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Hot and cold starting...

Discussion in 'Norton Motorcycles (Modern)' started by iwilson, Oct 1, 2017.

  1. trevorpacker

    trevorpacker

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2012

    It is possible on some 961’s for the battery to hold charge for an extended period, had mine in storage resently for one month with no battery tender and it fired up no problem. Battery was low but had enough juice to start. Battery is a fairly new cheap lead acid type.
     
  2. richard-7

    richard-7

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    I know ive said this before somewhere but a lot of starter struggles are the starter solenoid contacts. ONE07 has a tool to set them so they make FULL contact which makes starting a lot easier. See on CNW website.
     
  3. iwilson

    iwilson

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2015

    Remove the sensor plug (squeeze the wire bar and wriggle off the plug). With a multimeter measure the resistance across the two terminals. Should be around the same reading as mine 2.8k ohms +/-. Re-attach the plug start the bike and run for 5 to 10 minutes. Switch off and re-measure the resistance, it should have dropped significantly. If the bike won't start remove the sensor and warm it up in an oven. If sensor checks out ok then I would then look at checking the wiring from the sensor to ECU. If all ok then your problems are probably not with the engine temp sensor.
     
  4. contours

    contours VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Thanks iwilson, As soon as I was done writing my question I said to myself "what a dumb question!". But I appreciate the tip about removing the sensor.
     
  5. BPHORSEGUY

    BPHORSEGUY

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    So exactly how much did you pay for your sensor? A top quality battery, which is the only thing I would put in the 961 is easily $110-$130!
     
  6. contours

    contours VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Well, I ordered them from my trusty foreign car mechanic and I'm sure I paid top dollar. A little over $200 for both sensors.
     
  7. Britfan60

    Britfan60 VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
  8. contours

    contours VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Sympathies accepted. There was no clear way of knowing if the parts were genuine on line. So I went with my favorite mechanic. Que sara sara.
     
  9. richard-7

    richard-7

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    Go with your gut. The amount of fakes is astonishing!!
     
  10. iwilson

    iwilson

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2015
    Found a chart that shows what the correct values should be for a given temperature. Fits in nicely with what I measured, should be useful for anyone trying to fault find.

    T [°C] R [Ω]
    -40 45313
    -30 26114
    -20 15462
    -10 9397
    0 5896
    10 3792
    20 2500
    30 1707
    40 1175
    50 834
    60 596
    70 436
    80 323
    90 243
    100 187
    110 144
    120 113
    130 89
     
  11. richard-7

    richard-7

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    Good find. Thanks for sharing
     
  12. Britfan60

    Britfan60 VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
    This is true, and to be totally honest, I haven't ordered from them yet. I am going to give it a try. Wish me luck. There's a California company called Meyle that claims the make better for less. 47.00 for the crank sensor.
     
  13. Clive

    Clive VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2017
    Hi - I suffered this only once but it seems a very common problem - does anyone know why it refuses to start? Is the fueling completely wrong, does it not fire the injectors at all or is it an ignition problem?

    The engineer in me wants to understand exactly what is going on. For my cars I plug in an OBD bluetooth connector, connect wirelessly to an program on a laptop or app on a phone and get a readout of errors. As a community we should be able to find a setup that can analyse these problems cheaply and easily?
     
  14. Britfan60

    Britfan60 VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2014
    I don't have a non starting issue very often, but sometimes I do and sometimes it starts and maintains a low idle like its going to stall. My best result is instead of keeping hitting the start button, simply turn off the ignition key for a second or two and then retry. Seems to work most times. Not sure of why.
     
  15. contours

    contours VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    My cold start ritual is a little different. When I first turn the ignition key I press the button on the console and scroll to the battery voltage reading. If the voltage reads 12 or less I plug in my jump starter, let it sit for about 15 seconds and then press the start button. It usually starts on the first try. Of course, I expect a low voltage because I can't keep my battery on a charger until I add another cable to the battery. After riding around for a bit she usually starts without help. But on rare occasions even an adequately charged battery combined with a warm engine still gives me problems. :roll: So I will swap out the sensors this weekend.
     
  16. iwilson

    iwilson

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2015

    Mapping has improved over time but no one would say it’s as good as it could be. You can plug an OBDII Bluetooth scanner in - I did at one point. Although it stopped working when they swapped my ECU for a different brand and inserted a hybrid wiring harness, but the plug is there. Unfortunately all we can do is watch since the ECU is not user accessible.
     
  17. contours

    contours VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Took my first ride with he Bosch head temp. sensor installed. Started nicely from dead cold at about 50°F. Subsequent start ups after stopping for 10-20 minutes was difficult. If nothing else, the new sensor has flipped the cold/hot conditions of my start up problem. :confused:
     
  18. richard-7

    richard-7

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2014
    Interesting.....
     
  19. BPHORSEGUY

    BPHORSEGUY

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
     
  20. BPHORSEGUY

    BPHORSEGUY

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    You can plug in an OBD Bluetooh connector and read issues! I use Torque for the software. I did a thread on this 2 summers ago!
     

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