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"Goof-proof" anti drain valve sequel (2012)

Discussion in 'Norton Commando Motorcycles (Classic)' started by nortonspeed, Dec 15, 2012.

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  1. Snorton74

    Snorton74

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    That sure looks like the business Foxy. Kinda spendy for sure, but if CNW/Jim have one up their sleeves it probably won't be much cheaper than this one. Cheap work ain't good and good work ain't cheap.
     
  2. nortonspeed

    nortonspeed

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2008
    Nice Foxy, sure looks promising :!:
     
  3. mike996

    mike996

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2006
    "here are 2 things it WILL cause, excessive crankcase pressure forcing the drive side crank seal out and massive amounts of oil forced up to the rings to have to contend with. "

    Well, perhaps I've been lucky then. One would think that my Commando, sitting unused for up to 6 months at a time would blow that seal on a regular basis...but it doesn't. One would also think that if the oil is being forced up past the rings that there would be considerable smoke on that start up...but there isn't. Neither my current 850 or my old 750 ever exhibited any reaction of that sort to wet sumping. Admittedly, that is only two Commandos but it's hard for me to imagine that I had the only two bikes that didn't blow seals after long periods of wetsumping if it was as common as the stories seem to indicate.

    I have to admit I wonder if there are not more stories about blown seals than there are actual occurrences of blown seals. ;)
     
  4. radiofun

    radiofun

    Joined:
    May 15, 2011
    I bought one from Old Brits while purchasing some other parts. Anyone have experience with these?
     
  5. hobot

    hobot

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    Ugh I never bother to drain sump just add some to tank if tool low to run a 30 sec to get tank refilled. Never blew the cranks seal in two Combat nor in current Combat that grit ate its rings up so lost of blow by till head leaked but crank seal still seals. I don't let it idle slow cold either and get it to 1800-2000 rpm soon as it takes easy throttle and more concerned with cam/lifter wear than some oil weepage or a rather rare seal blow out. Still not a bad thing to prevent wet sump sitting still or on the fly, so have at it any way ya can. When I got my 1st Combat it'd tank was empty so small engine shop worker topped off 2 qt's then started up - till 30 sec later at least a qt was puddle on floor from tank over flow. Said guess I got a free oil change in the bargain. Didn't blow seal but leaked 13 places after 30 yr hard life after being the shops sale demo test ride bike.
     
  6. rpatton

    rpatton

    Joined:
    May 17, 2011
    Foxy,
    The price for the AMR modification is $70US plus shipping each way. Did they tell you what the seals are made of? Would it be a deal breaker if it was anything other than brass lapped on brass?

    http://www.amr-of-tucson.com/nortech.html
     
  7. Foxy

    Foxy

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2009
    Foxy,
    The price for the AMR modification is $70US plus shipping each way. Did they tell you what the seals are made of? Would it be a deal breaker if it was anything other than brass lapped on brass?

    http://www.amr-of-tucson.com/nortech.html[/quote]

    Gday rpatton, thanks for the link to AMR showing cost of their mod. In answering your questions, the pingel vale is all billet aluminum and the seals are 1 viton and 2 nylon. I know there are various grades of both but being able to handle petroleum products I believe seals should be up to the job. If not Im thing they can be changed out for better.
    Postage to Australia is approx $60 plus $348 for valve makes it spendy!
     
  8. worntorn

    worntorn

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2006
    Aside from the great expense of the Pingel unit, this just might not be a great place for bling. I'll probably go the other way with the valve(when I do get round to it)
    Seems to me it might be cosmetically better to have a piece of anti-bling there rather than the shiny piece. Here I'm thinking that cosmetically no valve or an invisible valve (amr mod) is ideal, so why not powder coat the brass valve and whatever switch I use satin black?
    That way it will just fade into the woodwork, hopefully at a casual glance just look like a lump in the hose.
    I do respectfully aknowledge the right of others to add bling as desired :D

    Glen
     
  9. rpatton

    rpatton

    Joined:
    May 17, 2011
    Foxy,
    It's the temps that the seals might have to deal with that made me wonder. The ARM deal includes some work on the oil pump but there was a post that mentioned that CNW at one time used the ARM type mod but it didn't always work. Maybe fixing up a ARM check valve yourself is something to look into. According to Fred, the MkIII cover with the checkvalve can be used on the earlier motors, if you can find one for a reasonable price then just do a transplant.

    http://www.oldbritts.com/11_066161.html
     
  10. bill

    bill

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2003
    the MK3 cover is NOT a bolt on job. the oil pump outlet and seal is different and the piston has a history of sticking. when it sticks it will still allow it to wet sump BUT all you need to do is increase the clearance as it seals on the pump outlet and not in the bore.

     
  11. commando6868

    commando6868

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    Nortonspeed,

    I was checking the CNW web site, they don't have the anti drain valve listed. Do you have a photo/price? I guess a call or e-mail to them would find out if they are selling them. I hear they have a simplified wiring harness too, anyone install one yet?

    MF
     
  12. rpatton

    rpatton

    Joined:
    May 17, 2011
    Windy, I see what you mean. From the picture at the bottom of this link, it looks like it uses a wider seal and outlet .
     
  13. nortonspeed

    nortonspeed

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2008
  14. commando6868

    commando6868

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    MF here you go:
    http://www.coloradonortonworks.com/catalog/engine.asp
    http://www.hollandnortonworks.eu/?lang=EN&page=10[/quote]
    Yes, thanks. Time to get the credit card out.



    MF
     
  15. commando6868

    commando6868

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    Yes, thanks. Time to get the credit card out.



    Just checked, they don't sell them anymore.

    MF
     
  16. bill

    bill

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2003
    just maybe that is telling you something about them.

     
  17. aceaceca

    aceaceca

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2004
    I do not run any devices on my 71 Commando and am generally of the belief that it is not a problem. However, it is definitely harder to kick over while "sumped". I actually changed over to modern push button bike because I am older now and need more creature comforts. I swore I would never own a bike that was you did not tickle and kick. Aging sucks. Anyway, if I were to put a device to cope with sumping I think I would use the simple in line ball valve with a buzzer component ala Jay Leno. Alternatively, I have eyed these pumps for some time and thought they would be excellent to mount in the void on the Commando motor that looks like a place for a starter motor. Push a button and whir the oil back to the tank. It would look and sound cool. Take a look and consider this if you a die hard anti sumper.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Electric-Scaven ... SS:US:1123
     
  18. nortonspeed

    nortonspeed

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2008
    Are you kidding? :shock: :mrgreen:
     
  19. rpatton

    rpatton

    Joined:
    May 17, 2011
    I tried something similar. I have one of Jim's sump PCV's. I figured that if I removed the plugs and kicked it over that I could use the valve as a pump to move the oil from the case to the tank. I watched the breather outlet into the tank, no joy. Drat, foiled again Dudley.
     
  20. gtiller

    gtiller VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    @ foxy - did you order the pingel valve in the end?

    Please keep us informed!
     
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