New Norton Owner/ 74 commando 850 project

Hey my names Nick, I have recently purchased a 1974 Norton Commando 850 (bowling Ball Blue).. This is my second bike, and I am only 22. My first bike was a Goldwing that I turned into a cafe racer.


I have loved old british bikes ever since I got into motorcycles about 4 years ago. Then one day my neighbor pulled his Norton out of his shed (which for 15 years of knowing him never knew he had it or never mentioned it). It was love at first sight. Within a week I convinced him to sell it to me and it was mine.


I have been working on the Norton for about two months now, rebuilt the front master cylinder, installed single coil conversion and tri-spark ignition, all new gaskets and seals, new oil, clean all the brake lines, and disassembled the carbs and rebuilt them both installed two brand new tires and replaced all the rubber engine mounts. This bike is obviously totally different then my Honda so I am learning every night when I go to work on it. The bike only has 2000 miles on it and was sitting in a shed for 25 years. So it is very rusty and dirty. I am starting to clean up the engine and all polish the chain case cover and all the over covers. It is coming along very well. a couple problems that i ran into and would really appropriate if I can get some help...

where does the warning signal control module go or whatever or what its called because the sticker that was on it you cannot read. It is round cylinder shape with a wiring circling around it holding it inplace with a rod sticking out with a circle on the end which attaches somewhere but i cannot figure out where, as of now i just secured it with zip ties to keep it off the engine...

The engine is running very hot, even upon start up, I cant figure out what the problem would be or how I even go about fixing that becuase I don want to go digging around in the engine before I get some opinion becuase of my lack of knowledge on brit bikes.

And what is everyones recommendation on repainting the tank and covers, I want to keep it as close to original as possibly but the tank is definitely faded along with the stickers on the covers.

I will post pictures next week just want to clean it a little more first

Thanks for all of your help and please bear with me I am used to working on Hondas and trying to learn as much as possible about my Norton, Thank!

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

I lovewhat you've done to that Gold Wing, best looking one I've seen.

This is the place to get all your Norton questions answered. I'm a novice too, but many will be able to help you.
As far as running hot, remember you are dealing with a large AIR cooled engine. It will seem a lot hotter than that Gold Wing.
JD75

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

I wish I could find a reasonably priced commando in a shed somehwere, I envy you. Good luck developing your bike.
When I started to read your post and you mentioned a goldwing cafe racer, I thought' this will be a yawn'. But when I saw the photo I was most impressed, - the bike has so much fun potential. In a similar vein, I read in a magazine the other day where someone made a cafe racer out of a virago, - looking at the photos, I'd never imagined that such a mundane bike had so much potential .

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Thanks JD, yeah I love it, it took me about 2 years to fully finish, took it apart down to the frame and rebuilt it back up, once I rebuilt the carbs and synced them it ran amazing, soo fast. keeps up with any crotch rocket out there. until you hit about 120mph it speed wobbles very scary on that heavy thing. but thanks I hope to get alot of answers. And yeah I assumed it would be alot hotter so hopefully nothing is wrong just needs some time being ran and getting the new fluid though it.

Nick

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Yes, hot is relative.
Are you tuned as in timing? How do the plugs look? Are the pipes bluing?

Ambient temp can have a profound effect on these motors. Although it take a bit to get the oil up to temp, a 90+ degree day will really get the oil loose. Another thing is riding with and against the prevailing wind. Although you will feel more power and top end with the wind, going against the wind helps keep the motor running well.

Different weight oil should be considered. Amsoil has a straight 60 where is just to damn hot to ride or a good 10w 40 where it is cold. 20w 50 is most common.

I road the other day when 95 out. I measured 320 f at the inside of the top fin of the cylinder barrels. This temp was not too hot.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Nick that is one odd ball Goldwing but you pulled it off great! I've ridden with Goldwings and they can out pull Commando's in the opens and to higher speeds, unless race level Norton.

As too the hot engine, one its air cooled so radiates everywhere, but it is Not that sensitive to ambient temps as I"ve monitored head, exhaust and oil temps in 100'F direct sun no air flow and on the fly and it don't get very hot unless given it lots of fuel to burn. So if it really is getting too hot real quick then suspect the spark timing is too adv or retarded. Its possible its set too lean but that don't usually show up until on the fly, not idle or blips in shed. If idled in still air too long, like 10 min. then the oil can get too hot w/o air flow but not the engine itself as norton did get the fin mass pretty good. There is a note on forum recently about not moving the Trispark time plate once the LED comes on or can shift the final timing too much.

We are voyeurs so flash us yours when ya can.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Don't let the Honda to Norton crossover scare you. I started with a cb360, moved on to a 1980 GL1100 Wing and now have the same bike as you. Make sure you have the manual, read lots before diving in. Some mistakes on these bikes can be very expensive.

I like the cafe Wing. I am keeping my fully faired with all the tupperware but am looking for one for my son. He would like to do something like you have done.

Learn to use the search. A lot of the stuff you will need to know is already here. You may get 9 opinions on how to do something but the info is here to be found.

The warning thing you refer to is the assimilator. You can just remove it for now. Chances are, it may not even work. It controls a voltage warning dummy light. I took mine off. I never did try it. I plan to get a solid state one that will indicate under and over voltage status.

Some detailed pics will give the voyeurs here some indications of mods that may have been done.

One thing I would strongly recommend is to disconnect and clean every electrical connection on the bike all the way to the light connectors. It will save you some troubleshooting later. Check under the tank for the big 10 connector block. That should be replaced. It is usually falling apart and the connectors are degraded.

