RGM Cam followers - Lifters

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Ditto ref the BelRay Glen.

If anyone wants a few quarts of Redline 20w60 let me know...

(Maybe a hinge collector or similar...?)
 
worntorn said:
When it read 62-65 RC cam you had me kerfuffled :)
If my memory is correct you found most of the Webcams around 55 RC or so?
I was thinking this is why the lifters should be 58 or better as going the other way would be too low for lifter hardness.

Some seem to say that hardness difference is needed, but it doesn't much matter which part is the harder as long as it's there and both parts are hard enough.
So perhaps if the Norton cams were harder, a lower value lifter might work?


Then there is the crowd that says it doesn't matter , use same stellite for both ( Robinson)




Anyway, I have a 64 RC cam 58 RC follower and very bumpy cam in the 1360 and not much of an oil pump.
It will be interesting to see if it lasts!
So far it is just starting to shine up nicely, but still low miles.

Everything is getting BelRay oil from now on, should last forever!

Glen
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I wish I could get a Norton cam at 62 and a follower a little harder. I have not seen a Norton weld up cam that hard. The last batch of Web cams I got were ~ 58 RHC.

I wonder what process Robinson uses to get a 62 RHC cam.
 
Robinson cams and followers are stellite of some sort, but not that hard, IIRC mid fifties RC.
My 1360 setup is from Terry Prince.
His cams and followers are made of 8620 and case hardened to .040 depth.
He believes in maintaining that 5to6RC hardness difference, so the cams are at 64rc+- and followers at 58.

Glen
 
worntorn said:
Robinson cams and followers are stellite of some sort, but not that hard, IIRC mid fifties RC.
My 1360 setup is from Terry Prince.
His cams and followers are made of 8620 and case hardened to .040 depth.
He believes in maintaining that 5to6RC hardness difference, so the cams are at 64rc+- and followers at 58.

Glen
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OK, That makes sense then.
 
Hortons Norton said:
I see Andover has the new 1 piece followers listed.
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Hopefully not the same followers I tested.

I now have carbide faced followers in limited numbers available.
They are only suitable for use on Webcam Stelite camshafts -they are not compatible with case hardened cams.
They have been tested for ~ 300 hours in my spintron with virtually no wear.
They use a hardened chromoly body and weight 20 to 25 grams less than stock.
RGM Cam followers - Lifters
RGM Cam followers - Lifters
 
Hortons Norton said:
Very nice, with and without radius?
Click to expand...


I have special cams being made for the pictured follower. It is a 1.1 inch radius.
This has been the best combination -both for wear and valve train control.

I can also do them flat or up to 5 inch radius for use with the 312 or 312a grind.

I do the carbide facing to order.
 
comnoz said:
Hopefully not the same followers I tested.

I now have carbide faced followers in limited numbers available.
They are only suitable for use on Webcam Stelite camshafts -they are not compatible with case hardened cams.
They have been tested for ~ 300 hours in my spintron with virtually no wear.
They use a hardened chromoly body and weight 20 to 25 grams less than stock.
View attachment 14344 View attachment 14345
Click to expand...

It's strange how a small, one man operation in the wilds of Colorado can come up with the solution to the problem followers when the official suppliers dither and claim the problem is either non-existent, or that they have found a workable solution, which they haven't, while people hunt down second hand followers from years past just to get something that will get the job done properly without destroying their expensive engine rebuild, only to be met with deafening silence by the, well, silent majority. Credit should go to the man.
 
We in the Norton community are blessed to have team Colorado on our side but at least one of the "official" suppliers has also just released new lifters. Andover's news page has new one piece units, no more detachable steelite.
 
the issue is the two partys went down two diffrent paths.AN was working on how to make a follower to work with ALL camshafts while with jims soultion it will only with the hard welded cam. chalk and cheese as you would say.

Fullauto said:
It's strange how a small, one man operation in the wilds of Colorado can come up with the solution to the problem followers when the official suppliers dither and claim the problem is either non-existent, or that they have found a workable solution, which they haven't, while people hunt down second hand followers from years past just to get something that will get the job done properly without destroying their expensive engine rebuild, only to be met with deafening silence by the, well, silent majority. Credit should go to the man.
Click to expand...
 
comnoz said:
I have special cams being made for the pictured follower. It is a 1.1 inch radius.
This has been the best combination -both for wear and valve train control.

I can also do them flat or up to 5 inch radius for use with the 312 or 312a grind.

I do the carbide facing to order.
Click to expand...

Jim, will these carbide faced lifters be a drop in replacement to go with the 312A I bought from you?
 
bill said:
the issue is the two partys went down two diffrent paths.AN was working on how to make a follower to work with ALL camshafts while with jims soultion it will only with the hard welded cam. chalk and cheese as you would say.
Click to expand...

Yes, but one succeeded and one did not.
 
Designing a follower to be used with one known alloy was not that difficult.

A carbide blend that works with the Stellite on a Webcam is not something new.

Applying the hardface to a steel follower body without brazing is the hard part.

The big advantage is a follower without the compromises that would be needed to accommodate several different alloys.

Testing the carbide faced followers with a stock case hardened cam resulted in lobes that smoothly wore away in only a few hours.
 
I wonder if it's even possible to have one cam follower work with all of the different cam materials?
Original Norton didn't have to contend with this. Good that Jim has found cam and followers that will hold up
Admirable that Andover is trying to find a solution for multiple cams. The odds seem stacked against you.
Still, it's better than spending your time in Aston Martin show rooms ( six Astons , 1 Jag and 4 Range Rovers is what SG needed to do work on motorcycles!)

Glen
 
There is another lifter hard surface solution. The lifters below have the hard surface welded directly to the steel body (not brazed) - similar to hard welded cams. Some of these lifters have been running in Nortons for years and I haven't heard of any wear or complaints except for the fact that they are no longer available. The hard surface works well on all types of cams - billet as well as cams with hardwelded lobes.
RGM Cam followers - Lifters


I was told that the SRM camfollower hard surface is stellite #6 hardweld approx 50 HRC - softer than the 56 or 60 type hardwelding that Webcam uses so it is compatible.

They came supplied with a 1.125 radius and could be reshaped down to a .875" radius for wilder cams. The manufacturer of the SRM lifters no longer exists. But someone else is working on producing this shape of lifter again. Weight of the lifter shown above is only 38 grams compared to the 75 gram stock Norton lifter.
 
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Mark Cook's PES company in UK make a similar cam follower to the SRM one but its for the BSA Unit single B50, so he has the capability to make the BSA Twin version as they have the same basic design.
 
kommando said:
Mark Cook's PES company in UK make a similar cam follower to the SRM one but its for the BSA Unit single B50, so he has the capability to make the BSA Twin version as they have the same basic design.
Click to expand...

The SRM followers are a softer Stellite based alloy so they can be used with stock cams. They are a compromise when run on on a Webcam.

The carbide followers I am making are 62-63 RHC
 
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