1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Side stand upgrade

Discussion in 'Norton Commando Motorcycles (Classic)' started by austinnorton, May 17, 2018.

  1. austinnorton

    austinnorton

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2006
    The Commando side stand issues have been a topic of discussion (derision?) here for some time. It seems to me it is a design intended for an era of unimproved road and roadside surfaces that benefited from distributing the load over a wider surface. Problem is that it transmits the load as a large bending moment using the stand as a 2’ lever to the (small) pivot that quickly wears out and sometimes fails just as you apply max load kicking the motor over (not recommended, but you did it just that one time. Right? :wink:).


    You can remove the stand (that won’t happen again... but it was convenient), replace it with a new one (that won’t happen again... for a while), or replace it with a more contemporary and shorter clamp-on aftermarket stand (works well... looks a bit out of place).


    Recently I was awaiting a parts order to complete an interminable rebuild project when I manually swung my side stand. It was a mess. The bore in the stand was worn to an oval and the bolt wallowed in its thread unless the lock-in bolt was tightly torqued, in which case it wobbled a bit less.


    The solution seemed to be to assist the cantilevered bolt by adding support and creating a clevis joint. But first the stand needed repair to create a precision pivot. One option would be to start by purchasing a new stand ($100+). Or restore the existing stand bearing. Note that the described fix requires the later side stand bracket design.


    I found a 3/4” x 5/8” bronze bearing at the local hardware store. Using a (3/4” max, 1/16” steps – self aligns with existing hole) step drill, drill press and vise I re-board the stand, then press fit the bearing (assisted by Loctite retaining compound) into the hole and drilled and reamed the bearing to closely fit the hardened steel bush.


    I then fabricated a 1/8” “Z” bracket aligned with, and matching, the underside of the mounting weldment and bored/reamed it to the pivot bolt just under its head.


    Final installation requires a ¼” gr 5 bolt to attach the bracket to the underside of the bracket. Assemble the and drill a 5/32” tap drill size hole through the weldment and bracket. Tap the weldment (1/4-28). Drill the bracket 1/4”. Screw in 1/4 x1” gr 5+ bolt w/ locking nut on top. Fettling with the 3/8” pivot bolt and lock nut will achieve smooth low effort swing and “down” position with little or no slop. I tapped the bracket because little room on the bracket for a retaining screw hex head and there is a lot more material to grip. A socket head screw threaded into the bracket may work and would be easier to thread.


    It is a bundle of work to make/fit up a one-off unit. If there is sufficient interest I might offer bracket/kit. You will still need to drill and tap for the securing bolt. PM me if interested.

    Photos
    https://1drv.ms/f/s!Ajp0LHBjgmfvp3KOvK5ff-baK10f

    Dave Winship
     
    Tags:
    XTINCT likes this.
  2. Bob Z.

    Bob Z.

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2012
    Interesting design using that new bracket to support the bolt head.
    Well thought out.
     
  3. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    P1020402.JPG P1020403.JPG
    Sorry about the road grime.

    After years of trying to keep my sidestand from getting loose with larger bolts and thrust washers and even a bearing I realized the wear in the pivot was not from putting the sidestand down, it was from the vibration and rough roads while your riding.

    So I made this little plastic job for my stand. It steadies the end of the stand when it's up. I haven't had to rework the pivot for several years now. It also cured a vibration that would come and go at speed. Comnoz
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2018
    mdt-son, chaztuna, robs ss and 2 others like this.
  4. 850commando

    850commando

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2014
    time has marched on; i get of my modern(well reasonably modern 2003) bmw and find that the norton side is such a long way out there i can barely reach the end to retract it.

    has anyone devised a shorter side stand which is easier to reach? it would entail moving the pivot point back a bit, and the bigger issue is the load created when some uses the KS while on the side stand... even though we know you are not to do so...
     
  5. XTINCT

    XTINCT VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Those are both very good ideas.
    For your entertainment. When I was a young buck (40+ years ago).
    I may have been drinking. In my dad's driveway. Total darkness. On the sidestand. Lifted high in the air for a drunken kick. Unbeknownst to me the sidestand bolt chose this moment to fail. My first realization of what had happened was when my helmet and shoulder slammed into the blacktop (macadam?) driveway.
    Surprise !! Lesson learned !!!
     