Good Luck. Looking forward to some pics.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Oh ugh AAU could well be giving up the ghost and no easy way to repair or pay for one to replace, with what few remain on vendor shelves. Its worth an exam and clean up and thick STP like oiing to see if gives a brief period of decent stable idle. If you give up on yours I collect them. Discouraging list of things that can all do about the same thing in a Cdo. I get light headed reading the ones that skipped my mind but I've got to keep in mind operating a Cdo. Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most. I had similar happen on past Peel, would start run fine then misfire and stall, but once rev'd seemed fine so began a ride across pasture going easy so mis firing then just quit. Found the problem was shorting out ground strap in the tail bulb mount. Oh yeah Peel had a carb slide piece break off to be inhaled, but didn't bother her idle too much.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

And here i was going for the youngest person in eastern PA restoring a norton! Is part #36 in this photo the one your talking about?
http://www.oldbritts.com/1973_g29.html

as far as the tank and side covers, have you tried cleaning them up and waxing them at all? Mine are in pretty bad shape, and appear to have had a lame respray at some point in time. Just the other night i did a bit of wet sanding with 1500 on the tank then 4 or 5 coats of wax and it actually looks pretty decent from a few few away. Good enough to put on the bike once it's done and refill the wallet. Those can be easily removed so i'm not worrying about them right away.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

thanks for all the responses, and yes its number 36. picture is kind unclear where it actually connects to, and can I actually disconnect it and not worry about it?
and i haven't actually touched the painted yet but I will do that since I spent over $1000 on parts so far and cant really afford a paint job right not. I am in the process of painting the cylinder barrel black and it looks awesome, definitely a huge improvement. I also lowered the idle speed and that seemed to help alot with the temp of the engine obviously. its idling around 1100rpm which seems good, but not sure if that's normal for a norton or not. And does anyone have any idea where i can get the middle "n" of the Norton Sticker on the tank. I need a replacement all the other letters are good its just the lower case n (gray). Thanks, Nick

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

nr325996 said:

thanks for all the responses, and yes its number 36. picture is kind unclear where it actually connects to, and can I actually disconnect it and not worry about it?
and i haven't actually touched the painted yet but I will do that since I spent over $1000 on parts so far and cant really afford a paint job right not. I am in the process of painting the cylinder barrel black and it looks awesome, definitely a huge improvement. I also lowered the idle speed and that seemed to help alot with the temp of the engine obviously. its idling around 1100rpm which seems good, but not sure if that's normal for a norton or not. And does anyone have any idea where i can get the middle "n" of the Norton Sticker on the tank. I need a replacement all the other letters are good its just the lower case n (gray). Thanks, Nick

Click to expand...

i believe on mine it was placed between one of the two bolts from the coil mounting bracket. As for the logo, you can buy them from that same website, www.oldbritts.com i think they're under the fuel tank section. it will be the entire logo, which you could chop up and use or replace the whole thing if easier/it's not under any clear.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Sounds like you have a great project. I have some questions for you. When you say it is running hot, even on start up, what are you seeing? Pipes bluing? Pipes turning red? Something else? You need to get the timing dialed in and then start looking at the carbs. Timing is pretty straight forward with the Tri-Spark but be aware that the timing gauge inside the primary case can be off by a number of degrees. When you put the primary cover on, usually you can shift it around a bit on its pins, a bit of a rocking motion. This shifts the timing indicator in reference to the rotor. It can also have been bent or just installed out of place. Get a degree wheel and go through the process of static timing the bike. Then check to see where the primary cover is in relation to the rotor. I found mine is spot on if I rotate the front down until it stops before tightening it up. Such is the nature of the beast.

After you get the timing spot on, you can start to verify if you have carb issues. I found a tiny air leak at a plug in the pilot circuit on one of my Amals. It caused me all sorts of trouble until I solved it. If the slides are extremely loose in the barrels it will also be hard to get them adjusted properly, but if the bike has 2000 original miles, the carbs are probably in decent shape. Running hot pretty much has to be timing and carburetion in some combination.

Moving on to the paint. What color is the bike? Some of the members here have done a great job in matching original colors. As for finding original paint, sometimes you see cans of Norton touch up paint on Ebay. If you found a can of your color, you could try to have an auto shop match it. Or you can start looking at cars on the street until you find the paint that looks right to your eye and then look up the paint code. Be warned, I found out that it is not acceptable behavior in our society to ask young women for their paint codes while at the service station. I have nearly been maced and arrested for such lewd behavior.

Russ

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

When I first got it....





After a week of clean up and packets of steel wool later... this was taken about a month, without any modifications i did to it besides cleaning


I will take up to date pictures this week, with the mods and new paint on the engine.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

As far as the placement of the spring for the warning light assimilator, make sure it hangs in free space as much as possible. A good way to kill them is if they are hitting the tank or other things under there. They need to be free to boing around on their spring.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

"Very rusty and dirty"

Sorry, but that is a little rusty and dirty. This is what very rusty and dirty looks like!

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

first thing i would invest in would be a new set of handle bars to replace those high riders. ::cringe::

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

Already did that was my first purchase trust me I totally agree.

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

always nice to see im not the only kid with a norton out there 8)

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help

If the tank and sidecover paint is good , just faded , could pay to leave it as is .Its only original once .

Reworking the stripes and getting a good clear coat on it would be the problem , and maybe getting o.e.m. transfers for authenticity .
Thered have to be some about , if your patiant .

Good effort nevertheless , though im partial to the silver barrels . We can pretend theyre aluminium . Gives a diferant aspect to the machine .
And matches the silver pinstripeing . :?

Re: New Norton Owner need technical help





updated photo, rebuilt and painted front master cylinder, news bar, single coil conversion kit, trispark ingnition, two new tires, painted the barrels black, carbs cleaned, new petcocks and hoses, new oil filter, but seems like the return hose to the oil tank is leaking...