New Norton Caf'e Racer

Commando 961 Sport





http://www.nortonmotorcycles.com/news/view.php?id=210

I think it looks great in that red!

I didn't care for that pale yellow however.

Too expensive for this peasant girl however, so I'll have to make do with this instead:

debby said:

I think it looks great in that red!

I didn't care for that pale yellow however.

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It's a different model, Debby (961 Sport)

debby said:

Too expensive for this peasant girl however,

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It's also cheaper than either the SE or the Cafe Racer. The Sport UK OTR price is £11.995 GBP, so US price will probably be less, in the dollar equivalent?

debby said:

I think it looks great in that red!

I didn't care for that pale yellow however.

Too expensive for this peasant girl however, so I'll have to make do with this instead:

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nice - but like the new nortons (and triumphs) a pale comparison to the original

I got an e-mail from South Bay Norton - they said prices start at under $18K.


I agree, it looks great in red

Hi everyone,

I know Stuart and the guys at Norton and have just seen the bikes at the bike show, they look fantastic in the flesh, easily the best put together bike of the show, the quality is in a different league compared with the Ducati sport classics and even the old dreer prototype, which incidentally shares not one component with the new Norton,the lads on the stand were saying how they have had to re-engineer every nut and bolt on the bike to make it viable for production, so the the Dreer comments just sound a bit bitter to me as the lads in the UK have achieved what he couldn't, ie make a few bikes!

The comments on here saying its not a true Norton I just dont understand, if the company is working to the same values as the old norton why isn't it a proper bike? Because it wont leak oil and start on the button? If they turned out bikes that were as 'good' as old Nortons they would be out of business in minutes! I also know that Norton are using UK components where ever possible, the engine for exmple is all made in the UK as are frames etc, surely this alone qualifies them for being a proper Norton, Triumph make frames and engines in the far east with far east components for example and while Triumph make fantastic bikes for the price are they truley British and does it even matter on a £6k bike?

Just give these guys a fair go, they have done what everyone said couldnt be done, they have made a fantastic bike which is a proper Norton and by all accounts its pretty much sold out for next year, so they have done something right!!!!

I too was at Donnington and wanted to be convinced by the "Norton" guys, I wasn't so kept the £1600 deposit for an SE in my pocket. Spoke to the designer at length and despite telling me "he" redesigned the motor he was a bit vauge about some tech questions. I also mentioned the lack of a dealer network, all Commando's until they decide about a dealer network will go back to Donnington to be serviced was what I was told, a 700 mile round trip for me! When I (and others) talked about where to hang the luggage for a long trip we were told that it wasn't that kind of bike and how could we consider putting throw overs on such a classic. There was apparently an unlimited mileage warranty which sounds great but the guy nearly S*it himself when I told him I could easily put 30K (miles) on it in a year if I only used that bike.

I do want it to suceed as like most I'm fed up of the Norton name being a joke, so far I've yet to be convinced that its not a rich guy playing with an expensive train set for the benifit of his rich friends.

All that said I love the look of the red unfaired bike and IF i see some bikes rolling out of the factory on a regular basis and IF they don't F8ck up in the first few weeks I might just have one, at £12K they seem not too expensive for a quality bike (if they are a quality bike)

Until then the original Commando still gets my vote as the bet all round bike of all time!! :lol: :lol:

BTW Commandoman who are you in real life? Do you work for Norton? :lol: Or are you on the committee of the NOC who seem to be trying their best to get up Stuart Garners backside? :roll:

Strong affinity on this site for the racers side of Norton History.
Absolutely necessary to quote as it is the back bone of this bikes lineage.
I still like sitting up right and looking cool. An American arrogance I inherited I guess?
My yellow Roadster lets any male struggling with his masculinity that it's ok to ride a yellow bike.
As for the ladies, there's no shortage of willing riders every time I pull into WaWa for fuel 8)
Shuu !!!
My wifes coming :roll:
Marshal

I like the bike. I wish I could see one in person, but the only dealer in the US is 3000(!) miles away. While it is true that the bike is decidedly more expensive than an equivalent bike, I think - considering the economies of scale - it seems a good value for the size of the company.

