French Newbie

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rvich said:
If you pulled the seal and heated the area well it will help drive the oil out of the crack, then as it is cooling you would need to flow something like acetone into the crack with a pipette. Since acetone is flamable make sure the case has cooled enough to lay your hand on, but the temp difference will help pull the fluid into the crack. Then the idea presented above about using some Loctite would be worth a try. I would warm the case again to apply it as it will open up the crack a bit.

If that doesn't seem aggresive enough, you could use a small cut off wheel and grind away some of the metal at the crack and work in some JB Weld or similar epoxy. There are a number of epoxy products that could be used to fair out the pry marks on the face as well if looking at them bothers you.

Russ
Click to expand...

Thx Russ for your advices, I'll proceed more or less like this as a first step before changing the crankcases.
When I bought this Commando, I though I would'nt have to work on it to quickly... Now that I see all the work ahead, I realise I paid too much for it :(
Still, I'll keep it :D

Xavier
 
Xpongebob said:
Thx Russ for your advices, I'll proceed more or less like this as a first step before changing the crankcases.
When I bought this Commando, I though I would'nt have to work on it to quickly... Now that I see all the work ahead, I realise I paid too much for it :(
Still, I'll keep it
Click to expand...


Well, I don't know if it's me, but personally I wouldn't think about riding it another metre/yard until those cracks were inspected and repaired or the crankcases changed if necessary.

The time to act is now, in my opinion.
 
Xpongebob said:
:shock: OH MY GOD ! :shock:

What is this made of ? Pig Iron ? I've never seen such things on my +60Kkm Japs, are the tappets and pushrods so hard on camshafts ?

Xavier
Click to expand...

I believe the camshafts were improperly hardened.
 
swooshdave said:
Xpongebob said:
:shock: OH MY GOD ! :shock:

What is this made of ? Pig Iron ? I've never seen such things on my +60Kkm Japs, are the tappets and pushrods so hard on camshafts ?

Xavier
Click to expand...

I believe the camshafts were improperly hardened.
Click to expand...

+1 on that. Brit bikes don't normally eat camshafts like that!

Webby
 
Xpongebob said:
rvich said:
Thx Russ for your advices, I'll proceed more or less like this as a first step before changing the crankcases.
When I bought this Commando, I though I would'nt have to work on it to quickly... Now that I see all the work ahead, I realise I paid too much for it :(
Still, I'll keep it :D

Xavier
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

It is always too expensive...this is the name of the game! Ask Laurent @ Machines et Moteurs... he may have some cases somewhere! BUT if I where I tried first to patch the one you have and run it like this for a while! The cams? you'll see more torque and less power as it's eat itself away (you can check the valve aperture in situ (lenght of movement) it should give you an idea!
Philippe
 
Welcome to the site :D

I have to agree with the other posters that there has been some very heavy handed use of a crowbar or screwdriver to lever off the cases, and unfortunately if the previous owner/s have done this much damage in that one location, there is a strong possibility of more damage elsewhere :( But on a brighter note this is all part of the fun of owning an old British bike! :D
 
I've seen that type cam wear damage before d/t real high rpm useage. I've seen that crack look on the inner rim from over rev'd crank sling that bears most in the 5-7 o'clock arc. The lower marks look like mechanic miss handling. I'd run those tested cases, just not up to full redline. I'd suspect bent cheeks or lurking fractures in cast iron flywheel. I will never ever expect to get a bargain Commando again.
 
Thought I'd clarify what I thought looks like a crack in the 2nd photo. If it is a crack it's dangerous.

French Newbie
 
RennieK said:
Thought I'd clarify what I thought looks like a crack in the 2nd photo. If it is a crack it's dangerous.
Click to expand...

Well that's a crack for sure. :|

Should I suspect the flywheel/crank too ? I saw that my rotor had multiple contacts with the stator as if the crank had a run-out (I'm not sure of the terms, in french we say "faux-rond" which means the crank end is not on a perfect axis of rotation). I'm now in hunt for a new pair of crankcase !

Regards

Xavier
 
You may want to consider buying a parts bike. One of the bastardized choppers might be a good candidate. Probably can be had for not much more than a good set of cases. Assuming the parts bike has unmolested cases, take what you want and sell the rest. New Maney cases would be an excellent choice, but a tad spendy, £939.00.
 
Those blue arrow cracks ain't hardly nothing but cosmetic the real crack of concern is a bit above them 7:30ish that runs radially outward not aligned with circumference as the more noticed fractures, which don't extend to the radius
of case surround. Cases could be racer beefed up fairly straight forward by welded on disc that surrounds the bearing boss. Cases don't fracture down low unless something jammed from above by flywheel momentum, like steel rod end rolled up like chewing gum. Racer cases let go with crack at rear of crank hole up though the top cradle bolt. Vendors have cases for a few hundered bux but if too pensive to run cases then also need all major items but barrel and head for another long runner. Some pet names might come to mind while really making her yours.
 
I think the 7:00 crack and the circular one are one and the same, joined by fatigued metal and waiting to get worse with every vibration.

