Small Italian bikes

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.
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GRM 450 said:
I
Enjoy it.
regards
Ian”
Ian Falloon perhaps.
Anything was possible,even my first SD came from the factory with twin rib SS con rods,what was on the shelf at the time no doubt.

72Combat said:
any pics?
My Darmah is stock and is a keeper too, These days I modify BMW airheads as they are cheap and provide me with lots of fun.
Daily rider is a 10 year old ST4s, its a bagger as the Americans say, but that 996 motor is a real blast. :D
Any pictures are on a PC over in your neck of the woods along with 13 other motorcycles in storage. (including the 77 SD - 81 SD - 73 GT)
If you went to the City of Cycles bike show around the mid 1990's you would have seen it,I didn't even think to take pictures of it.
As far as Ducati's go my 07 1100S Hypermotard would be the most used,that comes back to the "desmo thing,I am in no doubt a non desmo version of some of the current range would be marketable.
I was down at Frasers a month or so back (should have asked about the 961) the latest Hypermotard is typical,sanitised and water cooled.

 
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So there is no mix up it was Ian Gowanloch.
A mate had a black and gold SS that had an imola cam in the vertical cylinder and the std cam I the front cyl.
Another fellow bought a new 79 Darmah and wanted to open the box himself, the crate was marked 900SD and there was a 750 SS in the crate. He kept the SS.
The small Italians are much fun!
 

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.
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GRM 450 said:
So there is no mix up it was Ian Gowanloch.
A mate had a black and gold SS that had an imola cam in the vertical cylinder and the std cam I the front cyl.
Another fellow bought a new 79 Darmah and wanted to open the box himself, the crate was marked 900SD and there was a 750 SS in the crate. He kept the SS.
The small Italians are much fun!
How could I forget Mr Gowanloch,I was supposed to phone him today and forgot until now. :oops:
 
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A 450 with matching 250 engine AND frame numbers though. ??
With a dodgy '2' in the frame number too, if you read that Trademe ad again... ?


GRM 450 said:
I've had 3 x last model 450 singles ('74) none of which I bought new. Were they crash repairs, or made from left over parts from the factory?
All of them had 250 frames without the gusseting.

GRM 450 said:
I asked a well known Ducati dealer from back then and here is his reply

"hi Graeme,
You have stumbled on another corollary of the eternal mystery.
It has long fascinated me that people write books about Ducatis and make a definitive statement that some model must have a particular part. It never quite worked that way. There was chaos. Also in 1974 there was a lot of industrial trouble in Italy causing great disruption to the production of anything and everything. It would not surprise me that all your bikes were made in one batch and the day they were put together there were only 250 frames on the shelf so that is what they got. There are enough incidents of this type to fill a not particularly small book. The 1973/74 era was rich in this type of uniqueness (that is a nice term for it) and the 1983/84 era totally redefined one-offs. As the great Inspector Clueseau said as he stepped from his Citreon 2CV into the swimming pool into which he had just driven,"It is all part of the rich pageant of life".
Enjoy it.
regards
Ian”

Graeme
 
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I don't think there is such a thing as a matching number bevel?
Engines were stamped and stored, frames the same as I understand.
What was next on the shelf became a bike.
Maybe the very early ones had matching numbers?

My yellow 450 is the best bike I've owned for a smile.

Graeme
 
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That one on TradeMe has matching numbers.
Even if they are for a 250, and the bike is a 450 !?
 
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xbacksideslider said:
Good points Daveh, about IOM and street racing.

As for the later Desmo singles, they are great lookers but . . . . give me a narrow case, every time. I had two coffin tank (wide case) Desmos, a 350 and a 450 and I put tens of thousands of miles on both of them. I also had a 250 Diana that I rode for years as well. I also built and rode a hot rod high compression narrow case 350 with Diana head and chassis.

If I could do it all again, I'd convert another 250 Diana into a high compression 350 with the 1967 Diana cam and chassis/tank/electrics and I'd graft a later Marzochhi disc brake front end onto it. Short rod makes all the difference and the chassis/tank/controls/electrics are simpler/lighter too.
Xback - I also had a narrow case - a 250 Mark 3, and boy was it quick, original spec, never been interfered with. I think that was what you call the Diana in the States? It had flywheel magneto ignition and no rear sets, otherwise almost identical to the Mach 1. I sold it after about 18 months. In my very first street race in the Phoenix Park, Dublin in the early 80s, that little 250 I had carefully rebuilt with a stock motor passed me out on the long main straight on my then stock 450 Desmo. I couldn't believe it! I only had it as a street bike, and I remember it being small, cramped and uncomfortable with the stock footrests and 'bars and that awful seat stuffed with springs.

Dave
 

xbacksideslider

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Yes, Daveh, same bike - Diana and Mark 3. Somehow, with my 250, I fell into some good parts - factory rearsets, clip-ons, Veglia chronometric tach, and the "endurance racer" package of a 4 or 4.5 gallon tank, big 7" headlight, and headlight bracket number plate. Yeah those spring seats were heavy but if I recall correctly, my Commando's seat is a torture rack by comparison.