Some have compared it to other 'retro' bikes, such as the Ducati Sport Classic, Triumph Thruxton, or Moto Guzzi V7 Cafe Classic, but I think it is more in line with another bike - Moto Guzzi's Cafe Sport of a few years ago. Classic lines, 'naked' cafe look, top-notch chassis. It was less expensive that the Norton (about 8500 GBP when new), but Guzzi is a bigger company, especially now they've been taken in by Piaggio.

I guess I need to repeat this, as it's been a while and I've jaded.

When the first Blue (Dreer) prototype show bike appeared in an internet spy photo just before the NY show, I said to myself, "I WILL have one". As soon as I was able to track down a phone number with someone on the other end (Kenny), I talked to him and his chief engineer for nearly an hour (from my emploer's work phone!) My plan was to buy an 880 right then, and buy a 952 engine as soon as they were available, then swap it out. "No can do" was the reply, totally different animals. I stayed in touch on a regular basis and was soon given bits of info on a regular basis, ahead of the splashy e-mails that went out to those who signed up. I was "this close" to sending them a check for a deposit, but ended up buying my wyfe her 2002 Bonneville instead. I stayed hopefully optimistic over the years, then kept a stiff upper lip when I learned of the sale to Garner.

Still I remained upbeat, but realistic in my expectations. My monetary situation had changed (now self-employed and poor again), so I called Kenny on the off-hand chance that I could scrounge up a few bits & bobs to build a custom "880". Most of you know what happened next, I was in the right place at the right time and came away with the bodywork, pipes, CF primary case & monoshock rear end from that very first Blue prototype bike. I have since built a reasonably nice 880/952 replica using a stock 850 ES lump with modern inverted forks & Clubman rearsets.

Back to the topic.

My upbeat but realistic opinion of the 961 remains on a pretty eve keel, but I've taken to being the "devil's advocate" on the subject, probably because all expectation of ever owning one is now only a dream. I still wish them well, I still like the bikes (for the most part, too "tail happy" with all that space under the seat), but I DON'T like the price AT ALL. They will sell a few bikes to a few really well-to-do guys (celebrities included), and probably make a touring, bobber and cruiser model, none of which I'll ever own.

I appreciate that they are well made, but if they were making them in serious numbers, I think the current eceonomy would sink them. I sincerely hope they have no significant "teething" issues with the new engines, especially in light of the dearth of a dealer network. I understand South Bay is the sole importer/dealer in the U.S. for some time to come.

I also heard from one of thier people that they received the first 2 bikes FOR SHOWS ONLY, NOT FOR SALE; and that the first bikes for sale in the U.S. should be in April 2010.

commandoman said:

Hi everyone,

I know Stuart and the guys at Norton and have just seen the bikes at the bike show, they look fantastic in the flesh, easily the best put together bike of the show, the quality is in a different league compared with the Ducati sport classics and even the old dreer prototype, which incidentally shares not one component with the new Norton,the lads on the stand were saying how they have had to re-engineer every nut and bolt on the bike to make it viable for production, so the the Dreer comments just sound a bit bitter to me as the lads in the UK have achieved what he couldn't, ie make a few bikes!

The comments on here saying its not a true Norton I just dont understand, if the company is working to the same values as the old norton why isn't it a proper bike? Because it wont leak oil and start on the button? If they turned out bikes that were as 'good' as old Nortons they would be out of business in minutes! I also know that Norton are using UK components where ever possible, the engine for exmple is all made in the UK as are frames etc, surely this alone qualifies them for being a proper Norton, Triumph make frames and engines in the far east with far east components for example and while Triumph make fantastic bikes for the price are they truley British and does it even matter on a £6k bike?

Just give these guys a fair go, they have done what everyone said couldnt be done, they have made a fantastic bike which is a proper Norton and by all accounts its pretty much sold out for next year, so they have done something right!!!!

