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I'm really interested in this
I've never worked a bit of glass fibre in my life
I'm pretty sure if attempted this I'd have a bit of glass fibre oil tank glued to my hand for the rest of my days!
There's a pretty steep learning curve to it, but it can be figured out, just like anything. The polyester resin in some ways is more magic, as there's a ton of variables to mixing the resin and catalyst. There's none of that with the epoxy.

I have a fatal flaw in overestimating my abilities, and I'm constantly thinking, "How hard can it be?" And then I go and find out it was way harder than I ever thought. But as always, the next project is better, then the next better, etc. Sometimes it gets me into real trouble though.

And really, it's a big mess. It just is. No way around it. Seems the pros (def not me) are good at separating the mess from the project. I have an outside area tented off from my little shop, where I make the dirty, dusty messes, and I live in a rural area. If I was doing this in my suburban garage and had any downwind neighbors, composites would not be a good project.

It's going to be wet and warm few days, so hopefully I'll get this thing done and to the painter by the end of this week. The weather (other than this coming week) has taken a dry turn, so it's time to get this bike back on the road.
 
Update:

This project has found its way to the back burner, no matter how I try. The time I had set aside for completing the tank was promptly taken over by a failed retaining wall behind my house. It was getting a real nice lean to it, and couldn't be ignored anymore. Oh well. We now have a sweet new retaining wall though!

In the back of my mind, I'm pretty sure I was delaying because I was a bit anxious about the post-cure heat cycling. Honestly, in my hubris, I had earlier scanned the post-cure heat cycle, found it to be easily accomplished, and didn't think much more thoroughly of it. Sadly, I should have thought it through much more.When you're curing it in the oven, this heat resistant resin is much like other resins, in that it loses its structural stability. The way it differs is that it is thereafter stable at that temperature, unlike poly resins that will continue to go soft-ish at whatever previously visited temperature. So, I should have made a plug (the original form) out of a heat resistant material, so when I made the mold (with the heat resistant epoxy resin), I could then heat cure the mold on the plug, and then in turn, I could then heat cure the individual component parts inside their molds, and then build the components to a completed tank, which could then be heat cured as a unit to make sure the epoxy resin used in joining was all copacetic. Instead of baby steps, I barged through in my ("how hard can it be?") hard-headed mentality, and was forced to problem solve my way out of a conundrum of my own creation. You know, the usual...

So, the fear was that while baking, the resin would go soft and tank would collapse. I came up with a bunch of hair-brained schemes, but I finally settled on building a wooden box, up tight against the tank's outer surface, and fill it with something to maintain the inner dimensions. To stop the tank from adhering to the wooden box, I coated it in the mold release, and then carefully covered it in aluminum foil panels, thinking the mold release would save me, but if it didn't, I'd rather have glued the tank to foil, rather than glued it to the inside of a wooden box. I'm not smart, but I'm pretty good at being dumb! I drilled holes in the box and ran bolts in, locating the various threaded fittings, so as not to have the tank slump inside the box. The filler cap and filter bung were stopped with corks. I coated the inside with the water soluble mold release, waited for it to dry, and filled the tank with rice.

I'm not sure if anything I did had any bearing at all on the outcome. It's quite possible that I was worried sick about nothing, and I'd like to think I can learn from a close scrape, rather than a Waterloo. Either way, the pine box and rice did their jobs magnificently, if a little stinky, and the tank came out great!

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Here's the pine box, and all its pitch that had run out while hot in the oven. I was more than a little nervous when I saw the goo had run all over.

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But... It came out great. A tiny bit of texture to be sanded off, but it needs a coat of filler anyway, so no biggie. The foil scraped off, the rice poured out, and the mold release washed away in a warm bath. I'll take it! There was a little air bubble at the front face seam that needed to get opened and filled with epoxy, but was easy force the epoxy into the void with a bit of air pressure. The void didn't make it inside the tank, so it was just an aesthetic thing with a bit of a bulge from the expansion of the air void in the heat. Better to heal that minor de-lam now. Easy peasy. With all the things that could/should have gone wrong, I'm feeling pretty good about it.

Gotta do the skim coat of filler and then primer and paint. The best riding weather is slipping away!
 
Got the tank all done. Whew.

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Took some doing to get it over the finish line, including doing some re-wiring, as I really hated the old pull switch for the tail light, and its associated second cable off the brake lever. I finally buckled and got a mini-switch. Don't know why I resisted. Cleaned up a lot under the seat and on the brake lever.