  6. NortonMKIIA850

    NortonMKIIA850

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2017
    I LOVE the Commando side stand, for the historical reason suggested by the OP – essentially, it means you can park your bike reliably, on soft, uneven or even loose ground, and the angle of lean means it's very unlikely to topple the other way either. The era of imperfect roads and roadside surfaces is still very much with us. The Commando side stand just looks to me how a side stand should, and particularly having had the experience of one of those short, stubby stands on another bike sinking into tarmac softened by hot weather, resulting in a broken clutch lever and (weirdly) rectifier, I hope I never have to use one again! So for me the Commando's side stand is perfect. I'm short in the leg too btw, but I manage ... Sorry if I'm re-hashing here! But I must say, though, that I do like the thinking behind the mods that have been shared.
     
  7. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    The side stand is a bit to far forward for me to reach properly on my commando
    So I bought a zzr1100 Kawasaki side stand complete with the lug and just welded it on the frame at the right angle
    It works perfectly it's easy to reach and it has a double spring
     
  8. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    There is also one other good thing with the stock stand you forgot.
    If you forget to put the sidestand up as I have been known to do, it simply folds out of the way when you turn that direction -instead of throwing you in the ditch....
     
    NortonMKIIA850 likes this.
  9. CanukNortonNut

    CanukNortonNut

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    +1 comnoz I have done that.:oops: much to my embarrassment, at least twice already. And like you said, she didn't kick me off for being a knucklehead.:confused: I make it a habit to always raise my sidestand before I kickstart my bike.
    Cheers,
    Thomas
     
  10. robs ss

    robs ss VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    Jim
    Great idea!. What plastic did you use for that?
    Cheers
    Rob
     
  11. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    It was white, It was a little softer than ABS and harder than Teflon. But I don't remember what it was to tell you the truth.
    I have a big bin full of plastic drops of all sizes and compositions. Some is marked and some isn't, so I may have never known. Comnoz
     
  12. robs ss

    robs ss VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    Okay - thanks. I'll have a go with what I can find.
     
  13. 850commando

    850commando

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2014
    more details, or at least a picture please

    and thanks
     
  14. comnoz

    comnoz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    Dave, it sounds like you may have a nice mod there. Now add something to the rear of the arm to stabilize it and it should last forever. Comnoz
     
  15. NortonMKIIA850

    NortonMKIIA850

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2017
    Not so much forgotten, as not realised – that's never happened to me! So yes, another good thing. Not crowing, I've done plenty of other stupid things ...!
     
  16. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    Ok I'll see what I can do I'm not good at putting pictures on here
     
  17. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    I had never realised the side stand on a commando simply flipped up if it touched down if you forgot to put it up!
    It always looked to me like it could launch you
     
  18. Stephen Hill

    Stephen Hill

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2009
    The side stand does not always flip up if you forget and leave it down.
    A while ago I took my bike off the center stand, turned right out of a parking lot, and turned right again onto a fast rural road. Then the road swung to the left, but the bike wouldn't lean left and would only go straight. 50 mph, straight into a corner. I managed to stop the bike just before it jumped the curb. It was night and the guy behind me wondered where all the sparks came from. I now have a nice flat ground in the bottom of the side stand.

    Stephen Hill
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2018
  19. N0rt0nelectr@

    N0rt0nelectr@ VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Does the side stand spring catch on the head of the bolt?

    John in Texas
     
  20. austinnorton

    austinnorton

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2006
    Yes, contacts bolt head. Mine always has. The parts diagram shows no washers but mine has always had one washer the locking nut and two under the bolt head (one champhered). All three are HD 1/8”. Seems unlikely that no washers were factory installed. Dunno. I have owned th ebike since 1977 and purchased from original owner. I left one washer between the bracket and hardened “spacer pivot”. I did not think the bracket was precise enough to serve as a contact surface for the stand to rub on through its swing. The total height of the Assembly is unchchanged. Spring contact every Time you swing the stand and the potentially nasty outcome from its failure probably warrants proactive periodic replacement i’d guess.

    Dave
     
Loading...