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Just because a bike has a Norton badge on the tank it doesn't mean it's a, as you put it, "proper Norton". If the bike has absolutely nothing in common with a real Commando, then why aren't the new bikes just called "Garners"? I'll tell you why. An attempt to use a name with so much history to give credibility.
As for "working to the same values as the old Norton", are you trying to tell us that the new company has top heavy management, makes short sighted decisions and quality control is non-existent?
Just kidding there but in the end I guess that so many have seen it all before and won't become true believers until the products are out there in the marketplace and working to everybody's satisfaction.
You seem to have some idea that people here are badmouthing Mr Garner and his efforts. I don't recall seeing anything like that in previous posts.
However, real Norton Commandos have, over the last 41 years, EARNED people's respect and admiration. The new bikes will have to do the same. Such respect does not come from buying a name. I think that is the crux of the matter.

I can't pretent to be overly interested in the new bikes, as I'm just in it for the nostalgia, but to chuck in my thoughts regarding branding, it's clearly important to start off with a badge which people recognise.

That said, would Hesketh have sold more bikes if they'd been called Vincents?

B+Bogus said:

...That said, would Hesketh have sold more bikes if they'd been called Vincents?

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Yes.

Hi guys,

I am not an employee just a friend of the guys there, not interesed in sucking up to Garner just want to get across whats going on there.

I know no one is really knocking what the guys there are trying to achieve and you all wish them the best and hope Norton succeeds too!!

I just can't get my head around what they would have to do to be called proper Nortons then?

What would you do if you found yourselves in Garners shoes and found you had a brand like Norton? There is no product there only brand values, so what sort of bike do you sell? A £7000 Bonnie type made in china? Will that be better than a high quality product made in the UK but twice the price?

Interesting......

There is one for sale on Ebay. starts at 15K

Hi

Its is all in the name.
Triumph & Norton survive because there was not a huge gap in production. If like the Indian, brilliant name & bikes, the name is the only link.
To claim any sort of link you must build a copy or modern equivalent. If Vincent is resurrected that is the way they will go, how big the market is & how good your first, stand on its own design is, will dictate whether the company survives. I think this is where Mr Bloor was so brave, modern designs using the original model names to link the bikes to the new Triumph factory was first class. Drives me mad looking for parts on e bay though.
all the best Chris

commandoman said:

the quality is in a different league compared with the Ducati sport classics and even the old dreer prototype, which incidentally shares not one component with the new Norton,the lads on the stand were saying how they have had to re-engineer every nut and bolt on the bike to make it viable for production, so the the Dreer comments just sound a bit bitter to me as the lads in the UK have achieved what he couldn't, ie make a few bikes!

Click to expand...

To me it is still a Dreer. They bought his design and tweaked it so it can be assembled on a production line. That's the only difference I see.

Funny how even though "Norton" says it redesigned the whole thing it still looks pretty much exactly the the Dreer prototypes.

Are you sure you are not an employee? Your two posts since you have joined have both been in this thread mysteriously pushing the legitimacy of the new Norton.

I could really care less about any bike being built past 1983 so this new Norton doesn't even pique my interest. What does get me going is these companies from years past getting the name and the rights to the name bought up. It's like a remake of an old movie and usually the remakes never come close to being as good as the original.

commandoman said:

What would you do if you found yourselves in Garners shoes and found you had a brand like Norton? There is no product there only brand values, so what sort of bike do you sell? A £7000 Bonnie type made in china? Will that be better than a high quality product made in the UK but twice the price?

Interesting......

Click to expand...

I'm sure if that Garner guy designed the bike and named the company anything other than Norton, he would likely get more respect.

Is he wanting to buy the BSA name next?

Until they have been on the road awhile and some miles put on them we won't know, But the fact that Commandoman says there is not one component on it that is the same as Dreer's design tells me if anything goes wrong Garner can't blame anyone but himself. I am really hoping that it goes well for him and the brand becomes once again a true british icon in motorcycles. I also think that saying that nothing is the same is kinda silly, It does look the same as Dreer's design. Maybe he just wants to feel as if he alone brought it back from the dead. LOL LOL. Lets just wait and see guys, P.S. I am going to the motorcycle show tomorrow to see it in the flesh, And also get to meet Mr. Garner If he allows me to I will take a picture of him and the bike for you guys. Take care, Chuck Horton. :lol:

Oh and don't bash Triumph, They are great bikes. I just talked the wife into letting me buy a Thruxton. I have a bunch of friends that ride them and put a hell of alot of miles on them at high speeds. They hold up well. http://www.ba-moto.com/home/