Help! I've been FRAMED!
- Thread starter snortonNorton
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Ok here's my opinion... And we all know what they say about opinions.
If you want a bike for a riding and you have to rebuild it why not make it as good as it can be.
I am rebuilding a 1968 commando that had the original Widowmaker frame when I got it. I have upgraded it by welding in the extra top frame tube. So now it's no longer original, but I know it's not going to try and kill me.
Also as I didn't have an original side stand I decided to fit the better late model one... Although I did replicate the original welding
If you want a bike for a riding and you have to rebuild it why not make it as good as it can be.
I am rebuilding a 1968 commando that had the original Widowmaker frame when I got it. I have upgraded it by welding in the extra top frame tube. So now it's no longer original, but I know it's not going to try and kill me.
Also as I didn't have an original side stand I decided to fit the better late model one... Although I did replicate the original welding
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While its handy to do might add a small cross brace about 1/3rd way up the front down tubes and also across the rear lower frame loops and maybe even a strap across back of cradle> in case someone down the road wants to add a rump rod link for some reason.
Nice work on the top frame tube and side stand lug Dean, I couldn't quite make it out from the pictures but did you add the upper rear shock/ seat loop plate to help strengthen that area. Oldbritts has a pattern for it on their website, seems the factory was short sighted in that area too.Dean said:..............I am rebuilding a 1968 commando that had the original Widowmaker frame when I got it. I have upgraded it by welding in the extra top frame tube. So now it's no longer original, but I know it's not going to try and kill me.
Also as I didn't have an original side stand I decided to fit the better late model one... Although I did replicate the original welding
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I was looking at that shock mount last night and thought that was pretty week. Now you got me thinking again..........hm. Maybe thicker plates, but than you would have to make those custom seat bolts longer.
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Them There 850s have the inner plate going aft another few inches , so the subframe doesnt fall off if the pillions eaten to much ,
eyeball a picture to copy the inner shock top bracket , perhaps .
eyeball a picture to copy the inner shock top bracket , perhaps .
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cjandme said:Nice work on the top frame tube and side stand lug Dean, I couldn't quite make it out from the pictures but did you add the upper rear shock/ seat loop plate to help strengthen that area. Oldbritts has a pattern for it on their website, seems the factory was short sighted in that area too.Dean said:..............I am rebuilding a 1968 commando that had the original Widowmaker frame when I got it. I have upgraded it by welding in the extra top frame tube. So now it's no longer original, but I know it's not going to try and kill me.
Also as I didn't have an original side stand I decided to fit the better late model one... Although I did replicate the original welding
My rear frame loop was bent like many others and when I went to repair it I found a solid bar had been bashed in to strengthen it. I cut all this off then repaired it. To weld it I had to remove the top shock mount. I then made up new shock mount with the inner extended to support the rear loop better. It is also one gauge thicker metal.
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Good job. That looks pretty beefy and should be much stronger. I want to keep it fairly stock looking so it's not too noticeable at first glance.
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When pre-peel rear loop saggend then fractured one side merely carrying a 6 hp chain saw and feed sag off pavement had no concept of a obsolete Commando as a hot rod with good power to weight potential so lucked out in small town to find a machine shop with steel rod cut off scap that was easy to grind a bit and pound in frame tubes before weld and regrind. I found just bracng the loop internally is good for under 100 lbs on smoother surfaces but fit the long stuts for feed sags and beer cases hauling home. With Ludwigs featherweight wonder in mind I try to put out of mind the almost 2 lbs i added by solid inserts rather than tubing. On next Peel with the inserts and carpenter square gassets her long sturts [when needed] attach to the rear of luggage rack not the loop itself. A 50 lb feed sag and groceries can be supported fine on next Peel w/o the back up struts. Its the big bottom gals I've mostly in mind of course : )
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hobot said:
I get it now. I didn't notice those long struts the first time I looked at that bike. I use to be able to carry a case a beer in my T-shirt or coat in the early 80's. My brother carried all his hockey gear and stick on his RD 350 in the 70's. But in India they bring it to a whole new level.
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snortonNorton,
Sorry, I hate to be a pecker peeing in the wind here, but from the photos
you've posted it appears you've welded a straight piece of bar into the
frame. The equivalent bar on stock frames that have them have a pretty
substantial arc, away from the lower engine. And with the bend the stock
cross-member bar has, the clearance from the bar to the lower engine cases is
only about 1 inch (approximate measurement of two 850's while they were
parked on center-stands).
If you've welded in a straight piece of pipe, then from my estimations there
is a chance the engine cases will make contact with the frame.
Another thing to take into consideration, is the precise placement of the
bar. There is an aftermarket engine breather available that can be fitted
into the sump at the bottom of the cases. If you place the pipe too close to
the sump, you may end up not being able to fit the breather, if you wanted to
do so. See this thread for more information on the sump breather I'm
referring to:
post-installation-comnoz-sump-breather-norton-t14005-30.html
Good luck.
