Kick level loose as a goose again & again

Ugh, Just the few times I kicked Trixie off this Sunday in moccasins which didn't hurt, has loosened the *new* lever on as good as new shaft splines. I'd hack sawed wider the gap and nipped up the clamp bolt till almost shearing off the corners but wasted effort. What's left to try short of welding the face seam to grind off when time to remove. Drill through both to put a shear pin through? Grind shaft to a square and weld level hole up and mill to fit square peg? ugh.

Guess its time for me to invent something again and being a Commando, my solution will not be where the symptoms show up at the splines.

I'd suggest an Indy style electric hand starter!

I tease thee not on spanking sports bikes and hand starting 10.5 CR 920 by hick hobot way someday. A hand grip on kick level would be another rub to flaunt the rest of the world so thanx for another insight to steal. But its not Norton way so can't/won't apply to '72 Trixie.

I have been thinking of installing the kick lever and drilling holes around the perimeter for bolts/pins. Also a tapped center hole for a bolt and large washer to prevent slip off. The trick setup would be pins welded to the washer held in place by the center bolt.

All it takes to fix it is 1 good 3/8 fine thread ARP 12 point black oxide bolt. Tighten it like you mean it. It will handle 50 ft lbs and hold it. Has kept mine from coming loose for years. Jim

Get rid of the splines along the clamping slot

bwolfie said:

I'd suggest an Indy style electric hand starter!

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I'm sure they can keep it on your support vehicle for when you want to go beyond 5 miles or so. You do you have a "Follow Me" sign on you mud flap, don't you?

After my Yamaha failed me again last night, (failing charging system and gelcell battery (2nd one))(the fix is on the way) a chase vehicle is starting to look like a viable idea. Luckily it wouldn't leave my garage so the chase vehicle was unnecessary. At the rate Hobot modifies things, what could be concidered out of the question. Percussion start is another good idea.

Hi

Get a longer bolt amd make sure it can thread right through the kick lever so that their is enough to put a locking nut on the end of the bolt, tighten the bolt up nomaly then thighten the lock nut then you shouldn't have any more problems with it coming loose.

Ashley

All it takes to fix it is 1 good 3/8 fine thread ARP 12 point black oxide bolt. Tighten it like you mean it. It will handle 50 ft lbs and hold it. Has kept mine from coming loose for years. Jim

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Dear Sirs: quips like above just make me want to slap ya silly Damit, I'm no newbie now and long ago put grade 8 with back up nut on with widened gap and a couple the spines near it removed, dam baby stuff not up to Norton bad leverage and Combat compression. I've sheared off both nut corners and even bolts plug wrench jaws and ratchets in case ya think I'm being too wuzzy to 'mean' it. Bolt heads get trimmed to be trapped at rear and to seat flat.

No sirs, its time to get serious and simple. Two woodruff keys/channels, square peg-hole fit, JBWeld that needs hi heat to soften to remove, bore tape the interface for screws like I did rear sprocket ring...

If anyone mentions locktite I'll ride over with loose lever in hand and bonk em,
then roll start out of there.

Peel is my non Norton Commando anything goes lark to design and work on, Trixie is my real Norton test if I'm man enough to handle it, which I ain't yet attained to my satisfaction, ugh. Some Norton features were deadly to destructive so feel no guilt to modify as long as its still a modified Norton item.
Nothing damaged yet but not riding yet either so time to decide before new parts needed - again.

Hobot ,my MK 111 kicker hangs loose on the splines cause I've given up too. Hacksawed ,longer bolt . Bought a wreck a few years back and yes the P.O. had WELDED it to the splines. Next step.. put it inside a glass pyramid ringed with quartz crystals for say a month or so but only after the full moon starts to wane.

File/grind spline shaft 2/3 flat...
Install this:

Spoken in "Hobat-enese" :

"Ya'll jus shelf yer cranium process for a min and perpetuate a cognitive spark."

Interpreted: "I'll try and not insult ya with my idea, it's just a thought."

Hobot ,my MK 111 kicker hangs loose on the splines cause I've given up too. Hacksawed ,longer bolt . Bought a wreck a few years back and yes the P.O. had WELDED it to the splines. Next step.. put it inside a glass pyramid ringed with quartz crystals for say a month or so but only after the full moon starts to wane.

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Ah so Toro- at some point we have to come to the realization no mechanical man on Earth can over come the loose dangle - after tight fitting that is kicked on. I accept that but not when it boogers up the splines so bad its a freaking terror to get off, ugh.

Skyguy's shaved bolt is over my head to see how applies other than taking out some thread meat to clamp- [explain fast to stop my next experiment, as somehow it also inspired me...

What if, a drill was bored into the seam in say 3-5 areas, or rounded groove milled, enough a ball bearing or 3 could be dropped in to jam the rotation and then a cap bolt and washer to retain them, then the decorative clamp bolt put in for show? I've had way to much experience with blacksmith welded woodruff keys in Norton and my mowers, and we Now Know ya can't nail the think down w/o a wobble, so at least might allow kick torque tolerance to start yet when the time comes, and it will, able to remove kicker by a wrench and a hand tug, not levers and staining air blue with bad expliticives [sp].

