A hugh mistake

L.A.B. · Jan 13, 2013

pierodn said:
why when I squeeze the two spindle nuts on the rear wheel (that is a ES 850 mounted on his original swing harm) braking the wheel spins?.

Sorry Piero, but it isn't exactly clear (at least to me) what you mean?

Do you mean the wheel becomes more difficult to turn when the nut and spindle/axle are both tightened?

Two spindle nuts?

There is only one "spindle nut" on the left (drive) which is part of the sprocket assembly on the 06-5552 dummy spindle/axle/shaft. The hexagon on the right (timing) side should be a fixed part of the spindle/Axle.

motoracer8 · Jan 13, 2013

I've laced many, many wheels over the years and have two note books with lacing patterns and offsets. If I'm lucky enough to have the unmolested wheel I can measure the offset and make a note of the spoke pattern. But more times than not some one will bring me pretty rechromed rims, polished hubs, maybe some spokes and say can you lace these up? I ask did you measure the offset before you took the wheels apart? Many of the guys I lace wheels for know and even get the correct spokes. But some... say whats offset??? Without my notes of the past 30 years I would not have a clue.

Norton Front disc brake wheels have a big offset and have 4 different spokes, inner, outer, left and right. The disc side spokes are slightly shorter than the others, disc side spokes are tensioned slightly higher.

I've had discussions with Kenny Buchanan over the spoke lenghts and the angle the holes are drilled in the rims, they can get it right, I've installed many aluminium rims on Nortons over the years. There is no reason for bowed spokes if the holes are drilled correctly.
I used to get blank rims and drill the holes myself, it's not that hard. I made a little jig that clamped on the rim so the holes were consistant. The machine that Buchanans uses is alot more hi tech than mine.

Spoke angles on a Yamaha 280mm four shoe front brake with a 18" rim are pretty severe, I have drilled them and so has Buchanans, they can get it right.

pierodn · Jan 13, 2013

L.A.B. said:
pierodn said:

why when I squeeze the two spindle nuts on the rear wheel (that is a ES 850 mounted on his original swing harm) braking the wheel spins?.

Click to expand...

Sorry Piero, but it isn't exactly clear (at least to me) what you mean?

Do you mean the wheel becomes more difficult to turn when the nut and spindle/axle are both tightened?

Two spindle nuts?

There is only one "spindle nut" on the left (drive) which is part of the sprocket assembly on the 06-5552 dummy spindle/axle/shaft. The hexagon on the right (timing) side should be a fixed part of the spindle/Axle.

Dear Les,
Is right what you said that "the wheel becomes more difficult to turn when the nut and spindle/axle are both tightened".
My 850ES rear wheel has two final hexagon nuts, and on the Andover web page i seems to see like it.
May be not!.
Regards.
Ciao.
Piero

Matt Spencer · Jan 13, 2013

" Hi Sir,
Sorry, but who is Peel?. "

I think its a BSA Golden Flash . :wink:

L.A.B. · Jan 14, 2013

pierodn said:
Is right what you said that "the wheel becomes more difficult to turn when the nut and spindle/axle are both tightened".

The complete Mk3 rear wheel assembly consists of two sub-assemblies retained and two separate spindles/axles,

1. The wheel assembly and disc brake, fixed by the main axle/spindle (06-5553).

2 The sprocket assembly, located by the dummy shaft/axle (06-5552) and nut (14-1306).

So you need to discover which part of the main assembly is causing the binding problem? On the Mk3 this can often be the speedometer drive gearbox rubbing against the face of the sprocket when the dummy axle nut has been tightened.

pierodn said:
My 850ES rear wheel has two final hexagon nuts, and on the Andover web page i seems to see like it.
May be not!.

The Mk3 parts diagram in the factory parts book, and on the Andover Norton and Old Britts websites is inaccurate. Items [27]washer, [28]nut & [35]oil seal are drawn in the wrong locations, and [29]spindle is drawn incorrectly showing a thread at both ends, and the second 06-5552 washer for the main spindle is not on the diagram.

The rear wheel diagram in the 850 Mk3 manual (below) is more accurate as it shows the parts drawn in their correct order of assembly. The Mk3 06-5553 main rear spindle is one piece, it does not have a separate nut.

pierodn · Jan 14, 2013

L.A.B. said:
The Mk3 parts diagram in the factory parts book said:

washer, [28]nut & [35]oil seal are drawn in the wrong locations, and [29]spindle is drawn incorrectly showing a thread at both ends, and the second 06-5552 washer for the main spindle is not on the diagram.

The rear wheel diagram in the 850 Mk3 manual (below) is more accurate as it shows the parts drawn in their correct order of assembly. The Mk3 06-5553 main rear spindle is one piece, it does not have a separate nut.

Click to expand...

Dear Les,
my workshop manual shows the same wrong diagram of Andover!!!.
You say n. 35 oil seal but maybe is n. 25???: the n. 25 on my book goes after the sproket bearing, on your diagram goes before.
Where i must fit it?.
Thanks a lot.
Cio.
Piero

L.A.B. · Jan 14, 2013

pierodn said:
You say n. 35 oil seal but maybe is n. 25???: the n. 25 on my book goes after the sproket bearing, on your diagram goes before.

Yes, item should be 25, not 35. Its correct position is the other side of the 06-7688 double row sprocket ball bearing [23]

pierodn said:
my workshop manual shows the same wrong diagram of Andover!!!.

Doesn't your Mk3 manual copy contain drawing Fig.H3a?
http://britmoto.com/manuals/Manuals/850_man.pdf p122

pete.v · Jan 14, 2013

I think it is good when assembling the rear wheel to the swing arm and or adjusting the chain slack or checking alignment that you snug the left stub axle first, then secure the main axle.
I am not sure why, but I feel main axles and perhaps other parts, fail due to the reverse.
What ever your argument might be, not that there is one, it just makes sense.

pierodn · Jan 14, 2013

Tanks Les and thanks to everybody.
I feel me better thanks to you and i think i can do a good job.
Ciao.
Piero

P.S. 1: i am starting to rebuilt on line the front wheel !!!!!!! i need 12 mm ahead to the disc side !!!!! i dont knowh if i will be able.

P.S. 2: sorry for my bed english language

pete.v · Jan 14, 2013

pierodn said:
Tanks Les and thanks to everybody.
I feel me better thanks to you and i think i can do a good job.
Ciao.
Piero

P.S. 1: i am starting to rebuilt on line the front wheel !!!!!!! i need 12 mm ahead to the disc side !!!!! i dont knowh if i will be able.

P.S. 2: sorry for my bed english language

You're more inderstandable than some.

pierodn · Jan 15, 2013

Thank you very much.
I will be good in writing English than in rebuilding my Commando.
Unfortunately the good wills clashes several times with no knowledge.
I hope i will improves in both.

Ciao.
Piero

A hugh mistake

L.A.B.

Moderator

motoracer8

pierodn

Matt Spencer

L.A.B.

Moderator

pierodn

L.A.B.

Moderator

pete.v

pierodn

pete.v

pierodn

Similar threads