That batteryless energy transfer magneto was fine except for when the brake light filament burnt out. They had that little switch on the top of the tail light that you switched to restore ignition when the brake light filament burnt out. Otherwise every time you stepped on the rear brake the ignition would cut. Typically, you'd be flying into a corner hot, downshifting, the engine buzzing to the moon on compression braking while you are also on the rear brake hard (since the front brake was just a single leading shoe) and the brake light filament would blow from over voltage and that would instantly kill the ignition . . . . . so then you'd reach back and flip that switch on the tail light to bypass the blown filament.
 
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xbacksideslider said:
Yes, Daveh, same bike - Diana and Mark 3. Somehow, with my 250, I fell into some good parts - factory rearsets, clip-ons, Veglia chronometric tach, and the "endurance racer" package of a 4 or 4.5 gallon tank, big 7" headlight, and headlight bracket number plate. Yeah those spring seats were heavy but if I recall correctly, my Commando's seat is a torture rack by comparison.

That batteryless energy transfer magneto was fine except for when the brake light filament burnt out. They had that little switch on the top of the tail light that you switched to restore ignition when the brake light filament burnt out. Otherwise every time you stepped on the rear brake the ignition would cut. Typically, you'd be flying into a corner hot, downshifting, the engine buzzing to the moon on compression braking while you are also on the rear brake hard (since the front brake was just a single leading shoe) and the brake light filament would blow from over voltage and that would instantly kill the ignition . . . . . so then you'd reach back and flip that switch on the tail light to bypass the blown filament.
Wow, I never knew they had that problem! You were fortunate to acquire a race kit. I bet a genuine kit in good condition would be very sought after now. Quite a few guys who liked scratching on back roads had a lot of fun with the little singles. Good on the road and a great entry level bike that you could race virtually out of the crate. It is a tribute to them that they are often still raced with the stock frames.

Period pic. It came to me with the Veglia tach and I wish I'd kept it when I sold the bike. Note the absence of a battery! I don't think the square slide Dell'Orto carb was stock and I may have acquired that to replace the Amal Concentric it came to me with. Otherwise stock. The front brake wasn't much use but then I never got on with drum brakes.

 

lcrken

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The first motorcycle I owned was a small Italian bike, a Parilla 250 scrambler. I bought it as a basket case and restored it somewhere around 1966. Sorry for the quality of the pics, but they are scans from 47 year old slides.





That was the only Italian bike I owned, up until I bought this Gilera supermono racer in 2000.



After a racing crash, I repainted it in team colors, as it remains today.



I sold the Parilla after a couple years, and didn't have another motorcycle until I bought my Commando PR in 1972. I still have the Gilera, but now that I'm pretty much out of road racing, I think I'll put it up for sale.

Ken
 
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Yamahahaha Deltabox ?
Except that it looks like Gilera had these made especially ??

What is the engine in it ?
Any pics under the skin there ?
 

lcrken

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The chassis was made for Gilera by Bimota. The bike was a factory production racer for the supermono class, and they only made 50 of them. This one is serial number 40. The engine is a 4-stroke, water-cooled, DOHC single of 558 cc. These pictures show some more detail on the engine. I sleeved the engine down to 526 cc so we could race it in the AHRMA Supermono 2 class, and we had some good wins. A couple years ago, AHRMA changed the displacement limit for water cooled engines down to 450 cc, so the bike was no longer legal for the class. It's been sitting in the trailer since.





This is my favorite shot of the bike. This is the AHRMA race at Barber in 2004. The Gilera, number 164, is leading leading our homebuilt Yamaha-powered singles racer, number 119. Two of my friends were on the bikes. My racing days were well past by then. We ended up with the Supermono 2 class championship that year on the homebuilt. It was running a Yamaha SRX-6 engine that I had de-stroked down to 527 cc the get it within the class limits.



Ken
 

xbacksideslider

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Wow, thanks for sharing Ken; what a sweet single that Gilera is. I imagine there was politics in the rule changes.

The Barber pic is great, having both your bikes dicing for the lead, just great.

Reminds me of a regret. I should have bought that MZ Skorpion (Yamaha 600 engine) that I passed on a while back.
 
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Why didn't Supermono have a 500cc capacity limit - does the class still exist ? The politics and backroom deals in motorcycle road racing really shit me. A big turn-off.
 
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Hi Rohan, I too have a passion for the single Ducati, mine is a Dianna Mark 3 narrow case, about 1967. I ride it as often as I can ,in the Kent lanes (UK), I am also building an 860 to be a foil to my Norton. The 250 looks mostly standard but has a flowed inlet so happily revs into grenade territory when I forget to watch the big old Veglia. Its very involving to ride and wears me out ,but I just love the punch and the way it explodes into action. It always draws a crowd (which is handy for push starts!).
 
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