What's happening at Norton? Sale to TVS, massive investment, new bikes...

NPeteN said:
If there's a winner and a loser, it ain't pointless.
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I thought I read that moto gp organizers want the baggers to run at moto gp events. Anybody else read that ?

Harley-Davidson Bagger World Cup series will race at select MotoGP events starting in 2026, featuring race-prepared Harley-Davidson Road Glide motorcycles in a six-round championship.
 
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NPeteN said:
If there's a winner and a loser, it ain't pointless.
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Maybe but it’s still stupid. It’s a big unsophisticated turd, and in some cases it’s almost like NASCAR as the baggage is just cladding on a sport bike with bendy bars!

You can still be a winner, but goddamn, wouldn’t have any self-respect in the morning after riding that!! What do they say about fat chicks and mopeds?
 
TonyA said:
I thought I read that moto gp organizers want the baggers to run at moto gp events. Anybody else read that ?

Harley-Davidson Bagger World Cup series will race at select MotoGP events starting in 2026, featuring race-prepared Harley-Davidson Road Glide motorcycles in a six-round championship.
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Yeah they are all in. Just like the 100k bagger HD Dealers are trying to oversell between 130k and 150 K to some unsuspecting customer that has to have a short run bike.
 
Ducati V4 Pani models start at £24K, while their cheaper V2 models start at £15K, and that's for the base model. I expect the new Norton V4s will be similarly priced. Whether they'll succeed we'll have to wait and see. However, the bulk of their sales will be the 450 twin and future middleweight models. Just as they are for most manufacturers. Triumph have sold over a 100,000 400s since launch for example. IMO Norton will position themselves as a slightly more upmarket Triumph.
 
Bevelheadmhr said:
IMO Norton will position themselves as a slightly more upmarket Triumph.
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Doesn't matter the price of the V4. 20k, 45k, or 65k. It's still a placeholder until Norton TVS brings to market the "other" motorcycles they keep promising. Also, if you think there is an "up" market for Norton, then that makes them compete with BMW, etc., which, as said before, is in direct competition with itself. They would also need to have better components, etc, and TVS is not known for better.

One thing all these manufacturers know is they sell bikes for the market rate at each CC level, given apples to apples, so a lot comes down to marketing, financing, and I hate to say it, but too many people drink the koolaid of these internet "reviews." Even the magazines are now swayed by manufacturers with trips and swag. I went to a manufacturer's event not long ago, and basically, it was hand-holding the whole time. I listened to all the reps repeating the same lines to each person. Isn't that the best(whatever)you have ever seen? This isn't just new, it's Next-level! My favorite was when they kept name-dropping famous people to say what they thought about them. So and so thought this was awesome. They plant phrases that are easy to repeat. It’s a subtle influence to give them the words, and those words have shown up in reviews, unboxings, and ride videos almost verbatim.

Keep referencing Triumph, and you need to add that it was because of Bajaj (mostly) and because of dealer/manufacturer incentives. Right now, dealers in California are still trying to sell 2024MY bikes plus get the 2025s sold, hence the promotions, below list sales. The Speed is a great bike, and for smaller or entry-level riders, you would be wise not to overlook it. Just like the Thruxton R is one of the best bikes they made, and is a solid ride.

As mentioned earlier, the Triumph name carries significantly more weight around the world, and name recognition is crucial to sales. Norton has none of that....right now. Maybe if they can attach more of the TVS to it in the markets they excel at, then maybe so. However, I don't see Norton being a big seller in Brazil etc, either, where small bikes also dominate. Then again, David Hassholf was a platinum-selling artist in Germany, so anything is possible!!
 
City Garage said:
Doesn't matter the price of the V4. 20k, 45k, or 65k. It's still a placeholder until Norton TVS brings to market the "other" motorcycles they keep promising. Also, if you think there is an "up" market for Norton, then that makes them compete with BMW, etc., which, as said before, is in direct competition with itself. They would also need to have better components, etc, and TVS is not known for better.

One thing all these manufacturers know is they sell bikes for the market rate at each CC level, given apples to apples, so a lot comes down to marketing, financing, and I hate to say it, but too many people drink the koolaid of these internet "reviews." Even the magazines are now swayed by manufacturers with trips and swag. I went to a manufacturer's event not long ago, and basically, it was hand-holding the whole time. I listened to all the reps repeating the same lines to each person. Isn't that the best(whatever)you have ever seen? This isn't just new, it's Next-level! My favorite was when they kept name-dropping famous people to say what they thought about them. So and so thought this was awesome. They plant phrases that are easy to repeat. It’s a subtle influence to give them the words, and those words have shown up in reviews, unboxings, and ride videos almost verbatim.

