Maney Belt Drive

I emailed Steve yesterday. He still has some belt drive kits left. I assumed since he “retired” that all the parts were gone. It definitely looks like the race parts are no longer available.

If you are thinking about a belt drive now might be the time to jump on it. Considering the RGM is the same price it’s a pretty easy decision. I do like that RGM seems to have addressed a few of the issues since I got mine.

So get in line behind me for your kit.

http://www.stevemaney.com/products.html

Yeah, it would be an easy decision. I would pick the RGM every time.

Might one enquire why?

Matchless said:

Might one enquire why?

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Yeah, @comnoz what don’t you like about the Maney one? I’ve never heard one thing said about them not working and many cases of the RGM having issues. Perhaps a case of many more RGM versions being sold?

Dave what have you found were the problems with the RGM kit? I have one on my 72 and would like to know.

There is nothing wrong with the Maney kit but the RGM kit uses a better type of belt.
The Syncroflex belt is oil proof and lasts longer.

Some of the RGM kits have had problems with the snap ring groove being too close to the end of the splines. This stopped the diaphragm from applying pressure to the plates unless the clutch stack was too high to work well. That is an easy fix if you have a lathe.

What about Jerry Does post showing his RGM belt destroying itself?

https://www.accessnorton.com/NortonCommando/rgm-belt-drive.28050/

Is this a potential problem with the Syncroflex belt - a wire rubbing the pully flange, coming loose and unraveling the belt? Or was it just because it was a Red belt?

comnoz said:

There is nothing wrong with the Maney kit but the RGM kit uses a better type of belt.
The Syncroflex belt is oil proof and lasts longer.

Some of the RGM kits have had problems with the snap ring groove being too close to the end of the splines. This stopped the diaphragm from applying pressure to the plates unless the clutch stack was too high to work well. That is an easy fix if you have a lathe.

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Snap ring groove in the wrong place, button heads on the back that would hit the inner chain case... do we see a trend here?

Seems like a serious QA issues that may or may not be resolved. Yet to hear of anything similar from Maney.

Since the belt will be drive us the Maney belt still an issue?

I respect the hell out of @comnoz so always willing to learn!

I've not had issues with the button heads hitting the case. If it did I would just add some more shims on the shaft.

But there is no question, the RGM kit [like many RGM parts] may need more "fettling". But I will do that when I get double the belt life.

But if you want the best belt, it is going to be the Gates Polychain carbon that comes in the CNW starter kit. Some day I may have to make up some pulleys for that belt with the ratio I prefer for my bike.

We do have to keep in mind that you put more miles on your bike in a day than I do in ten years. Belt life is a lower priority for me.

Is the tooth profile the same on the Maney and the RGM belts? Could you put the Gates Polychain on the Maney pulleys?

If I got the @cNw kit I wouldn't use a cover just so I could look at that beautiful hunk of metal.

swooshdave said:

We do have to keep in mind that you put more miles on your bike in a day than I do in ten years. Belt life is a lower priority for me.

Is the tooth profile the same on the Maney and the RGM belts? Could you put the Gates Polychain on the Maney pulleys?

If I got the @cNw kit I wouldn't use a cover just so I could look at that beautiful hunk of metal.

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No interchange, the RGM and Maney belts use a different tooth profile.

And I can certainly understand how a belt kit that installs easier might be a better option for many people.

Here's a few more belts to add to the mix.
The first photo is of an eBay impulse buy for the lightweight 920 project. I paid $300 US, it's unused, but no bearing and the belt arrived as shown, destroyed from damp storage.
By the time I buy the clutch plates, diaphragm and clutch centre the cost will be getting up there.
I wish I had saved my pennies for a Newby as these must be the lightest setup available, no clutch centre needed and the Newby, although expensive, is complete with clutch.
So not really that expensive and really light.
Maybe someone ( Madass?) will come up with an anodized alloy centre so that we can have a clutch as light in weight as a Newby but easier to pull in as with Commando.
Belt is 32 mm wide.





This is the spare belt for the Newby belt drive on the 650 ss. It's only 26 mm wide.
I seem to recall Bob saying he used this same setup on Commandos. In fact now I recall that I had some concern whether his 4 plate setup would handle the tuned 650ss without slippage. The stock clutch slipped even when run dry.
His answer was that this was the same clutch a/ belt drive haas he had fitted on his 850 race bike.
It does hold but I had to tighten the springs down 4 times from the initial easy pull setting hoped for. Not such an easy clutch now, but still reasonable.