You still don't need to modify anything. The problem is the bolt stretchs after you kick it a few times. Even a grade 8 will not hold for long. If your kickstart lever is all wallered out from being loose then you may have to find a replacement. Then pick up a 180,000 PSI bolt from here and they will stay tight. Yes you have to buy a pack of 5 and they are expensive but for some applications they are worth it.

http://issuu.com/arpbolts/docs/catalog2 ... ipBtn=true

around page 82, Jim

LOL to OMG! cosmoz, if it takes even you to buy packs of special bolts just to be able to take the dang kicker off some day, it ain't good enough for my lazy ass. I did need your assurance it wasn't just me lacking skills or good parts to secure it.

I will solve it once and for all same as Roadholders and isolastic limitations or bust.
Even w/o writings - I get the brain waves of those putting attention on this so can't really claim ideas originate with me, but eventually end up manifesting here.
One half is robust grip geometry, the other half is relieving the loads.
Neither will involve any ways so far mentioned and simple and slick as .... Your remarks have pissed me off so much I'll have energy to work off by jerking the guts out of Trixie's fine rebuilt gear box just before she is ready to ride after 3 yr stress to recover her rod bolt blow up. I already know if I don't pull off kicker now I'll be suffering worse soon enough again.

Btw I taught Zint of Lindskogs to be competent in all Norton cranks issues and he the issues surrounding fasteners to Nth degree to me as regards upgraded crank bolts, even APR could not supply em w/o more mods to crank. Ask Zint for a long conversation to follow. In the end of my evolution - an almost factory Norton Commando may be the most desired long term best handling most comfy easy to maintain motorcycle known to man. Then there's the no holds barred one.
Then I die.

This is ( partly ) because youre not suposed to KICK it .

' Kick Start ' is a misnomer . ( or for multis and japers)

THE Lever is used to position the pistons just at T.D.C.
(or whatever)
THEN the clutch is used to free the lever and position it at the top of its travel , ENGAGED .

Sidestand down you'll tear the mount off , or bugger the fit , as per ' Foot Crank '

( Thats the problem with CARS these days ! Theres nowhere to put the CRANK HANDLE ! :shock: )

Now where was I ?

The CONTRAPTION is SET ! :mrgreen:

Throwing the motorcycle a little to ones right , Right foot on lever , Knee BENT ! one throws oneself
Upward till the Right Leg is fully extended and STRAIGHT , and the lever Swings Through under your
full weight for THREE Cylinders of Compression . Just .

Or catapults you over the bars ( just kidding ) .

Haveing the FOLDING LEVER angled forward ( just ) of square is essential . AND free of slop .
put in a shim or close the gap , if theres any ' wobble ' , the lever should ROTATE . ONLY .
Not Wiggle .( like one of those cheap Japanese things . )

' Blueprint ' here by dressing / removing all burrs , and ARC welding the heel where it butts , if nesesary .

Then Grinding the weld to give a angle of say 2 to 3 degree forward sweep.this saves the foot slipping off and barking the shin on the shaft .

The same attention should be givin to the cleanliness and fit of the Lever to the Splines . A ( Copper) mallet / Vise etc being used to adjust the fit to Close and Parrallel. i.e. remove any ' twist ' at the botom of the shaft fitting ( missalignment ) .

Wrapping the parts in a damp cloth when welding , other than the immediate working area will avoid splatter and most discolouration .

I always considered the Lever on the I.O.M. P.R. bikes a good deal more sensible , the footrests nearly at seat hight !
Unfortuanately these will foul Std. pipes .

Ok Matt critique my technique, keeping in mind I had camshaft/new lifter surfaces to initially run in on Combat 10 CR- .040" over bore on as solid firm attached as good as new lever and shaft splines -fine as it gets factory fit... and Comstock telling us how he'd ruined an engine before it started by turning it too many times before trying to start... I have prior hand started Trixie and Ms Peel w/o injury to my skinny Ichabod frame. Tach wasn't indicating so I guesstimate 4500-5000 rpm rev reached. It idled as low as my '38 JD tractor 2-300 rpm for the few rpm I allowed it before kill button touch.

Two-just 2 'kicks' to run because I was afraid we'd flooded it by stuck RH tickler, silly me. *Kicker was found damaging wiggly loose*. I was up and down all last pm-am dreaming all sorts of ways to nail it down and awoke today with a new plan that won't require touching-removing the lay shaft. Will report back in few days if works as dreamed.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmiZ0QI18ks&feature=player_embedded[/video]

bwolfie said:

After my Yamaha failed me again last night, (failing charging system and gelcell battery (2nd one))(the fix is on the way)

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and to think everyone bad mouthed lucas electrics. so is your fix some lucas parts? :mrgreen:

No Lucas parts. The Yamaha has a 2 wire Brushed alternator with a bunch of other usless failing components. Upgrading to a 3 wire stator and rotor off of a mid 80's honda. And a solid state regulator/rectifier. No more brushes, and a higher output. It's a common problem on the XS650.