Flatten oil pump base

Time Warp · Feb 11, 2020

RoadScholar said:
BMWs have these pumps, at least the /5, /6 and the /7s, the models I have worked on.

Best.

I guess that is where the Japanese got the notion to use that form of pump and there would not be many models that do not use that today, high pressure shell bearing or low pressure roller bottom end.
There was a guy on BB.com that did one for a Trident engine (iirc)

mdt-son · Feb 11, 2020

Time Warp said:
When will someone make a dual stage gerotor oil pump ?

I have given this some thought. One would need a pump housing which connects to the existing oilways. The pump itself would have to sit outside of the intermediate gear. A new timing cover would be required which wouldn't look very pleasing.

Gerotor pumps have been developed for the AJS/Matchless twins by an engineer with BMW. The AMC engines have a pump plate and a drive coaxial to the crankshaft, thus a give-away solution.

I believe the 961 engine uses a gerotor oil pump.

-Knut

Time Warp · Feb 11, 2020

mdt-son said:
I have given this some thought....

-Knut

Yes it would hard to fit and needing two rotors adds more complication, I guess that is why they will most likely never be an off the shelf part........ for now.

I had given thought to this for the Sunbeam but it is a wet sump engine and the stock gear oil pump is integral with the rear main bearing flange.
In that case it would not be to hard to machine a alloy rear flange plate with a Moto Guzzi main bearing centre/center with a recess (as per stock) for the gerotor below the main bearing.
This thought was mainly in an effort to get rid of the white metal rear bearing if a AMR300 was used.
Of course if it did not work, there is the possibility of spinning bits on the inside exiting to the outside via the engine case.

Bernhard · Feb 11, 2020

Time Warp said:
When will someone make a dual stage gerotor oil pump ?

But do BMW have wet sump or separate oil tanks that sometimes drain oil into the engine?

L.A.B. · Feb 11, 2020

Bernhard said:
But do BMW have wet sump or separate oil tanks that sometimes drain oil into the engine?

They're wet sump.
The later 'K' series had a gear pump.

NortonMKIIA850 · Feb 11, 2020

RoadScholar said:
+1 on sending it back. A/N needs to know about this, and, hopefully will take corrective action including an inspection of their current inventory; it benefits all parties.

Yes, exactly – to my knowledge the process you describe has happened twice with other parts, namely the plastic levers for pre-Mk3 Lucas handlebar switches and, just in the last few days, the filler cap repair kit, in which the 'seal support rubber' supplied to me was vastly different to that illustrated on the web page for the kit, and completely useless. AN are now aware of the problem and dealing with it. It's a shame these things happen, but you have to give them a chance to sort it out.

guest76 · Feb 11, 2020

@disquek to answer your other question, we always paint the paper gaskets with Wellseal.

They are then hung up to 'dry' for a couple of days.

The Wellseal soaks into the gasket, and it goes nice and sticky.

Provides a great seal every time!

I trust Wellseal for areas that have oilways and galleries much more than I trust silicon based products like Hylomar and Hermetite so use it wherever it is practical to do so!

baz · Feb 11, 2020

Just send it back mate
Let an deal with it

cliffa · Feb 11, 2020

mdt-son said:
I have given this some thought. One would need a pump housing which connects to the existing oilways. The pump itself would have to sit outside of the intermediate gear. A new timing cover would be required which wouldn't look very pleasing.

Gerotor pumps have been developed for the AJS/Matchless twins by an engineer with BMW. The AMC engines have a pump plate and a drive coaxial to the crankshaft, thus a give-away solution.

I believe the 961 engine uses a gerotor oil pump.

-Knut

I should think it would be possible to graft a Japanese pump onto the spare space at the back of the timing cover, drive it by chain then make up a dummy oil pump body suitably drilled to link the original oilways.

Bernhard · Feb 11, 2020

cliffa said:
I should think it would be possible to graft a Japanese pump onto the spare space at the back of the timing cover, drive it by chain then make up a dummy oil pump body suitably drilled to link the original oilways.

Maybe you could do that, but don't expect it to solve your oil tank drainage problem, as the majority of jap bikes are wet sump.

jbruney · Feb 11, 2020

Gerotor and geroller pumps also leak by as they wear. Geroller are in general larger and employ a case drain. Nothing is perfect.

Time Warp · Feb 11, 2020

I am not worried about leakage but if a Gerotor would produce more reliable oil pressure compared to gears.
Not that it matters the Yamaha TRX850 is dry sump with a dual pump, maybe the oil tank on top of the gearbox was put there for a reason (or not)
#
I guess the OP's oil pump is in the mail, return to sender... uh-huh-huh.

jbruney · Feb 11, 2020

Both gear and gerotor produce good pressure and volume, but alas as with everything they do eventually wear.

Flatten oil pump base

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.

mdt-son

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.

Bernhard

L.A.B.

Moderator

NortonMKIIA850

guest76

baz

cliffa

Bernhard

jbruney

Time Warp

.......back to the 70's.

jbruney

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