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Very pleased with how it came out, and learned a lot with this epoxy resin. The next one (if) will be made a bit faster, but a LOT lighter. This one came out about twice as heavy as the aluminum tank, but it's definitely made to go the distance, and was not built very efficiently, due to my inexperience with the epoxy. It should get put on the bike over the weekend, and hopefully filled with oil and leak tested at 100mph.
 
More projects slowly getting checked off the list: Yokes, triple trees, whatever you want to call them. I've had the drawing and intentions for these for a half dozen years, but things take a while...

These have the stock Roadholder offset (2-1/4" / 57mm), but use Honda GL1000 shortened forks with Racetech Gold cartridge emulators, with twin Brembo calipers as before. The GL1000 yoke offset is 45mm (if I remember right), so this should sharpen up the steering a bit (cue Al's misinformed diatribe). There have been a couple corners on local roads that really highlight the need for a bit more offset. Thought about going halfway, because there's a lot of really bad pavement, and the stability can be nice as well, but I'm just going to commit to the stock offset and cross fingers.

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9" radius on the manual rotary table is about as much as I ever want to do. Pretty noisy, even pushing against the clamps. I used a roughing end mill so there were small chips and less rattling, but it was a lot of noise.

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Tried a concave radius end mill, but the vibration was insane (and sketchy), so I profiled the edges with a ball end. WAY better results, even though it meant I was going to have to clean up the edges manually.


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The results after tumbling and sanding. Pretty happy. I generally take things up to the finish provided by a maroon scotch-brite pad, so it's always easy to refresh. Works out to about 600# paper.

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Turned the stem leaving .0015 interference for the lower yoke, chucked it in the freezer, put the lower yoke in the oven, and the stem slipped right in. Whew...

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Now to scratch together some time for the install. Might rethink a few things along the way.
 
More projects slowly getting checked off the list: Yokes, triple trees, whatever you want to call them. I've had the drawing and intentions for these for a half dozen years, but things take a while..
Which aluminum alloy did you select for the yokes?

- Knut
 
Which aluminum alloy did you select for the yokes?

- Knut
6061. Very strong, easy to machine, pretty stable without anodization, and I have plenty on hand. If I had wanted to pocket out the yokes more to save weight, maybe 2024 would be appropriate, but I didn't want to spend the time doing the FEA on the pocketing, and I don't have any 2024 on hand. 7075 would have been plenty strong for almost any pocketing I would have dared, but stability would have been affected, and ano would have been required. As is, I dropped 3/4 of a pound, which is plenty for me. Perfect is the enemy of good, and time is already too precious.

I didn't mention the anti-corrosive treatment (Eezox) I put on the 4130 steel stem before it got dropped into the yoke. The previous stem had no treatment at all, and was somehow completely clean of any corrosion, so I'm not too worried about any galvanic corrosion, but it's good to take the easy steps.
 
If I had wanted to pocket out the yokes more to save weight, maybe 2024 would be appropriate, but I didn't want to spend the time doing the FEA on the pocketing, and I don't have any 2024 on hand. 7075 would have been plenty strong for almost any pocketing I would have dared, but stability would have been affected, and ano would have been required.

... I'm not too worried about any galvanic corrosion, but it's good to take the easy steps.
Galvanic corrosion is of no concern unless your headstock runs half full of water. If left dry, only surface corrosion will occur.

If I am not mistaken, Eezox is a weapons oil. It may not protect the surface if left to dry out.

Living near the shore, saline atmospheric corrosion of aluminum is a concern. Both AA2024 and AA7075 are susceptible to serious corrosion in marine atmospheric environments, so they will require anodizing or better surface treatments. i have received hubs out of AA2024 where severe corrosion had happened under powder coating, which peeled. Anodizing will not peel of flake, and it improves protection against corrosion over bare metal, but in a saline environment, the anodizing layer needs sealing to offer adequate protection.

- Knut
 
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Galvanic corrosion is of no concern unless your headstock runs half full of water. If left dry, only surface corrosion will occur.

If I am not mistaken, Eezox is a weapons oil. It may not protect the surface if left to dry out.

Living near the shore, saline corrosion of aluminum is a concern. Both AA2024 and AA7075 are susceptible to serious corrosion in marine atmospheric environments, so they will require anodizing or better surface treatments. i have received hubs out of AA2024 where severe corrosion had happened under powder coating, which peeled. Anodizing will not peel of flake, and it improves protection against corrosion over bare metal, but in a saline environment, the anodizing layer needs sealing to offer adequate protection.

