Stripped!

Translation . :wink:

Any accomplised welder / Metal worker should be able to do it standing on his head .
In fact one rotates the job so it is under the heat .

A lick of siff bronze on the lower tube. Welding would make X section discontinuous / un uniform . Rather unnessesary , but dressed( filed) will reinforce & replicate contour ( Id get a lick of oil inside after though .) As ar as Im aware its Seamed Mild Steal tube . Just Like exhaust tube. 16 Guage , the 1 in dia. tubes .

Very straight forward job . Have gas gear , other than bottles , here. And have previously welded an inch or two ( thousand ) of like work .

A couple of lengths of Stainless or Steel rod ( 3/8 or 10 mm ? Dia ) about a yard long , through the Iso Mounts allow an easy check for sighting alignment , parrallel . And measureing between ends , fore & aft .

A good Arc or Mig welder would deal with the brackets . Not in ten minutes , but in little more .

The design was post time consumeing ' Brazed Lug & Tube ' , More modern production tecnology . Apparently Italy Contraced
supply at one stage .Bit like these fence / hand rail welders . IF they can do a uniform weld. Unlike the robotic Jap Frame
welding of the Era .I pressume , as per same constructio Triumph twin Frames , they were ARC welded .

P.M. sent , Comrade . suspect its the machine in youre avatar . 8)

Thanks Matt, yeah guessed it must be pretty thin wall stuff. I get most of what you're saying on the welding tips, but been a long time since I was on the other end of the gear though. Solder every day at work though, so will give Silver solder a go as you recommend John.

Can anyone please bung up a pic of the sidestand? I'd like to see what the original arrangement was - how it attached to the frame bracket.

Also - what sort of flux do you use with Silver solder. Unlike with Lead-Tin soldering Bakers flux just evaporates at the temps required for Silver solder to melt.

Thanks in advance.

Dave go to your nearest BOC and tell them what silver solder or braze rods you are using, they'll have the correct flux. about 10 to 15 dollars. Or somewhere that sels oxy accet.
What are you silver soldering?
If it's not structural use blue top as it's 40% silver and has a low melting piont.
I've seen and used it to brace frames, I even think Harris used blue tip on their frames, the brases were a thing of beauty.
graeme

Hi Graeme,

just using it to fill a couple of dings and scrapes in the frame prior to painting. Purely cosmetic. Using an LPG flame and soldering iron with Silver solder on a reel. Bunnings likely to have the right stuff? Be grabbing the White Knight while I'm there too.

There is this from Oldbritts, It's only part of the info on the site better to visit their website to see all the accompaning photo's Etc... from the home page scroll down to our products, then manufactured products, then frame parts,then Norton side stand lug for '71 frame upgrade. also check out their frame loop support upgrade. good stuff. Cj

Upgrading the 1971 Side Stand Lug
by Fred Eaton
Summary:

This article covers the procedure of replacing the existing side stand lug on the 1971 Commando with the later version bracket. There are two reasons to upgrade the '71 side stand lug -- the pin on the '71 holding the side stand would break off and the '71 version of the side stand is no longer available. There are bolt-on side stands available that bolt around the frame tube, but these bolt-on stands tend to crimp the frame tube if used improperly. This procedure is normally done when a complete frame up restoration is being performed.A picture of the new bracket held to the frame with spring clamps and using our pattern to get the correct placement. A square tube is layed accross both lower frame tubes just above where the new bracket is to be welded.

Please Note: Do not weld the top part of the bracket to the frame in the center. You need to allow room for the nut and washer holding the side stand to fit flush against the top of the bracket. The second picture in this article shows the welds just on the end of the top.


We have a limited supply of the factory side stand brackets, part number 38-200002, $23.05, as of 10/04/11.

Thanks CJ, will have a look.

Goodies turned up today!



Have quite a bit of work ahead of me. Better get the frame sorted this weekend.

The sidestand bracket that you have left on your frame is the 68/70 style that everyone seems to hate and wants to replace with the later style like in the Old Britts article. Here is how your original prop stand looked.



Here is the bracket that attaches to the frame.



and here is the old prop stand, that is really too short.



That being said, I still use mine and have about 14K miles on it now. I have always started the bike with the prop stand down and have suffered no ill effects. There is a BSA stand that is about 14" long that will fit on the bracket too, I've been looking for one for a while.

Dave
69S

davamb said:

Better, but looks like it needs a bit of metal let in in places. A couple of runs of weld might do it, but will this embrittle and compromise the strength?

Click to expand...

The short answer is yes!
Any welder or frame maker, after making a joint, who is worth their salt will use an oxy/achy torch to heat up the weld to almost bright red and allow to cool down naturally, this will anneal the metal.
HTH

Thanks Bernard, I understand. My ding filling with Silver solder shouldn't be an issue then, low heat and plenty of cooling.

I checked out CJ's link Dave and couldn't see how it was compatible with the existing fixture - your pic explains why. How do you find the centre stand? Adequate cornering clearance? Easy to use? I'd rather have a good centre stand over a rubbish sidestand any day. Actually I'd rather almost any centre stand over any sidestand!

No, the 68-70 side stand is not compatible with the 71 and up at all. I was just showing how it worked. The centre stand mounts off the frame with 2 brackets off a tube that connects the frame below the sump bolt. The new ones (71 up) mount off the cradle. Actually, I cannot get the bike up on the centre stand unless I put a 2x4 under the front wheel, but then I'm old and even then, I have to take the seat off and pull it up with my left hand under the rear loop and my left foot on the back of the stand. I have no experience with the newer cradle centre stands. I have no issues with my centre stand, but then, I'm a pretty casual rider. The new cradle mount ones come in 2 flavors, the later one is much heavier and has bushings as I understand.

Dave
69S

Dave the White Night epoxy enamel paint you want is called Rust Guard. When I typed the original post I wasn't sure of the name so I added it later, which you may not have noticed. :wink:

DogT said:

I have no issues with my centre stand, but then, I'm a pretty casual rider.

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No worries Dave, will try and source one and ditch the sidestand.

Splatt said:

Be careful with some of the stuff from British Spares, I don't know were they are sourceing it from and it is usually to expensive, so I stopped dealing with them

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Caution noted Splatt. Normally I try to buy all my stuff locally to look after local business, but these were the nearest adjustable isos I could find and hard to argue with the price given the exchange rate at the moment. The boys at Bikes and Bits in Brizzy have been outstanding in their service over the last couple of years and if they had the bits, they would have got the guernsy.

Mark F said:

Dave the White Night epoxy enamel paint you want is called Rust Guard. When I typed the original post I wasn't sure of the name so I added it later, which you may not have noticed.

Click to expand...

Thanks Mark, going to wander up there and grab some later. Have finished prepping the frame so it's time to start painting today. Damn inconvenient having the MotoGP on this arvo.

Dave, make sure you get all the flux off around the braze. It can dry to a brown looking hard crust around the braze and will rust the frame if it's not removed. Sometimes you can wrap a wet rag around the braze to soften the dried flux then wash it off while scrubbing with a wire brush.

Thanks Graeme, yep after soldering I washed the frame down with soapy water and stainless steel wool, dried it off with a clean rag and then took the wire brush to every suspicious spot I could find. Now have White Kernighut and will experiment on swingarm before tackling frame.

Just be carefull you don't say "Nih"! And beware of shruberys!

GRM 450 said:

Just be carefull you don't say "Nih"!

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Like the Knights of Nih?

Dave

It,,,,,,,oh no I said it,,,,,,,,, I said it again,,,,,, !!!!!!!!