Trouble Starting, needs tickling hot

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swooshdave

swooshdave

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While I didn’t touch the carb settings at all and they use to be perfect I’m now having a problem starting. It needs tickling hot or cold.

My brother suggested the float level needs checking. I never touched them so I’m surprised they could have shifted. They are the Stay Up floats.

Anything else to look for?
 
If this is the bike I think it is, the carbs have been sitting for quite a while. The pilot circuits might be clogged/partly clogged.
 
True, but then in your video, I never saw you let it idle. Does it idle? At what RPM?
 
I am having a similar issue....recently my dual Amals are harder to start when engine warm/hot. Previously I could start pretty much everytime on a single or second kick...using tickle when cold and only needing another tickle if sitting more than about 20 min when hot. Now it takes lots of kicks and tickle after short time length shut downs (like at a gas pump). I find that just kicking while astride the bike is not enough, need to pop up onto CS and give it a better kick while standing beside the bike (gives me a greater/faster swing). I'm going to check the bowl temps to see if they are getting too much heat soak leading to fuel evap issues. Had this happen on my previous setup with single Amal with the bowl getting too hot to touch within 5 minutes of shut down. Solution was to run phenolic gaskets at both front and rear of the manifold. My dual setup I've gone back to a single phenolic at manifold/head flange and rubber o-ring on manifold to carb flanges. Thinking here was that the two manifolds should be better at dissipating heat from their greater surface area than the relatively larger blob of alloy that is the single carb manifold.
 
marshg246 said:
True, but then in your video, I never saw you let it idle. Does it idle? At what RPM?
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that videos get released sometimes weeks after they are shot.

The bike is running fine except for the starting.

I have not put the air filter back on so that is going to have some affect to lean it out until it goes back on.

It will idle under 1k no problem. I have it set around 1100-1200.
 
If you have been using fuel with ethanol in it, alcohol can cause the formation of a white oxide inside the carbs if it is left standing. - Blocked idle circuit. I use methanol fuel and always remove the jet covers after using the bike, to let the fuel evaporate. Then I replace the caps a few days later. When I was racing a two-stroke, I once forgot to loosen the drain screws after using methanol. The next time I used the bike, it went like an absolute blur, then seized at high speed.
 
my 72 T120 and my 68 A65T and friend calvin's 72 A65T have amals ...the bikes all act horsey when starting hot especially when ambient temp goes over 80F-ish and need a bit of tickle to put cooler fuel from tank into carb my understanding is ethanol fuel vaporizes or 'boils' from heat sink when hot bike sits a brief spell...I now go to local station and get big can of non ethanol for bikes and 1939 Farmall F30 tractor that's my experience anyway PS a #78 drill bit for pilot jet hole is required equip for amal bikes especially if using ethanol gas
 
swooshdave said:
I have not put the air filter back on so that is going to have some affect to lean it out until it goes back on.
Click to expand...

This. Needing choke or tickle when hot is a lean condition. Needing a "partial tickle" after 1/2 hr cooldown is normal, but not starting after 5 minutes at the gas pump says something is wrong.

Try cracking the throttle open a bit when kicking hot. It often helps.
 
Mine always need tickling in warmer weather, even after only a few minutes. I'd leave it alone until some cooler weather comes and then see if you need to adjust.
 
swooshdave said:
Keep in mind that videos get released sometimes weeks after they are shot.

The bike is running fine except for the starting.

I have not put the air filter back on so that is going to have some affect to lean it out until it goes back on.

It will idle under 1k no problem. I have it set around 1100-1200.
Click to expand...

Understood.

However, the need for a tickle at anytime means need fuel. Generally, when hot that's not a problem because the entire pilot circuit is full of fuel. Once that drains back into the bowl, then it needs a tickle. You also installed the gantry so you don't know if the slides are lifted the same amount as before at idle. You may simply have the slides open more to get the nice idle and only be partly on the idle circuit. All this assumes that you have no significant air leaks.

Silly question: did you remember to put the manifold crossover tube on?
 
If the weather is cooler, that should lean-off the carburation. If you need to tickle when the bike is hot, it is probably already too lean.
 
swooshdave said:
Keep in mind that videos get released sometimes weeks after they are shot.

The bike is running fine except for the starting.

I have not put the air filter back on so that is going to have some affect to lean it out until it goes back on.

It will idle under 1k no problem. I have it set around 1100-1200.
Click to expand...
BTW, the air filter will not lean it, it will make it richer.
 
marshg246 said:
BTW, the air filter will not lean it, it will make it richer.
Click to expand...

Re-read this, I may have not been clear. I said the air filter is off right now, so it is leaner (more air is going in). Putting the air cleaner back on will richen it a little as less air (more fuel in relation) will go in.
 
marshg246 said:
You also installed the gantry so you don't know if the slides are lifted the same amount as before at idle.
Click to expand...

You will need to clarify that statement, it didn't make any sense to me. Why would the gantry change the location of the slides in order to obtain an idle?

Silly question: did you remember to put the manifold crossover tube on?
Click to expand...

Yes, silly question.

Trouble Starting, needs tickling hot
 
swooshdave said:
You will need to clarify that statement, it didn't make any sense to me. Why would the gantry change the location of the slides in order to obtain an idle?
Click to expand...

The gantry itself would not - I think it's a great improvement.

To me, it's clear that you don't have enough fuel for the air when trying to start. Adjusting the idle higher can mask the problem - whether you have the gantry or original throttle stops.

I'm continuing to say that your symptoms point to a clogged/partly clogged pilot circuit. Or, you have an air leak. Anyway you look at it, needing to tickle means that you need fuel. BTW, the pilot circuit starts near the bottom of the bowl - someone else mentioned that you could have crud there.
 
Your bike is different, even though the carb settings haven't changed. Maybe the new engine is so much tighter than the old that you have less velocity in the piston when you kick it over due to the new higher compression. That leads to less vacuum when the valve opens and less of a gulp of fuel ...

I would do what Maylar said as a remedy. Pick up the throttle bodies about half way... Kick, Vroom... Try it.
 
swooshdave said:
Re-read this, I may have not been clear. I said the air filter is off right now, so it is leaner (more air is going in). Putting the air cleaner back on will richen it a little as less air (more fuel in relation) will go in.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I did miss-read.
 
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