This is the 40 mm wide belt for the 1360.
The outside drives the Alton alternator.
This is also a German made Gates.
It looks like it might break, but the 1360 has given it some extreme testing and no problem to date.

worntorn said:

Maybe someone ( Madass?) will come up with an anodized alloy centre so that we can have a clutch as light in weight as a Newby but easier to pull in as with Commando.

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I don't think the clutch center has anything to do with the pull aside from notching. I don't think the weight is as crucial as it is for the bigger basket.

https://coloradonortonworks.net/cnw-clutch-center.html

comnoz said:

But if you want the best belt, it is going to be the Gates Polychain carbon that comes in the CNW starter kit.

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Just to be sure that people know. I offer a stand alone cNw belt drive kit that uses the Poly Carbon belt (same as for the starter kit). The ratio is virtually the same as stock (chain). Some people, like Comstock, want a different primary ratio and at this time we are not making any other than our stock one.

Another thing worth mentioning is that the front sprocket is made from S7 tool steel rather than aluminum that some other manufacturers use. I have taken a lot of belt drives down and some are showing a surprising amount of wear on the soft aluminum alloy front sprocket, even those that have been anodized. This mostly with belt drives that have used a vented set up where some debris can enter that cavity. A rough or compromised surface on any sprocket can of course lead to premature belt wear

Matt

My brother has a Newby drive on his Commando. I was going to post a picture of him installing a new belt under an exit sign along the interstate but I couldn't find it.

Actually if you install the Atlas clutch cam or reshape the Commando cam then you can get a pretty light clutch pull with the Newby.

Or if you use my hydraulic slave cylinder you can use an 11 or 12mm master and have a light clutch pull.

The Newby clutch does not need as much pushrod travel as a Commando diaphragm does.

swooshdave said:

I don't think the clutch center has anything to do with the pull aside from notching. I don't think the weight is as crucial as it is for the bigger basket.

https://coloradonortonworks.net/cnw-clutch-center.html

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What I meant was, an alloy centre Commando clutch could be a lightweight alternative to the Newby.
It would take an alloy centre with the Commando clutch to come close to the Newby weight.
Then you would have light weight and an easy pull diagphram clutch.
RGM sells an alloy centre, but they are listed as a racing item for short term use only .
I don't think they are annodized.
Madass was considering making one from good alloy and then annodizing.

cNw said:

Just to be sure that people know. I offer a stand alone cNw belt drive kit that uses the Poly Carbon belt (same as for the starter kit). The ratio is virtually the same as stock (chain). Some people, like Comstock, want a different primary ratio and at this time we are not making any other than our stock one.

Another thing worth mentioning is that the front sprocket is made from S7 tool steel rather than alloy that some other manufacturers use. I have taken a lot of belt drives down and some are showing a surprising amount of wear on the soft alloy front sprocket, even those that have been anodized. This mostly with belt drives that have used a vented set up where some debris can enter that cavity. A rough or compromised surface on any sprocket can of course lead to premature belt wear

Matt

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Yeah, I need to replace my crank pulley. The anodized engine pulleys do wear through the anodizing. But mine has been looking pretty ugly for 3 or 4 years now and there is a new pulley on my bench just waiting for some time to install it and the TTI trans that is there with it.

comnoz said:

My brother has a Newby drive on his Commando. I was going to post a picture of him installing a new belt under an exit sign along the interstate but I couldn't find it.

Actually if you install the Atlas clutch cam or reshape the Commando cam then you can get a pretty light clutch pull with the Newby.

Or if you use my hydraulic slave cylinder you can use an 11 or 12mm master and have a light clutch pull.

The Newby clutch does not need as much pushrod travel as a Commando diaphragm does.

Click to expand...

I guess I would already have the Atlas type arm on my 650ss, so no joy there. I have recently switched to a Venhills Featherlight cable and that helped a lot.

cNw said:

Another thing worth mentioning is that the front sprocket is made from S7 tool steel rather than alloy that some other manufacturers use. I have taken a lot of belt drives down and some are showing a surprising amount of wear on the soft alloy front sprocket, even those that have been anodized. This mostly with belt drives that have used a vented set up where some debris can enter that cavity. A rough or compromised surface on any sprocket can of course lead to premature belt wear

Matt

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My assumption was that most of the belt drive suppliers use an off the shelf front sprocket and then add the adapter for the Norton crankshaft. That’s certainly my impression of the RGM one.

The Newby setup is pretty much all made on his machines, other than belt and plates.

Glen