A question about motor sport

I have a problem reconciling a couple of things. In Australia free to air TV channels will not pay for content. Because events are not televised, there is a poor following, and gate takings are low. This means that organisers of events such as historic motor sport must penalise participants with excessive entry fees. The whole approach seems wrong to me. Development competition classes in motor sport are a basis of technology innovation. What we see on our TV is sanitised big money stuff, such as F1 and MotoGP with no view to improving local economic outcomes. If you have this problem in America, how do you overcome it ?

No offence Alan, but what a brain-dead question, you totally run out of ideas and logic ??
Most historic motor racing barely attracts a paying crowd, so to expect TV to fund anything like that is just plain wishful thinking,
they need audiences of MILLIONS just to be able to pay the tea lady. And get the advertisers (hint).
I've been to race meets where the entry was free, and they barely got any attendees.
Definitely a niche market, a very small niche market.
Motor Racing has always been a rich mans sport, what has changed ??
Think outside the square ?

Yes, we have that problem in America.

We have yet to overcome it.

I believe there was a televised bit done on an AHRMA Thruxton Cup (Transatlantic Challenge) race, due to a former champion racing in the class (there are several that have raced and still race in various vintage classes). I don't think it played out to any significant improvement in visibility.

The biggest crowds attracted here in the states come with circus atmosphere of "wall of death", air show, bike shows, swap meets, rock-n-roll bands at night, several other series (VMX, Dirt Track), and other big attractions such as Barber's Vintage Motorcycle Museum. Even then, I'm not sure the promoters make much money at all. Certainly they do draw "packed house" crowds.

TV istelf it a big part of the problem. People will sit on their asses at home rather than buy a ticket to a race event and actually attend. These lower attendance figures lead to smaller TV audiences, smaller purses, less interest, lack of media coverage, it's a vicious circle. Anyone who hasn't been to a MotoGP or GNC flat track race doesn't know what they're missing-or what they're killing with their apathy, either.

I have the feeling that a lot has to do with 'critical mass'. TV coverage shows the product and brings more followers to events which makes the cost of TV coverage more affordable and defrays the cost to competitors. It seems like a 'chicken and egg' situation to me. In Australia good sponsorship played a major part a few years ago. Our mentality seems to have radically changed.

Rohan said:

No offence Alan, but what a brain-dead question, you totally run out of ideas and logic ??
Most historic motor racing barely attracts a paying crowd, so to expect TV to fund anything like that is just plain wishful thinking,
they need audiences of MILLIONS just to be able to pay the tea lady. And get the advertisers (hint).
I've been to race meets where the entry was free, and they barely got any attendees.
Definitely a niche market, a very small niche market.
Motor Racing has always been a rich mans sport, what has changed ??
Think outside the square ?

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Rohan - it doesn't have to always be that way. In Australia we have only one promoter who has organised TV coverage for his motorcycle events. Have a look at Formula Extreme on SBS.com.au , as a result bike racing has only a very small following. Our historic scene is growing, however there is now no base level in road racing except for that.
\

I'm most impressed with Lord March's efforts with the Goodwood Revival. It doesn't rely on sponsorship or advertising and must cost a bomb to run each year. He doesn't seem to have any paranoia about putting video of the whole event up on Youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HlU1OZ8WQ0

(you have to wait a few minutes for the video to start up.)

acotrel said:

I have the feeling that a lot has to do with 'critical mass'. TV coverage shows the product and brings more followers to events which makes the cost of TV coverage more affordable and defrays the cost to competitors. It seems like a 'chicken and egg' situation to me. In Australia good sponsorship played a major part a few years ago. Our mentality seems to have radically changed.

Click to expand...

I'm not so sure this is right for small interest things like historic bike racing...
Even MotoGP and F1 in Oztralia is going backwards at the moment - witness the free-to-air TV coverage now only showing selected events and edited highlights of the others.

Too much of something makes the interest wander elsewhere ?
Maybe past champions should be excluded once they have their champeensheep in the bag ?

