IS THIS A GOOD IDEA

KiwiShane

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It probably can't be any worse than the great War on Drugs that started in the 1960s and continues today. Drug use and deaths have vastly increased in that time. Clearly does not work. Just results in record numbers of people in prison, which is the world's best training school for hardened criminals.
Clearly the reason its not working ...is because some of the powers that b are in the pockets of the cartels and or a foreign adversary......"truth be known".
Fentanyl is white death for many that indulge it also ends the lives of our naive young
 

Fast Eddie

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I think boredom is a huge factor.

We are animals at the end of the day.

Ever seen how mental an under exercised young dog gets? And how quickly it happens?

We’re no freakin different.

I firmly believe that this incessant push for and ever safer, more sterile, more mollycoddled, risk free, trigger free life has a DIRECT opposite reaction, especially on the young.

Plus… So much is illegal / pressured against / frowned upon these days. If you constantly feel like you're breaking rules or taboos at every turn (especially when there seems to be little or no consequence for doing so) then what’s the big deal in breaking ‘just’ another one with drugs?

So, in short, my theory is the well intended societal pressures are having a very bad unintended consequence of driving young people in the direction of drugs.
 
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concours

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Well said.

For 40 years I've said: (to people who don't like the idea of dirt bikes) "Kids have LOTS of energy. They WILL find something to do. Would you rather they be doing drugs & stealing your car? Or blasting around on dirt bikes?"
 

baz

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I read somewhere that the Victorians had a better understanding/handle on drug taking when it was legal
Than we have today!
No idea if that's true?
 

NPeteN

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No one takes ONLY fentanyl on purpose.
It's mixed with heroine in extremely small quantities to enhance the narcotic effect.

When the two are mixed incorrectly the results can be deadly.
 

grandpaul

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What lax laws? The US has the world's highest percentage of its population in prison, about half of them for drugs charges. Clearly no lax laws, penalties or enforcement there, overall. Yet the use of drugs and resulting deaths continue to increase. Clearly, locking people up for drugs at a world record rate does not work.
That's false, I believe.

Show me the U.S. prison population percentages, based on crime committed.

Drugs are not in the top 10 on any graph I can find.
 

grandpaul

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I think boredom is a huge factor.

We are animals at the end of the day.

Ever seen how mental an under exercised young dog gets? And how quickly it happens?

We’re no freakin different.

I firmly believe that this incessant push for and ever safer, more sterile, more mollycoddled, risk free, trigger free life has a DIRECT opposite reaction, especially on the young.

Plus… So much is illegal / pressured against / frowned upon these days. If you constantly feel like you're breaking rules or taboos at every turn (especially when there seems to be little or no consequence for doing so) then what’s the big deal in breaking ‘just’ another one with drugs?

So, in short, my theory is the well intended societal pressures are having a very bad unintended consequence of driving young people in the direction of drugs.
No, human minds do NOT work the same as dogs (in that respect).

There are MANY factors that trigger drug use in humans.

As to "unexercised" young people, the negative results of lack of exercise is shaped by their entire surroundings - media, technology, habitat, parenting, schooling, peers, etc, etc, etc.

Same goes for obesity, and any number of maladies we see rampant in the U.S. and many other countries.

Take your family to a beautiful DESERTED island with plenty of fish, game and edible natural produce, and NONE of them will become obese, drug addicted, or any other typical first-world problem. EVEN WITHOUT EXERCISE.
 

Fast Eddie

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No, human minds do NOT work the same as dogs (in that respect).

There are MANY factors that trigger drug use in humans.

As to "unexercised" young people, the negative results of lack of exercise is shaped by their entire surroundings - media, technology, habitat, parenting, schooling, peers, etc, etc, etc.

Same goes for obesity, and any number of maladies we see rampant in the U.S. and many other countries.

Take your family to a beautiful DESERTED island with plenty of fish, game and edible natural produce, and NONE of them will become obese, drug addicted, or any other typical first-world problem. EVEN WITHOUT EXERCISE.
Exercise doesn’t have to mean gym membership GP !

Living on your desert island would give plenty of exercise.

Exercise in the context I meant is simply living and moving and burning off some energy.

Getting outside, working on the farm, riding motorbikes, whatever floats yer boat !

If you don’t do stuff that stimulates, and tires out the mind and body, there’ll be a negative consequence. That’s the bit that’s the same for dogs and humans IMO.

And I’m not saying it’s the only cause, but that it’s a big factor.
 
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marshg246

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A big problem with things like this is grouping. Last week in my area there were Fentanyl deaths in multiple high school bathrooms where teenaged boys took one pill. There were also three saved by Naloxone last week. Heroin is bad for many reasons, but one shot does not kill. Cocaine can be bad as well, but one line or reasonable recreational use does not kill.

I thought at first it was a joke. Make it legal so you could much more quickly legally kill yourself and once those who wanted to died from overdoses were gone so would be the problem!
 

NPeteN

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A big problem with things like this is grouping. Last week in my area there were Fentanyl deaths in multiple high school bathrooms where teenaged boys took one pill. There were also three saved by Naloxone last week. Heroin is bad for many reasons, but one shot does not kill. Cocaine can be bad as well, but one line or reasonable recreational use does not kill.