.
snortonNorton,
Sorry, I hate to be a pecker peeing in the wind here, but from the photos
you've posted it appears you've welded a straight piece of bar into the
frame. The equivalent bar on stock frames that have them have a pretty
substantial arc, away from the lower engine. And with the bend the stock
cross-member bar has, the clearance from the bar to the lower engine cases is
only about 1 inch (approximate measurement of two 850's while they were
parked on center-stands).
If you've welded in a straight piece of pipe, then from my estimations there
is a chance the engine cases will make contact with the frame.
Another thing to take into consideration, is the precise placement of the
bar. There is an aftermarket engine breather available that can be fitted
into the sump at the bottom of the cases. If you place the pipe too close to
the sump, you may end up not being able to fit the breather, if you wanted to
do so. See this thread for more information on the sump breather I'm
referring to:
post-installation-comnoz-sump-breather-norton-t14005-30.html
Good luck.
.
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1st off, the gosh darn sexy metal blending cross brace and side stand lug are way close enough to factory in position and contour to work just fine.
2nd, visited India a few times and other places two wheels carry way more than designed or expected so that's how I got impression my Commando could too.
3rd, its a Commando for gosh sakes so once one thing upgraded like the rear loop then next weakeness appears that hinders much use of the succesful upgrade, ie: you can definitely over load by mass and inertia the two piece dumb axle - like I have in 2 Combats both ways.
4th, to get some pay back for my forced cycle mechanics of grimy tedious tasks I have no hankering for I must use em more often than a cage so two feedbags 100 lb is routine as is 3-4 cases of brew. Things like PU truck wheel to fix is a challenge to attach for bumpy paths but when failures on top of failures cascade ....
5th, the most handy configuration is so taboo here they resort to back packing cargo like they was the mule, sheeze...
6th, Trixie's saggy hinny below is merely temporary rough ride loosing of the rear loop clamps and as Trixie is mere whimy frail factory Combat I'll never over load her to need struts or rod links or more frame bracing.
chicken truck feather cluster got under master link from power washer splash and zipped right off like a guy on a gals fasteners.
Ya just have no idea what ya missing w/o likes of Peel - as most the sport bike encountered were me just on daily commute rates - so one funny event was coming up on a Ducati squadron watching them knee drag the twisties [guess why i was last in line] then hit the opens all tucked down but Peel passed them all in short space with me sitting bolt upright open jacket flapping and milk crate on rear full of groceries sticking out,
2nd, visited India a few times and other places two wheels carry way more than designed or expected so that's how I got impression my Commando could too.
3rd, its a Commando for gosh sakes so once one thing upgraded like the rear loop then next weakeness appears that hinders much use of the succesful upgrade, ie: you can definitely over load by mass and inertia the two piece dumb axle - like I have in 2 Combats both ways.
4th, to get some pay back for my forced cycle mechanics of grimy tedious tasks I have no hankering for I must use em more often than a cage so two feedbags 100 lb is routine as is 3-4 cases of brew. Things like PU truck wheel to fix is a challenge to attach for bumpy paths but when failures on top of failures cascade ....
5th, the most handy configuration is so taboo here they resort to back packing cargo like they was the mule, sheeze...
6th, Trixie's saggy hinny below is merely temporary rough ride loosing of the rear loop clamps and as Trixie is mere whimy frail factory Combat I'll never over load her to need struts or rod links or more frame bracing.
chicken truck feather cluster got under master link from power washer splash and zipped right off like a guy on a gals fasteners.
Ya just have no idea what ya missing w/o likes of Peel - as most the sport bike encountered were me just on daily commute rates - so one funny event was coming up on a Ducati squadron watching them knee drag the twisties [guess why i was last in line] then hit the opens all tucked down but Peel passed them all in short space with me sitting bolt upright open jacket flapping and milk crate on rear full of groceries sticking out,
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Robert_Norton said:.
snortonNorton,
Sorry, I hate to be a pecker peeing in the wind here, but from the photos
you've posted it appears you've welded a straight piece of bar into the
frame. The equivalent bar on stock frames that have them have a pretty
substantial arc, away from the lower engine. And with the bend the stock
cross-member bar has, the clearance from the bar to the lower engine cases is
only about 1 inch (approximate measurement of two 850's while they were
parked on center-stands).
If you've welded in a straight piece of pipe, then from my estimations there
is a chance the engine cases will make contact with the frame.
Thank you for the advice. I meant to bend that pipe a bit before the installation but we got so busy working on my buddies truck before and I forgot. He smashed his thumb on the front yoke in his Jeep as you can see in the pictures. Ripped thumb nail half off , blood everywhere.
But I'm pretty sure it is forward enough to miss the lower front part of the engine. If not, than I guess we cut, heat and bend, than splice new piece in.
Fingers crossed.
Today we welded on the side stand mount and fitted the center stand. The center stand stop notches were worn out and had to be built up and ground down. Everything seems to be worn out.
Even the lower fork leg was broken, had it welded up than ground down now cutting in the slot. Pete's thumb was smashed earlier that day working on his truck.
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LOL... save me some beer, I'm comin down there some day just to check out Trixie.
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