Rohan said:

No offence Alan, but what a brain-dead question, you totally run out of ideas and logic ??
Most historic motor racing barely attracts a paying crowd, so to expect TV to fund anything like that is just plain wishful thinking,
they need audiences of MILLIONS just to be able to pay the tea lady. And get the advertisers (hint).
I've been to race meets where the entry was free, and they barely got any attendees.
Definitely a niche market, a very small niche market.
Motor Racing has always been a rich mans sport, what has changed ??
Think outside the square ?

Click to expand...

Here in the UK there is the annual Sun Free Motorcycle race day at Brands Hatch, it nearly always attracts big crowds, but there is a lot of publicity in the Sun newspaper and elsewhere, or they wouldn’t do it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQ44VFKX2SA

Bernard, that Sun Free Day was in 1986. Back then we also had a lot of bike racing in Australia. These days we have a strong media bias towards cricket and football, however there must be a way that road racing can get a look-in. The historic meetings in particular are good value, however the actual racing is often pretty much a parade. I think we have a problem with both the product and the way we promote it. Most of the fellas just want to have fun and potter around, however what disturbs me is that I know what real racing looks like and I don't see much of it these days. We have gone really backwards since the 80s.

I have a genuine reason for raising this topic, as much as Rohan might think it is trite. A couple of years ago the CEO of Winton Motor Raceway died and our club fell in a hole. We are about to do a restart, and getting TV coverage for our events is a major consideration. I'd really like to know how you do it in the UK and America. In Australia we don't have the economies of scale that you guys have. However I believe it is still possible to come up with a sensible solution which would grow the sport. The situation is that I really don't want to make an attempt at running a big event and fail, it would probably destroy our relationship with the raceway.

acotrel said:

We have gone really backwards since the 80s.

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You need to go and see some proper racing.
Supersport, Superstock, Superbikes.

Super popular with young riders.
Can buy a bike out of the showroom and go racing, for under $20k I have heard.
Last a whole season, with just routine oil and filter and tyre changes.
If thats not progress, then what is. ?

acotrel said:

We are about to do a restart, and getting TV coverage for our events is a major consideration. I'd really like to know how you do it in the UK and America. .

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I've never seen any televised classic racing, apart from lately at the IoM.
So heavily edited down into 'hi-lites'.

Historically, old racing film footage was mostly private cameras that showed some of it, that (eventually) made their way onto the small screen.
Shell and Castrol used to hire cine operators to film races, and then show them at those old clubmen style film nights.

Very little of that would ever have been shown live, the sponsors just weren't there to afford that.
And stll aren't. ??

MX TV appears on my TV now and then.
Privately filmed races, and low budget presentation.
It is watchable if they happen upon a good race...

If you have delusions of grandeur beyond that, you better get your sponsorship $$$ gathered together 1st ??!!

You could invite the local TV channel out to film the best race of the day.
They'll include 10 or 15 seconds of footage on the TV news.
And maybe even interview your hotshot rider for a 5 or 10 second news grab.
Thats probably $1000 of their time already....
They'll need someone to give them some seriously knowledgeable guidance and commentary on the day,
so they don't look/sound like utter amateurs.

I read an article that postulated that track days killed club racing. There are more enthusiasts than ever safety-wiring and duct-taping their bikes for track use and probably more track-only machines than ever before, so if anything was "killed" it was the old, exclusive way of getting people into racing that kept as many out as brought some in.

Racing is directly related to economy and if anyone didn't notice, we are still emerging from another world economic crisis caused by manipulators gone wild (always the cause). If things continue to improve and those with more money than God are successfully reigned in and their hijinks curtailed, regular folks will have more discretionary income and activities like racing will grow. That includes not only the racers and machines improving, but also the viewing public and their access to the fun.

Danno said:

and those with more money than God are successfully reigned in and their hijinks curtailed, regular folks will have more discretionary income and activities like racing will grow.

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Can we vote for you ?
Those in power seem only intent on preserving the status quo.
Which is going to have to lead to rev-o-lution, sooner or later,
the masses are running out of cake....

I doubt that I'd be electable as long as overwhelming apathy and cynicism has those who bother to vote electing toadies of billionaires intent on sucking the lifeblood out of any economic progress. I plan to retire in a year and a half, but the next generation will likely have to work until death stops them, making retirement income unnecessary and long-term healthcare an oxymoron on par with military intelligence and business ethics.

