Not so funny oil

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If not for an oil pressure gauge I might be in the same situation.

I was out for a ride on a cool morning and noticed that the oil pressure, which usually would have been around 50psi for that speed/temperature, had dropped to 5-10 or so. I was only two miles from home and gently rode there. The problem was a blown conical seal. It was still in place but it had split and was letting most of the oil back into the cover.

I heartily disagree with those who say a gauge is useless on a Norton and will only needlessly scare you.
 
JimNH said:
If not for an oil pressure gauge I might be in the same situation.

I was out for a ride on a cool morning and noticed that the oil pressure, which usually would have been around 50psi for that speed/temperature, had dropped to 5-10 or so. I was only two miles from home and gently rode there. The problem was a blown conical seal. It was still in place but it had split and was letting most of the oil back into the cover.

I heartily disagree with those who say a gauge is useless on a Norton and will only needlessly scare you.
Click to expand...

I agree,
I had a racebike that was very hard on rod shells for a while due to a poorly designed oil tank which was making air bubbles in the oil. You could always see when new shells where needed by the 20 psi drop in oil pressure. But even with the 1/16th inch rod bearing clearance, the noise increase was not evident unless the piston started hitting the head. Jim
 
Took mine out for first time this year and spent more time looking at the oil pressure gauge than the speedo. It is next to the speedo but i seem to always look at it first and i find it reassuring that all is well.

Starting engine last week after having timing cover off plus oil feed pipe to head and gauge it took long than normal for oil pressure to show. I was expecting this but still was waiting with finger on kill button.

I do feel for you Dave and i would humbly suggest that in future a gauge would give you peace of mind. Mine is old Smiths one so matches the clocks lights up in the dark (many don't) an is in chrome holder to blend in with polished clocks. All bits off Ebay for less than £70.
 
o0norton0o said:
lazyeye6 said:
o0norton0o said:
Personally, I've learned most everything in life by doing it wrong the first time. How my commando has not blown up yet is a mystery since I rebuilt it entirely by myself. (the machinst did the machine work of course) I think I guessed on half the torque values on the crankshaft nuts and connecting rods.... so my explosion is lonnnnnnnng overdue..

The best thing about this incident is that you didn't eat any pavement... I crashed a bike when I was young. I broke my hip socket, broke my clavicle, and had 100 stitches in my back from landing impaled on a cut off sign post... A passerby dressed my wounds or I would have bled to death right there. I still ride my commando in the repaired leather jacket I had on that day complete with blood stained liner...

Glad you're ok...
Click to expand...


Yeah, yeah. Pictures please.
Click to expand...

What exactly do you want to see pictures of? the scars on my ass and back, the honda 750F that I crashed 27 years ago, or the commando I rebuilt that I bought from a friend who couldn't fix it 38 years ago ??
Click to expand...

the jacket!
 
swooshdave said:
Not so funny oil

Not so funny oil


Grandpaul was right. Should have parked it.

Sorry for the big pics. Trying Imgur. Photobucket seems to going down the drain.
Click to expand...

Bummer Dave. Sorry to hear that but glad you weren't thrown off or anything more dramatic. Sounds like a bottom end meltdown due to oil starvation. Do you have a theory that encompasses the bronze filings you saw in your oil? Do you think your oil pump bit the dust and that is where bronze particles were coming from?
 
tpeever said:
Bummer Dave. Sorry to hear that but glad you weren't thrown off or anything more dramatic. Sounds like a bottom end meltdown due to oil starvation. Do you have a theory that encompasses the bronze filings you saw in your oil? Do you think your oil pump bit the dust and that is where bronze particles were coming from?
Click to expand...

My theory is the oil color had nothing to do with it, except that I took the timing cover off and the oil pump washer fell out into the oil pan, not to be found until I drained the pan... after the engine let go.

If I had just ignored the oil everything might have been fine.

While its crappy that I'll need to rebuild the engine, maybe it will be faster when I'm done. :mrgreen:
 
Torontonian said:
Soory D. but it's time to work to get new cases etc. $. :roll:
Click to expand...

Cases won't be a problem nor would getting these fixed, if they are fixable. It's just money, right?
 
