PartsParadise Indian Roadster Tank

bill said:

I still would AGAIN strongly advise against ANY sealer. It defeats the whole reason of the steel tank. If it leaks have it fixed with a proper weld job. the trouble we have in the US with ethanol fuel is the % is NOT reliable. we are at 10% BUT with the phase separation and it not staying in solution there has been as much as 25% found at some stations pumps. the EPA here has been talking of a hike to 15% so who knows where it will end. like I tell people corn is for eating or drinking NOT as a fuel.

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Windy, A few years ago an investigative reporter in Maryland tracked down ethanol levels of 20-25% at the pump. It turned out that a certain brand was always at the top. 'Gasohol' is subsidized at every point from corn to the pump, including the guys responsible for putting the ethanol into the gasoline, the 'Blenders'. No one ever checked this blender's activity from front to back, in other words," You billed us for blending 100,000 gallons of ethanol, but you shipped only 500,000 gallons of blended product". They got fined for repeated math errors. The reported never found a single example of gas at the pump being low on ethanol. If they get E15... Maybe they ought to be making gas tanks out of stainless.

For steel tanks and work on fiberglass.
http://www.hirschauto.com/prodinfo.asp? ... ation=PINT

Notice the hirsch ad says alcohol 'resistant'. Not alcohol proof. And do you trust what someone says that's trying to sell you something for a huge profit plus how do you know you've installed it correctly? I think it's another conundrum. You pays your money, you takes your chances. Personally I'd be very leery of an unprotected steel tank and ethanol. But I don't know what to do, so I'm sticking with avgas. I've heard there are some stations west of me that have ethanol free gas, but that's about like going to get the avgas only cheaper and what happens if I really want to take a trip, not that it's going to happen.

Really can't figure why someone doesn't make a GRP tank, other than it's probably not sale-able other than for off road.

It is nice to know one is available that is reasonably priced, but I notice he's not advertising in the US any more? Plus I bet my forks would hit it.

Ugh.
Dave
69S

DogT said:

Notice the hirsch ad says alcohol 'resistant'. Not alcohol proof. And do you trust what someone says that's trying to sell you something for a huge profit plus how do you know you've installed it correctly? I think it's another conundrum. You pays your money, you takes your chances. Personally I'd be very leery of an unprotected steel tank and ethanol. But I don't know what to do, so I'm sticking with avgas. I've heard there are some stations west of me that have ethanol free gas, but that's about like going to get the avgas only cheaper and what happens if I really want to take a trip, not that it's going to happen.

Really can't figure why someone doesn't make a GRP tank, other than it's probably not sale-able other than for off road.

It is nice to know one is available that is reasonably priced, but I notice he's not advertising in the US any more? Plus I bet my forks would hit it.

Ugh.
Dave
69S

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Exactly, you takes your chances with Tank sealants. Now, if I've got an old rusty tank with pinholes, and the sealant seals the holes, holds the tank together and ethanol proofs the tank, it would be worth taking the chance, but not with a newly made one imo.

The Avgas topic always made me chuckle. I know things must be different in the USA, but how far do you "Avgas only" guys actually ride. If I had to do that in the UK, any trip would have to be a tour of local airfields! Is Avgas for sale in some Petrol Stations over there?

Ethanol free gas, I'm not 100% sure but I think, correct me if I'm wrong, I read a thread somewhere that none of the Petrol companies in the UK would now "guarantee" that any of their products would be Ethanol free?

DogT said:

Notice the hirsch ad says alcohol 'resistant'. Not alcohol proof. And do you trust what someone says that's trying to sell you something for a huge profit plus how do you know you've installed it correctly? I think it's another conundrum. You pays your money, you takes your chances. Personally I'd be very leery of an unprotected steel tank and ethanol. But I don't know what to do, so I'm sticking with avgas. I've heard there are some stations west of me that have ethanol free gas, but that's about like going to get the avgas only cheaper and what happens if I really want to take a trip, not that it's going to happen.

Really can't figure why someone doesn't make a GRP tank, other than it's probably not sale-able other than for off road.

It is nice to know one is available that is reasonably priced, but I notice he's not advertising in the US any more? Plus I bet my forks would hit it.

Ugh.
Dave
69S

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Ugh, Dave.
I have used and would again the Hirsch product. I put it in my fiberglass tank and I put it in my new used steel tank. It is fantastic and I cannot believe I am the only one here who knows about it. A pint will do 3 to 4 roadster tank easy.

As with any thing like this, preparation is key.

Avgas is not available to everyone. I have tried all the regional airports around me.
Beside, I can get 110 leaded just down the street for around the same price.

The local airport here will sell me BP 110LL in my 5 G plastic jugs. It's about $5.60 or so, and it's guaranteed not to have ethanol in it, the airplanes can't use ethanol. I guess some places won't sell avgas to just anyone that shows up. And buying ethanol free gas at a commercial station, Who's to know, but it's easy enough just to add some water in it and see if the ethanol separates out. But if you're out on the road? Personally I keep my rides to 100 miles or less, so it's not an issue.

Then there's the guy on the forum that's been using ethanol fuel in his fiberglass tank and not having any problems. Who's to know.

I guess we've beat this one to death again.

Dave
69S

DogT said:

I guess we've beat this one to death again.

