!)

Not entirely sure that the length is correct now and whether there will be enough adjustment on the back end if it is not, once welded! Need to remove the rod again and make sure the failed thread ends are touching (ish).

Managed to damage the rubber insert to the ball joint, stripping the rubber collar section that goes into the ball joint - Doh! It’s just a rubber washer now and will not stop crap getting into the ball joint. Guess it’s possible just to slide a new one onto the joint?

Any ideas for fixing this sleeve into place rather than a messy weld? Drill and pin may be a tad tricky. Epoxy adhesive?

Ideas greatfully received.

Regards, Steve.
 
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ntst8

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Nice job, looks good enough to be permanent to me assuming the length has worked out.
The tube might too thin for a grub screw so could plug weld through a hole on the hidden side or perhaps just loctite it together?
 

Fast Eddie

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+1 on Loctite.

Looks to me like you’ve greatly strengthened the original weak point.
 
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I think we all know the answer to that!

The initial response from Marie was so quick my plan was to wait for the new item and use positioning of the broken rod to guide fitting of the new (not necessary I know), as gear change had been sweet as a nut until the rod broke. As I’m now going to have to wait for international post I’m gonna whip the broken one off and try a fix. I’ll let you know how I go.

Oh, and I’m also taking up ballet lessons:)!
Oh! Do you know where to buy tights ? wink- wink, nudge - nudge.
 
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OK guys, I’m part way through a fix (temporary or permanent - not decided yet).

As the picture shows I purchased some stainless steel tubing, ID 9.5mm; the only size I could find in my local area. Used a 10mm carbide tip drill and keeping it cool slowly expanded the ID to 10mm - who knew stainless steel was so hard! Removed the locknuts and placed the angled ball joint and push rod into the tubing. Interference fit to the ball joint shaft, firm push fit to the push rod.

View attachment 19452

Looks good (maybe better than the adj nuts on the original) but of course it still needs welding to both ends of the SS pipe, which will make it look like a bodge (which it is of course!)

Not entirely sure that the length is correct now and whether there will be enough adjustment on the back end if it is not, once welded! Need to remove the rod again and make sure the failed thread ends are touching (ish).

Managed to damage the rubber insert to the ball joint, stripping the rubber collar section that goes into the ball joint - Doh! It’s just a rubber washer now and will not stop crap getting into the ball joint. Guess it’s possible just to slide a new one onto the joint?

Any ideas for fixing this sleeve into place rather than a messy weld? Drill and pin may be a tad tricky. Epoxy adhesive?

Ideas greatfully received.

Regards, Steve.
If the weld is done by a pro , it can look very good . You also have the option of welding on the back side only to hide the bead . What is the OD of this tubing ?
 
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Looks good! If you are thinking of a MkII version then I would have got a tube of 9mm i/d and an o/d of 12mm+ and threaded them. Stainless is tough but a good tap/die set easily cuts it.
 
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I am still amazed that these linkages are breaking as the 961 gear selector is easily the smoothest i've had for many, many years, barely any effort required and always a positive selection.
 

Stephen_Spencer

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Good advice guys but not sure I would be happy with just Loctite. This fault has stranded me twice. Modern adhesives are amazing but cannot replace a permanent fixing IMO.

OD is 13mm so not thick enough for a grup screw. Plug welding could work as could just spot welding to the rear. I’m going to find a local welder and take his advice. Not sure how a die would go cutting a thread on the shaft of the angled ball joint, noting the flat sections and material hardness - could be possible.

I’ll let you know what the welder comes up with. Would like it to look pretty but functional is a must:)
 
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The early bikes had a reverse shift drum.
When you mount the shift lever direct to the shaft on the newer bikes, the first gear is up and the rest down. (like racing bikes)
The reason for poor shifting was the quality of the first gearboxes.
Ollie has overhauled one of my gearboxes and alll problems were gone.

Panetone
 

Fast Eddie

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But isn’t the angle wrong for ‘nice’ shifting? Due to that angle you gotta kinda hook the lever up and back, and push it down and forwards. Or is it a none issue in real life?
 

BritTwit

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But isn’t the angle wrong for ‘nice’ shifting? Due to that angle you gotta kinda hook the lever up and back, and push it down and forwards. Or is it a none issue in real life?

Yeah, most mags that did test early 961s complained about the feel of the lever motion when shifting.
The direction of the lever's rotation is opposite to the direction of the rider's ankle.
The lever is trying to roll off of the rider's foot, instead of following the natural rotation of the rider's ankle.

I used the same setup back in the day on the track.
My Z1 road racer had a reverse shifter with rearsets.
It does feel strange until you get used to it.
 

Stephen_Spencer

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And another one! Beyond being stranded or limping home (potentially from a great distance), what are the safety implications of failure at medium to high speed?
 

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Clive

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And another one! Beyond being stranded or limping home (potentially from a great distance), what are the safety implications of failure at medium to high speed?
Definitely add this one to the list of essential preventative work for new owners. Thanks for reminding me to get mine replaced. yup - for any normal vehicle this would be a safety recall...……...
 
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