Danno said:

I read an article that postulated that track days killed club racing. There are more enthusiasts than ever safety-wiring and duct-taping their bikes for track use and probably more track-only machines than ever before, so if anything was "killed" it was the old, exclusive way of getting people into racing that kept as many out as brought some in.

Racing is directly related to economy and if anyone didn't notice, we are still emerging from another world economic crisis caused by manipulators gone wild (always the cause). If things continue to improve and those with more money than God are successfully reigned in and their hijinks curtailed, regular folks will have more discretionary income and activities like racing will grow. That includes not only the racers and machines improving, but also the viewing public and their access to the fun.

Click to expand...

Road racing has been going backwards in Australia since long before October 2008. It is not really a question of money, but of confidence. These days there are not many of our local clubs which will run a road race meeting. We didn't have much money in the 60s and 70s, however there was still a road race meeting every month and sometimes twice a month. What confuses me is the way that sports such as football and cricket command the TV almost to the exclusion of all other sports. It is such brain-dead rubbish. When MotoGP started up, somebody said it would spell the end of normal road racing in Australia - that might be true ? I know in our local motorcycle club, I haven't seen even one kid make the transition from MX to road racing.

I wouldn't have thought track days would stop people from racing, quite the contrary. Once you are out there going around, the next step is natural. There are a couple of my friends who refuse to join me for a track day - they know what would happen - all part of having fun.

I think we are starting to see the real problem - from a quote from you from another thread here.....

acotrel said:

Years ago a young guy offered to build my Triumph race motor for me. I felt like strangling the little bastard.

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With an attitude like that, where do you see the future ??

acotrel said:

I have a genuine reason for raising this topic... getting TV coverage for our events is a major consideration. I'd really like to know how you do it in the UK and America... However I believe it is still possible to come up with a sensible solution which would grow the sport. The situation is that I really don't want to make an attempt at running a big event and fail, it would probably destroy our relationship with the raceway.

Click to expand...

"To make a million dollars in racing, start with 2 million" (paraphrased)

You need to have somebody with money as part of the team that intends to bring the project to TV.

You need to think through and formulate a REALISTIC plan and prospectus.

You need sponsors willing to spend money, based on a realistic prospectus.

You need to find people who have been involved in TV ventures before (preferably successful ones, although you can also learn from failures).

How we do it in the U.S. may have NOTHING whatsoever to do with how you can get it done elsewhere (although some aspects may be remotely similar, such as TV cameras)

You have to have a crowd of prospective participants lined up in advance, ABLE to be involved, pay entry fees, and SHOW UP with regularity. Everybody WANTS to do it, the true test is WHO ACTUALLY SHOWS UP (with race-prepped bikes and money in hand)

Your plan of course needs to have all other media outlets primed and ready to HEAVILY promote the inaugural event.

Plan also needs to include several other premier activities related to several of the events on your schedule. Turning racing events into total family draws greatly increases the success of the venture, as you won't be putting all your eggs in one basket (so to speak). Hoping a racing-only crowd will float the boat is not wise.

If you are unwilling to fail, don't even attempt it. ESPECIALLY without all of the above in place "guaranteed", and still no promise of success.

THAT is the way the world works. Some people are willing to gamble, and a small percentage of those people WIN.

I think that especially in Australia, we have a chicken and egg situation. The sport is usually too small to justify TV coverage, and without the coverage the sport won't grow. The thing that keeps a lot of older riders away from historic events is the structure of the race classes. If I bring out my commando-based bike I know it will be on the grid with very large capacity four cylinder superbikes of the 70s and 80s. It's not such a big problem if you have the right mentality, however for someone to make a comeback under those circumstances ..... ? The other thing about those race classes is the spectator appeal is almost zero. I've been going to road race meetings since 1954, and even I don't enjoy watching those races. Our Formula Extreme promoter runs mixed race classes with TV coverage, and seems to be going nowhere. He is still viable - just. I see his problem, his classes are designed for what is currently racing and he has to fill the grids, however his fees are much higher than normal.
I believe we have to take a step back and plan a very different approach. Find something decent we can sell to the big money guys in the background.