Keep referencing Triumph, and you need to add that it was because of Bajaj (mostly) and because of dealer/manufacturer incentives. Right now, dealers in California are still trying to sell 2024MY bikes plus get the 2025s sold, hence the promotions, below list sales. The Speed is a great bike, and for smaller or entry-level riders, you would be wise not to overlook it. Just like the Thruxton R is one of the best bikes they made, and is a solid ride.

As mentioned earlier, the Triumph name carries significantly more weight around the world, and name recognition is crucial to sales. Norton has none of that....right now. Maybe if they can attach more of the TVS to it in the markets they excel at, then maybe so. However, I don't see Norton being a big seller in Brazil etc, either, where small bikes also dominate. Then again, David Hassholf was a platinum-selling artist in Germany, so anything is possible!!
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Hey, don't dis The Hoff.:p
 
TVS Norton, or modern Norton for that matter, isn’t well known around the world as people here think.
People today recognize Triumph more so because they still use the “Steve McQueen, 007, Baja and desert racing scene, ETC. None of which Norton has.

Remember when Norton used the likes of Keanu Reeves? Or how about John McGuinness??
Yeah, that took them far 😂

Personally, no celebrity is going to sway me to buy a brand just because they endorse it.

One thing TVS Norton sucks at, it’s advertising.
 

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NPeteN said:
I think this statement sums up most of the pessimism.
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Not sure I get the statement really - better components?

TVS’s smaller bikes for the Indian market are engineered down to a price point and as such, components will be of lower quality.

But if we’re talikng about pessimism relating to Solihull future models, incl the V4, does that observation stand?

The component quality of the V4SV is pretty high (hence the high price point). Looks like the new V4 is using quality Brembo’s and semi-active Ohlins etc.
 
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What point would it make for Norton to make economical motorcycles?
Before, everyone kept saying Norton is a luxury or boutique brand.
Making cheaper motorcycles is what TVS is for.

I don’t get why people think Norton is going to offer these economic alternatives. Putting high quality components on a economy priced product makes zero sense. Like putting lipstick on a pig.
 
We may be conflating issues a bit. As I see it, Norton are offering up the new V4 to the premium market in the same way as Ducati offer their V4. Similar/same price range and wearing similar/same suspension and brakes.

I don’t believe for a moment they are trying to compete directly with Ducati or BMW. They will be hoping to grab a slice of the pie sufficient to get them into the ball game, with other models to follow of course.

Lower cost models will follow shortly no doubt, as discussed at length - manufactured in India for the home market and for export. It’s here I guess where they will be looking to generate the volume sales necessary.

A tall order in a difficult market - let’s hope that they can suceed.
 
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Stephen_Spencer said:
Not sure I get the statement really - better components?

TVS’s smaller bikes for the Indian market are engineered down to a price point and as such, components will be of lower quality.

But if we’re talikng about pessimism relating to Solihull future models, incl the V4, does that observation stand?

The component quality of the V4SV is pretty high (hence the high price point). Looks like the new V4 is using quality Brembo’s and semi-active Ohlins etc.
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Dismayed that the Norton name was not bought by a company known for quality motorcycles.
 
NPeteN said:
Dismayed that the Norton name was not bought by a company known for quality motorcycles.
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Thats definitely one opinion Pete. Personally I’d have been dismayed if the Norton name had not been bought at all and consigned to history.

I’m gonna wait and see what quality they produce - just a few weeks until EICMA. If they produce a poor quality machine I’ll be dismayed along with you.

What's happening at Norton? Sale to TVS, massive investment, new bikes...
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
Thats definitely one opinion Pete. Personally I’d have been dismayed if the Norton name had not been bought at all and consigned to history.

I’m gonna wait and see what quality they produce - just a few weeks until EICMA. If they produce a poor quality machine I’ll be dismayed along with you.

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Yep, willing to give them benefit of the doubt. Hopeful for some good news and new motorcycles.
Far easier is it to critique than to create!
 
Funny how people were saying weeks and months ago that Norton would be first releasing the small cc bikes first. Now they changed their tune.

I don’t understand why Norton would even offer a small cc bike when TVS already has that market. Who would ever buy a premium small cc bike? That’s an oxymoron.
 
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