Ken did a write up on the beefed up reenforcing that he uses for his 920's. It's quite a procedure and requires line boring again with an insert at the bearing boss if I remember correctly all due to distortion caused by welding. Great if you're building a hot rod 920 but very expensive otherwise. I'd get used cases. Some of the ebay sellers use good photos that allow you to see a lot of detail but query the seller on the condition too before you buy. Have him verify there are no cracks or other damage because shipping to France can't be cheap. The Maney cases are nice if you can afford them.
 
I saw that my rotor had multiple contacts with the stator

They All Do That . :shock:

IF it hasnt got a ' W ' its not got the magnets welded to the centre . SO , they welded them , and stamped ' W ' ( for welded ) on the rotor .

However , if it does have a ' W ' stamped on the ROTOR , :oops:

While youre there , GRAB the end of the crankshaft , if it goes up & down 20 thou , its as bad as a 25.000 well thrashed Bonneville . :oops: :lol:

Being cautious & carefull ( keep a cosh or handcuffs handy in case the bloke with the cold chisel puts his nose in ) Gripping the crank end securely
you can ascertain if there any ( radial - excessive ) bearing clearance . Itll Clunk / cunk or clank clank , freeplay .
Likely not , and Id think Likely Superblends from new , hopefully. perhaps .

Big Bolt in the end . sacrificial :oops: . And you can clamp Vice Grips down on it to grasp , feet apart , both hands centre , and lift / drop .
( Thread in bottomed , or near & locknut ) Should only be a few thou , maybe . perhaps . .010 + , and we expect a report . :wink:
 
JimC said:
New Maney cases would be an excellent choice, but a tad spendy, £939.00.
Click to expand...

Thx Jim for the tip, I was at the cases Norvil are selling, but for a few quids more I can have the Maney which seems very stronger.
As for the bastardized choppers on Norton Basis, or any other horrors Norton based, you won't find these easily in France. There are way less Cdos back here than in the us !

Matt Spencer said:
They All Do That . :shock:

IF it hasnt got a ' W ' its not got the magnets welded to the centre . SO , they welded them , and stamped ' W ' ( for welded ) on the rotor .

However , if it does have a ' W ' stamped on the ROTOR , :oops:
Click to expand...

What I meant is that the rotor has been wore out by brushing with stator - there are grooves on it.
Am in for the grand opening, even if the engine was running fine, I'd rather check everything now, and I'll open a new thread when opening the engine, and then I'll check all clearances and plays.


Waw, I must say I wasn't expecting so many answers, thx again :D
 
Maney case are way over kill and extra heavy weight for a street bike unless behaving like Ghost Rider every police is after on sight. So for the French traffic light drag races you'd be better off lighter than heavier, so I'd go with racer welded up factory cases, like on hand, to fly on and put the savings in other light and handling and cosmetic speed items.
 
How much more do Maney cases weight than stock cases? Ounces? There are many places to eliminate weight. but crankcases are not one of them. Welding WILL distort aluminum cases. It's a matter of how much distortion. If you are going to weld, make certain it's preheated. The whole case should be heated in an oven.

If you can afford it the Maney cases are the better choice, hands down.
 
JimC said:
How much more do Maney cases weight than stock cases? Ounces? There are many places to eliminate weight. but crankcases are not one of them. Welding WILL distort aluminum cases. It's a matter of how much distortion. If you are going to weld, make certain it's preheated. The whole case should be heated in an oven.

If you can afford it the Maney cases are the better choice, hands down.
Click to expand...

+1

Do it right I say. I've seen street Nortons crack the cases.
 
Quick answer to Ludwig (sorry it's in french :wink: ) :

Salut Ludwig, merci de ta proposition, j'ai déjà la rmt 12, le manuel haynes et le Norton Twin restoration, plus un imprimé de la part list (j'ai essayé de me blinder niveau doc -et outils-je n'aime pas être pris au dépourvu). Si tu veux prendre l'apéro à la maison, tu seras le bienvenu (si je suis dans les parages bien sûr ;)

A+
 
Oh, I got a question for you nortonists : I ordered some spares before my first opening at Norvil's, but I wondered what was the general feeling about them, as I received a Gearbox cover of poor quality supposed to be an Andover Norton Genuine ?

If I have a crank/ Cranckase failure, would it be worth investing in a brand new engine from them ? (Given that the inside could even worse...) I'm not at this point yet, I'll wait to see what's inside as soos as I got a moment to begin surgery.
 
I have had some poor parts supplied by Norvil in the past when I used to use them, one being (or two if you count the replacement that also failed) their lightweight disc and also poor machining on a "Norvil" fork leg that "shouldn't have been sent out to me." I'll stop there. They're not all bad, but an accumulation of things that have occured with me has made me stop using them.

I would try Mick Hemmings. As far as I know he only deals with genuine Norton spares from A.N. apart from his Norvil parts (which I believe are manufactured / machined to the original specs) but I'm not sure if he still offers a full range of work, or Norman White in Hampshire who is somebody else I would use in preference to Norvil, and I would think would probably be cheaper.

For any specialist parts, Steve Maney. Always spot on with pleasant service.

This is my opinion (which may not be shared by some).
 
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