Washergate is all well and good (so to speak) and fun to pick on you about, but this motor was living on borrowed time. Once you get it apart, I think your big end shells will tell the story, if there is anything left of them.
So in all fairness, all the missing washer did was to speed up the inevitable. IMH(humble)O

The good of the incident is that is shows people the importance of that little piece of rubber, to pay attention to the details, and maybe to trust your gut.
So, Dave, I guess that makes you kind of a hero....or a martyr.....or a sacrificial lamp. Baaaa :lol: :mrgreen:
 
pete.v said:
Washergate is all well and good (so to speak) and fun to pick on you about, but this motor was living on borrowed time. Once you get it apart, I think your big end shells will tell the story, if there is anything left of them.
So in all fairness, all the missing washer did was to speed up the inevitable. IMH(humble)O

The good of the incident is that is shows people the importance of that little piece of rubber, to pay attention to the details, and maybe to trust your gut.
So, Dave, I guess that makes you kind of a hero....or a martyr.....or a sacrificial lamp. Baaaa :lol: :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

You think there will be anything left of the big end shells to indicate they may have been on the way out? Pretty sure they are no longer with us.
 
You would have heard some serious knocking before the engine "went away", if the big end shells were gone.
 
grandpaul said:
You would have heard some serious knocking before the engine "went away", if the big end shells were gone.
Click to expand...
Comnoz reported that he could spot big ends going away on an oil pressure gauge long before he could hear them.

"
I agree,
I had a racebike that was very hard on rod shells for a while due to a poorly designed oil tank which was making air bubbles in the oil. You could always see when new shells where needed by the 20 psi drop in oil pressure. But even with the 1/16th inch rod bearing clearance, the noise increase was not evident unless the piston started hitting the head. Jim"
 
pete.v said:
Washergate is all well and good (so to speak) and fun to pick on you about, but this motor was living on borrowed time. Once you get it apart, I think your big end shells will tell the story, if there is anything left of them.
So in all fairness, all the missing washer did was to speed up the inevitable. IMH(humble)O

The good of the incident is that is shows people the importance of that little piece of rubber, to pay attention to the details, and maybe to trust your gut.
So, Dave, I guess that makes you kind of a hero....or a martyr.....or a sacrificial lamp. Baaaa :lol: :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

Unless Dave confirmed the bronze looking stuff in the oil was not just air, there is no reason to believe the motor was on borrowed time. As far as anyone has stated here, the original photo (now missing in original post) with bronze looking stuff was air; happens all the time. Unless Swooshdave checked and confirmed it was bronze or aluminum or steel grit, it was a non issue. Keep in mind that Dave stated "the last bits" while draining the oil which is where you would expect the fine air bubbles, not necessarily the metal.

Swooshdave has already stated he pulled the timing cover, dropped the seal, reassembled and grenaded the engine due no oil pressure and that is the sh*ts but these things happen. I have engine cases that I am not going to use if you are interested.
 
When I first saw how the oil was fed to the motor through that faucet washer, I said to myself now that' s dumb. Then when I saw that it might also need to be shimmed for adequate squish, I said to myself now that's even dumber. Now Swoosh has a few choice words of his own.
 
I'm all out of naughty words for now. There will be more as I see the full extent of the damage. Luckily for you sadistic bastards there will be plenty of posts and video of the journey. :mrgreen:
 
Dances with Shrapnel said:
pete.v said:
Washergate is all well and good (so to speak) and fun to pick on you about, but this motor was living on borrowed time. Once you get it apart, I think your big end shells will tell the story, if there is anything left of them.
So in all fairness, all the missing washer did was to speed up the inevitable. IMH(humble)O

The good of the incident is that is shows people the importance of that little piece of rubber, to pay attention to the details, and maybe to trust your gut.
So, Dave, I guess that makes you kind of a hero....or a martyr.....or a sacrificial lamp. Baaaa :lol: :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

Unless Dave confirmed the bronze looking stuff in the oil was not just air, there is no reason to believe the motor was on borrowed time. As far as anyone has stated here, the original photo (now missing in original post) with bronze looking stuff was air; happens all the time. Unless Swooshdave checked and confirmed it was bronze or aluminum or steel grit, it was a non issue. Keep in mind that Dave stated "the last bits" while draining the oil which is where you would expect the fine air bubbles, not necessarily the metal.

Swooshdave has already stated he pulled the timing cover, dropped the seal, reassembled and grenaded the engine due no oil pressure and that is the sh*ts but these things happen. I have engine cases that I am not going to use if you are interested.
Click to expand...

I'll look at the extra cases I have on Friday and see if they are usable. Thank you for the offer!
 
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