Dave
69S

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Aye

yes the ethanol does attract water. that is basically what was sold as dry gas if you had some water in a tank of gas.I am not 100% that it is just the ethanol that is all the trouble with the fiberglass tanks. the oil co. wont tell just what all is in this witch's brew they are selling.

I don't drain my tank instead I keep it full so there is less air in it and less temperature swing to cause condensation. another thing to do on raw steel is to use a phosphoric acid wash to help stop any rust.

DogT said:

But doesn't that ethanol attract water and make an unlined tank rust? Or keep it drained?

Dave
69S

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I'm running mine ethanol free and it is a bit of work planning trips but it actually adds some excitement and a bit of an excuse to go out of the way to new places. Here is the site.

http://www.pure-gas.org/

According to the site all the Alaska stations are ethanol free.

Yes, Alaska is still ethanol free. We gotta have some compensation for the short season and some of the most expensive gas in the union!

I found this to be interesting:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NORTON-COMMANDO ... d4&vxp=mtr

I've been doing some surfing regarding ethanol-free fuel in the UK, and apologies if this is old news...

I've read that 'some' super unleaded fuels are ethanol-free (Not Shell or Texaco), except in the South West.
Apparently BP is OK.
Murco fuels are apparently all ethanol-free, but their station finder seems strange, but works with postcodes.

http://www.murco.co.uk/serviceStationMap.htm

I also read that the pump should state the Ethanol content - if it says E0 it should be OK.

Not a definitive answer, but I haven't been looking for all that long :wink:

Bit of an update:

I pressure tested the tank, using the method I was given on the this forum in an earlier thread. Blocked off both tap holes with silicone sealant and plastic caps. Blocked off the filler cap by silicone sealanting a clear perspex cover over the hole. Sealed perfectly, and after 10 minutes of nearly scalding my hands holding the tank under the water in a hot bath (yes I did wait until my wife went out, and have had to pay off my son!) I could not find one leak, not a bubble

I was feeling pretty happy with the results, but after sleeping on it I began to think maybe the lack of leaks might mean I didn't do it right, or maybe not enough pressure, boo.

So, I made myself a cap with some Marine ply, and an old Mountain bike tyre valve see pics. Fitted again with the aid of more silicone sealant. I inflated it carefully as I could using a digital tyre pressure gauge to check after every few strokes. I was aiming for 1-2 psi, but I guess the digital gauge had a lower limit, so I ended up at 3psi, but the whole setup held together. After lots of submersion in the water, again no leaks, so yay, no welding required.





So, I guess the next step will be filling the tank with petrol and confirming no leaks, or is there any more good advice?

Good to see the advert was accurate :lol:

There's a Murco station on Tag Lane in Preston, so no water-absorbing ethanol :wink:

Thanks for sharing your experience - very useful

O yes, This product is "leak proof" ..... Never figured out the "made from toolings bit though" :shock:

Your link is good, I'd never seen that one before. Did you conclude the Ethanol free status from the "composition of ingredients" part on the products description, or does it state somewhere else on the site?

Tag Lane is not too far, so may have to head there with a jerry can when ready

Peter

Jerry can, I haven't heard that since the war.

Maybe it's common there by now.

Dave
69S

Jerry can isnt an unheard of term Id say.

Back to the tank, is it a good idea to fill it with fuel for test?
If you have to braze, would you be happy torching off after this?
Just wondering.

Peter
Rather than use petrol in your new tank for checking for leaks try using Methyated Spirits instead, this is cheaper and not as dangerous as petrol.
It will leak out if there are any holes just as easily as petrol and evaporate quickly.
Also if you do need to line the inside (which I hope you don't),there will no need to remove the petrol residue.
I have used this many times when repairing/finding leaks in fibre glass tanks.
Brett

Old Bloke said:

O yes, This product is "leak proof" ..... Never figured out the "made from toolings bit though" :shock:

Your link is good, I'd never seen that one before. Did you conclude the Ethanol free status from the "composition of ingredients" part on the products description, or does it state somewhere else on the site?

Tag Lane is not too far, so may have to head there with a jerry can when ready

Peter

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The 'made from toolings' probably means it was formed over an actual former, rather than beaten into shape free-hand. I know a guy who does Honda UK's alloy TT racer tanks like this - mallets and an English Wheel. Where demand is greater he has a casting done of the tank to use as a former.

I 'discovered' Murco was ethanol-free from a forum - they clearly don't want to get caught not being 'eco-friendly' by admitting to not using the stuff... perhaps :?:

For the greater audience, jerry can is pretty much the only description for a fuel can in the UK.
I believe it was coined after the desert campaign in dubya dubya two - our petrol cans were formed like modern oil tins, and they split, so the German welded-up cans became highly sought after. Perhaps that's why we tried so hard out there... :roll:

Rosey said:

Peter
Rather than use petrol in your new tank for checking for leaks try using Methyated Spirits instead, this is cheaper and not as dangerous as petrol.
It will leak out if there are any holes just as easily as petrol and evaporate quickly.
Also if you do need to line the inside (which I hope you don't),there will no need to remove the petrol residue.
I have used this many times when repairing/finding leaks in fibre glass tanks.
Brett

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just out of interest where do you get Meths cheaper than petrol! ?

Old Bloke said:

Bit of an update:

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Please tell me how the fillercap you've bought from them fit the tank.
Use kerosene instead of petrol to test the tank, you'll get the same result but with much less danger.
Fritz