I thought at first it was a joke. Make it legal so you could much more quickly legally kill yourself and once those who wanted to died from overdoses were gone so would be the problem!
Many drugs (typically opioids) are cut with fentanyl by dealers. This will kill you if the percentage is too high. Same goes for cocaine, pills, etc...
Rarely is some one overdosing on purpose.

You can test your drugs at centers to avoid accidentally injecting fentanyl. You can be revived there as well. You can pinpoint and eliminate the source of fentanyl laced narcotics if you know where they come from.
 

marshg246

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Many drugs (typically opioids) are cut with fentanyl by dealers. This will kill you if the percentage is too high. Same goes for cocaine, pills, etc...
Rarely is some one overdosing on purpose.

You can test your drugs at centers to avoid accidentally injecting fentanyl. You can be revived there as well. You can pinpoint and eliminate the source of fentanyl laced narcotics if you know where they come from.
Yes, I should have specified clean heroin or clean cocaine - of course, if cut you probably don't know. The kids dying near me right now are not using heroin or cocaine - it's Fentanyl pills. Of course, one clean Fentanyl pill shouldn't kill either.
 

NPeteN

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Yes, I should have specified clean heroin or clean cocaine - of course, if cut you probably don't know. The kids dying near me right now are not using heroin or cocaine - it's Fentanyl pills. Of course, one clean Fentanyl pill shouldn't kill either.
Never heard of fentanyl pills, are these pills laced with fentanyl or a pharma product? Bad mix with high schoolers. Do you have an article about it? Bad pills are scary.
 

marshg246

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Never heard of fentanyl pills, are these pills laced with fentanyl or a pharma product? Bad mix with high schoolers. Do you have an article about it? Bad pills are scary.
Fentanyl is a prescription drug: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/drugs/fentanyl?source=bing_drugs

Tainted/Fake Fentanyl is coming to the US and it kills. There are LOTs of articles about it, here's the first my search returned: https://news.yahoo.com/one-pill-kill-osu-working-045900427.html

Here's a story about Montgomery County, MD. A relatively small, wealthy county: https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/...rdoses-reported-in-montgomery-county/3263830/ kids dying or nearly so in schools.

Grouping even clean Fentanyl with clean heroin or clean cocaine is stupid and dangerous IMHO. Cocaine and Heroin are relatively hard to get. Many pharmacies and hospitals have clean Fentanyl in stock. Taking one pill should be OK, but take two and you might kiss your ass goodbye!
 
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That's false, I believe.

Show me the U.S. prison population percentages, based on crime committed.

Drugs are not in the top 10 on any graph I can find.d i

Read it and weep https://www.bop.gov/about/statistics/statistics_inmate_offenses.jsp

According to the Bureau of Prisons, 45 percent are in prison for drugs,which is close enough to half for me.
That's double the next category, which is weapons offences, and four and five and six times the rate for common offences like immigration, sex crimes and burglary and so on.
Drugs are big business for the prisons industry.
 
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Fentanyl is a terrible terrible problem. But all the history, statistics and research show that tougher laws and prison sentences will not fix it. It requires more innovative thinking than the traditional knee-jerk "get tough" reaction beloved of politicians because it wins them votes, but does not solve the problem.

One problem with "getting tough on crime" is the mistaken assumption that criminals make a rational choice before they commit a crime, and weigh up the risk of lengthy prison terms etc against the act they are about to perform. Research shows they don't do this. They make an emotional decision based on many factors, including addiction, poverty, peer pressure, confused drug-addled thinking, egotistical belief they won't get caught etc etc. Rational decision making has nothing to do with it. So longer prison sentences etc don't enter the equation. The history, statistics and research bear this out over and over again with all kinds of crime all around the world.

I think it was Einstein who supposedly said that doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. Describes the War on Drugs to a T, after 60 years of doing the same old same old over and over and the problem continues to get worse.
 

KiwiShane

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A big problem with things like this is grouping. Last week in my area there were Fentanyl deaths in multiple high school bathrooms where teenaged boys took one pill. There were also three saved by Naloxone last week. Heroin is bad for many reasons, but one shot does not kill. Cocaine can be bad as well, but one line or reasonable recreational use does not kill.

I thought at first it was a joke. Make it legal so you could much more quickly legally kill yourself and once those who wanted to died from overdoses were gone so would be the problem!
I am unclear what you meant in your last paragraph....but to be told your child has died at school from a drug overdose would be devastating.
 

KiwiShane

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When you see all of the big pharma sponsored news out lets etc peddling this company's weirs ...its of little wonder why the population potentially are poisoning themselves..when in reality you don't need them all
Something brought to my attention during the advertised recient flue a friend that owned a couple of chemist shops said most of the supply chain shortages of pain killers etc all were manufactured from china and their underground labs despite what we have been told are flat out producing their own variant of fentanyl you know the good stuff ?

 

KiwiShane

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Oh and they even make the cure ...
According to a report from the SFDA, only 22kg of Naloxone was made in China in 2005, generating sales of 1.25 billion RMB, or $156m USD.21/02/2007
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https://www.biospace.com › releases

China Aoxing Pharmaceutical Corp. Announces Product Launch Of ...

 
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