Redundant Control Switch

On my '73 850 I opened up the right hand electrical switch housing to spray some electrical cleaner. The top push button has a white/red stripe wire soldered to it, but the rider's manual states that the pushbutton is not used. I have tried the button with engine running, and it doesn't seem to control anything.
Is that wire soldered there for future use, or should there be any wire attached to the button at all?

I don't remember wire color codes in there but do know there is an excess RH switch not connected to anything unless you use it for your own application. Otherwise ignore it. I was thinking to use it to fire spark plug in muffler for flame thrower, still thinking that way, using a stun gun tiny sparker as ignition source.

singring said:

The top push button has a white/red stripe wire soldered to it, but the rider's manual states that the pushbutton is not used. I have tried the button with engine running, and it doesn't seem to control anything.
Is that wire soldered there for future use, or should there be any wire attached to the button at all?

Click to expand...

The button with the White/Red wire would have operated the ill-fated electric starter that the Norton factory wisely decided not to fit in 1971, so it does nothing.

The same button would have operated the electric starter on the BSA Fury/Triumph Bandit models-which of course never made it into production, but it was eventually used as such on the T160 Trident, so the starter button became a standard feature of the switch unit from '71 which was still fitted to the Triumph twins until they changed to the Norton style 850 MkIII handlebar switch units from the comencement of 1979 model production, the Triumph twins finally getting electric starters in 1981.

L.A.B. said:

singring said:

The top push button has a white/red stripe wire soldered to it, but the rider's manual states that the pushbutton is not used. I have tried the button with engine running, and it doesn't seem to control anything.
Is that wire soldered there for future use, or should there be any wire attached to the button at all?

Click to expand...

The button with the White/Red wire would have operated the ill-fated electric starter that the Norton factory wisely decided not to fit in 1971, so it does nothing.

The same button would have operated the electric starter on the BSA Fury/Triumph Bandit models-which of course never made it into production, but it was eventually used as such on the T160 Trident, so the starter button became a standard feature of the switch unit from '71 which was still fitted to the Triumph twins until they changed to the Norton style 850 MkIII handlebar switch units from the comencement of 1979 model production, the Triumph twins finally getting electric starters in 1981.

Click to expand...

That was the electric start that worked off the timing chest and destroyed engines when they backfired. I read an account of a Norton test rider in Classic bike who managed to convince his higher-ups that version of the electric start was a bad idea.

If you have the stock wiring harness, the button does work, it's just not hooked up to anything. With the ignition on, you'll get -12V at the end of the red/white wire if you press the spare button. I hooked it up to a homemade chain oiler that I made using an Ebay windshield washer pump. You could probably hook it up as a spare horn button, rocket launcher control button, smoke screen generator, etc.

If you don't have it hooked up to anything as useful as these items, you should insulate the end of that red/white wire, since if you inadvertently press the spare button with the ignition on, and the end of the red/white wire touched the frame, it would blow your main (actually only) fuse.

-Eric

Hobot,
You get that flame thrower device from theory to practical application and I'll order the first kit.
Great for tail gaters :shock:
There facial expression would by priceless.
The devil inside of me :lol:
Marshal

Bye the Bye

In the 60s I was a young aircraft engineer under training and my boss was troubled by a persistant tailgater each evening when leaving the Airfield.

We overcame the problem by welding an old diesel injector into his exhaust pipe quite near the outer end and piping it to a Kygas pump and a small tank.

The next time the tailgater came too close my boss gave a couple of quick pumps and neat Avtur (fuel) hit the hot exhaust and wes ejected from the rear in a wall of acrid smoke.

Thanks for bringing this memory back.

L.A.B. said:

singring said:

The top push button has a white/red stripe wire soldered to it, but the rider's manual states that the pushbutton is not used. I have tried the button with engine running, and it doesn't seem to control anything.
Is that wire soldered there for future use, or should there be any wire attached to the button at all?

Click to expand...

The button with the White/Red wire would have operated the ill-fated electric starter that the Norton factory wisely decided not to fit in 1971, so it does nothing.

The same button would have operated the electric starter on the BSA Fury/Triumph Bandit models-which of course never made it into production, but it was eventually used as such on the T160 Trident, so the starter button became a standard feature of the switch unit from '71 which was still fitted to the Triumph twins until they changed to the Norton style 850 MkIII handlebar switch units from the comencement of 1979 model production, the Triumph twins finally getting electric starters in 1981.

Click to expand...

Hi L.A.B.

Is this fact supportable or Norton legend? Oh no, not another Illf8ed (ill-fated) Commando issue.

Flame thrower was best I could come up with for the unused momentary bar switch.
Basic idea is rev up a bit - touch kill button to pass unburned mixture, then toggle the sparker while blipping up. Show cars use propane or other fuels for better flames. Peel was of a tune that she'd givbe 6-8" of blue flame jets beyond megaphone.

Another little nagging device - is oil or rather soap tank that when switched on sprays out when brake applied, in the off camber sharp turns around here.
i"ve still not decided if I'd run for it or not from police. But if they ain't following me very far, then no decision to be made.

illf8ed said:

Is this fact supportable or Norton legend? Oh no, not another Illf8ed (ill-fated) Commando issue.

Click to expand...

Well...we do at least have the written account made by Bob Rowley the factory development tester, (which Eric has already mentioned above) also, I seriously doubt the factory would have gone to all that trouble to fit new timing side engine castings for '71-'72 with strengthening lugs and a large hole in the "magneto" area where previously there hadn't been any need for a hole (at least not since the 20M3 points housing models) and then fit a blanking plate over the unused hole without good reason for doing so?
Coincidentally, the ignition coils were also changed from two 12V items to two 6V coils and ballast resistor at that time-which would be another indication that the factory intended to fit a starter motor.

And an exploded drawing exists-which does appear to show this (Lucas rather than Prestolite) starter motor and its drive mechanism.

ewgoforth said:

that red/white wire

Click to expand...

A minor point, but that wire would normally be white/red (white, with a red tracer) rather than "red/white" (red, with a white tracer) and is marked as such (WR) on the wiring diagrams. White/red also corresponds to the Lucas wire colour coding for a starter solenoid wire.

Btw, I've heard tell that once the white/red wire became a functional thumb commencer, it tends to lower ones IQ and fitness level.

And an exploded drawing exists-which does appear to show this (Lucas rather than Prestolite) starter motor and its drive mechanism.


I wonder why they went with the overly complicated MKIII setup. I like this idea much better. And with modern starter motors, it could be quite good. Someone could do quite good with a mod kit of this design, but reasonably price it. Not 3-4K like the old britts system.