- Knut
I've been using Eezox for a long time. It works very well. The directions for use include wiping off excess after it dries.

Unanodized 6061 will corrode eventually, however, it will not corrode enough for me to ever worry about again. The parts are in full view, will get waxed from time to time, and I'll avoid riding in the ocean.
 
View attachment 120153


The results after tumbling and sanding. Pretty happy. I generally take things up to the finish provided by a maroon scotch-brite pad, so it's always easy to refresh. Works out to about 600# paper.

View attachment 120154

Turned the stem leaving .0015 interference for the lower yoke, chucked it in the freezer, put the lower yoke in the oven, and the stem slipped right in. Whew...

View attachment 120155

Now to scratch together some time for the install. Might rethink a few things along the way.
Just so you know… no-one in the pub / paddock / etc will believe you made them !
 
View attachment 120153


The results after tumbling and sanding. Pretty happy. I generally take things up to the finish provided by a maroon scotch-brite pad, so it's always easy to refresh. Works out to about 600# paper.

View attachment 120154

Turned the stem leaving .0015 interference for the lower yoke, chucked it in the freezer, put the lower yoke in the oven, and the stem slipped right in. Whew...

View attachment 120155

Now to scratch together some time for the install. Might rethink a few things along the way.
Do you tumble them in ceramic beads?
 
Just so you know… no-one in the pub / paddock / etc will believe you made them !
That's ok. I hate standing around, thumbs-in-suspenders, talking about that stuff anyway. My day job involves making things WAY more involved than a few holes in a couple lumps of aluminum:

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Do you tumble them in ceramic beads?
Yes, but most of the final finish was acquired by hand filing, dyna-filing, and hand sanding. The tumbling mostly just removes some of the witness marks and gives me a relatively even finish to start on the hand sanding at 80#.
 
Beautiful work !

The early commando's have a 27 degree headstock angle and the 2-1/4" yoke offset, I believe the trail is somewhere around 108mm. That stock trail number configuration feels fine to me on my early model bike and I don't have a steering damper on the bike and never felt like it needed one. I wouldn't think you would need a steering damper if your amount of trail is similar. Certainly if you are down in the low 90's mm of trail you might need a steering damper to be safe. There are online trail calculators I believe so you can figure it out exactly to see where you are in the fork geometry universe

I use CBR600F4I dampers in my stock forks, which are showa 20mm damper tubes The honda high speed damper valves are not as free flowing as the Racetech ones. In my damper cartridge tube size there are a few valve choices that might work. When I did my modification, I didn't realize that the Suzuki valves in 20mm might be a better choice than the honda valves that came in the dampers that I bought. I saw that race tech made valves to replace the 20mm honda (showa) valves, but they were expensive so I passed on buying them. The ports on the gold valves were big, so I imagine you can get a more instantaneous transition between high and low speed damping. I was thinking of buying a pair of Suzuki 20mm dampers to experiment with those valves which are closer to the Racetech valve shapes and I could get them for a lot less money... I'll post the picture of the 20mm valves below for clarity of what I have said. Sometimes a picture says 1000 words...

I also used the Racetech online spring rate calculator and it indicated that I should buy .95kg/mm springs for my weight. Given that my stock springs were somewhere in the .63kg/mm rate and didn't bottom out, I compromised on their online rate calculator and bought .80kg/mm spring. I tried 4 different springs, including a progressive spring and settled on a spring that was softer than the $150 racetech spring I bought from them. IMO, their calculator must be for actual race bikes because even the .80kg/mm spring was a bit too stiff for my liking for riding on the public roads.

damper valve comparison.jpg
 
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Beautiful work !

The early bikes have a 27 degree headstock angle and the 2-1/4" yoke offset, I believe the trail is somewhere around 108mm. That number is also based on how long the stock fork tubes are, so your trail number might be more or less depending on how your fork tube length difference factors into your calculations. (If I understand your post correctly) That stock trail number configuration feels fine to me on my early model bike and I don't have a steering damper on the bike and never felt like it needed one. I wouldn't think you would need a steering damper if your amount of trail is similar. There are online trail calculators I believe so you can figure it out exactly to see where you are in the fork geometry universe

I use CBR600F4I dampers in my stock forks, which are showa 20mm damper tubes The honda high speed damper valves are not as free flowing as the Racetech ones. In my damper cartridge tube size there are a few valve choices that might work. When I did my modification, I didn't realize that the Suzuki valves in 20mm might be a better choice than the honda valves that came in the dampers that I bought. I saw that race tech made valves to replace the 20mm honda (showa) valves, but they were expensive so I passed on buying them. The ports on the gold valves were big, so I imagine you can get a more instantaneous transition between high and low speed damping. I was thinking of buying a pair of Suzuki 20mm dampers to experiment with those valves which are closer to the Racetech valve shapes and I could get them for a lot less money... I'll post the picture of the 20mm valves below for clarity of what I have said. Sometimes a picture says 1000 words...

I also used the Racetech online spring rate calculator and it indicated that I should buy .95kg/mm springs for my weight. Given that my stock springs were somewhere in the .63kg/mm rate and didn't bottom out, I compromised on their online rate calculator and bought .80kg/mm spring. I tried 4 different springs, including a progressive spring and settled on a spring that was softer than the $150 racetech spring I bought from them. IMO, their calculator must be for actual race bikes because even the .80kg/mm spring was a bit too stiff for my liking for riding on the public roads.

View attachment 120174
Before I built the new yokes, the Racetech emulators were pretty good, but maybe a little faster than the rear shocks (Fox Podiums with external rebound adjustment). I wish Racetechs had some form of external rebound adjustment, but alas. The GL1000 forks are a very good bang for the buck, and use offset rotors for the Brembos' placement on the lowers to clear the spokes. The earlier forks (pre-'78 I think?) are short enough to match the Roadholder length, if 2" are cut off the top of the fork tubes, so ride height/rake/trail should now run all stock, except for the Bridgestone tire I had to buy since Avon's are out of stock in my size (18 x 100/90 iirc). The Avon was the same diameter as the stock 19, and this Bridgestone is a surprising 3/4" smaller diameter difference for the same labeled size. So, two changes that will sharpen the steering. I'll have to relearn some things on this bike! The stock springs (-2") have actually worked out to be just fine. Racetech was trying to get me to spend money on their springs they said were the same rate. I declined.

I installed a steering damper a few years ago. The roads around here are just lightly paved over old logging roads, mostly through the redwood forest, that have a very shallow root system. The roots can take you by surprise and toss you a couple feet if you're not ready for it. The damper has thus far settled things just a bit to feel a little less loosey-goosey when you hit those bumps. If it's a placebo, that's just fine with me. The combo of wider tire, more offset and a damper to combat the pavement bumps were a bit too much every once in a while when it wanted to understeer more than I wanted it to understeer. Didn't happen frequently, but enough to do something about as the consequences are a bummer on these little single lane roads.

Really interesting thread to follow.
Thanks for the images.
Thanks. It's definitely a long and winding journey. Life over the past 5 years has gotten in the way of the amount of time I've been able to spend in the shop doing fun stuff, but that's ok. Plenty of time doing other fun stuff.
 
. I wish Racetechs had some form of external rebound adjustment, but alas. The GL1000 forks are a very good bang for the buck,
I have external low speed damping adjusters on both compression and rebound. I added a base adapter to the damper to fit the commando slider and then drilled the slider fastening banjo bolt down the center to add an adjuster down the center of the bolt. I can close or open the banjo port with the set screw (but that is actually the low speed compression adjuster) The low speed rebound adjuster is on the fork cap and only the cap needed to be turned down and threaded for the norton fork tubes.

The high speed adjustments with shim stack valves are only really adjustable without disassembly by changing oil viscosity. I'm thinking about experimenting with the suzuki valves this season because they look much more free flowing than the honda ones. I wish I knew someone who was an expert in shim stack valves for road bikes. Everything I know, I had to learn by research, with the exception of 50 emails that I shared with Ken Canaga who had done the same modification as I did a few years ahead of me. I'm still using the shim stack set up as they were assembled in the factory for the honda 600F4I. I'd like to experiment with it, but I wish I had someone who is expert with these shim stack valves to guide me on the key things to look for... I still have a lot of questions and I don't find a lot of people who know more than I do.... which just means it's not a widely known subject. (not that I know so much) One month I think I changed fork fluid a dozen times. I got tired of testing and I wasn't ready to start messing with the shim stacks.

here's the best information I could find on understanding this stuff:

 
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