clutch basket wobble

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Stillreel

Stillreel

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Increasingly poor clutch performance leads to a strip down. Everything looks okay but when testing the assembly with everything tight and the cover off, I noticed that the clutch basket wobbles when the lever is pulled the the rear wheel is spun. This can't be good. Hopefully, all I need is a new set of plates but I'd like to find out if anyone has seen bent sprocket shaft (4th gear) or if there's something else I should test/ look at.

Thanks

BC
71 Commando
 
Check the nut on mainshaft for looseness. Check the stoopid circlip for overtightened crushing damage. New one is 40 ft.lbs. only Or order in 06-8072 type.
 
My experience is that all clutch baskets seem to wobble a bit. How much is too much? :roll:
 
I'm thinking I've seen the mysterious wobble on other machines too. "How much is to much": there's the question. Its re-assembled now. I'll take it out for a run tomorrow to see if the problem is fixed.
 
Stillreel said:
Increasingly poor clutch performance leads to a strip down. Everything looks okay but when testing the assembly with everything tight and the cover off, I noticed that the clutch basket wobbles when the lever is pulled the the rear wheel is spun. This can't be good. Hopefully, all I need is a new set of plates but I'd like to find out if anyone has seen bent sprocket shaft (4th gear) or if there's something else I should test/ look at.

Thanks

BC
71 Commando
Click to expand...

What exactly is "poor clutch performance"?
Slipping?
Dragging?
Hard pull?
Slipping and dragging usually cured with a good cleaning of plates.
Hard pull usually fixed with added spacer plate in clutch stack.
Was the clutch hub badly notched since that will affect clutch function?
 
The basket bearing also plays a role. When I replaced mine the wobble decreased by about 1/2, but that is just my recollection, nothing measured. As I understand it doesn't take long for the bearing to wear again, but when the clutch is engaged it doesn't matter, only when you pull the clutch in to shift does it wobble. So I'm not sure it's an issue.

I'll be glad to hear other opinions.

Dave
69S
 
I'm fairly half fast expert on clutch wobble sources to say most likely the dang sleeve shaft bushes ate up as they only get some dribble down oil in top and sling it all out in all the lower gears w/o letting any back in, ugh. Also suspect frist cog bush trashed but that messes with staying in 1st rather than clutch wobble. When all parts are up to spec there is no visual-manual detectable basket wobble, till wear creeps in again. All the prior factors listed can apply too so implies nothing for it but more Commando worship postures and time and money sacrifices laid on the alter of heavenly rides to come, till next show stopper. When ya do get into it might oil groove the sleeve bushes and add a spare one ad center spacer if not getting the two longer version upgrade bushes. I've had unadjustable clutch cable tension hit once that turned out to be the main shaft nut loose under the inner cover side. Seems clutch was loosey sense to that nipped up.
 
rx7171 said:
What exactly is "poor clutch performance"?
Slipping?
Dragging?
Hard pull?
Slipping and dragging usually cured with a good cleaning of plates.
Hard pull usually fixed with added spacer plate in clutch stack.
Was the clutch hub badly notched since that will affect clutch function?
Click to expand...

The inside of the clutch basket looks okay.

It's an easy pull but there's slipping AND dragging, which is making me think Hobot has hit the nail on the head.

$217 for a bushing kit from Old Britts. Might be time to call it a season and start the winter project.
 
Stillreel said:
rx7171 said:
What exactly is "poor clutch performance"?
Slipping?
Dragging?
Hard pull?
Slipping and dragging usually cured with a good cleaning of plates.
Hard pull usually fixed with added spacer plate in clutch stack.
Was the clutch hub badly notched since that will affect clutch function?
Click to expand...

The inside of the clutch basket looks okay.

It's an easy pull but there's slipping AND dragging, which is making me think Hobot has hit the nail on the head.

$217 for a bushing kit from Old Britts. Might be time to call it a season and start the winter project.
Click to expand...
In addition to the sleeve gear bushes, the main shaft wears right under them. I have all the bushes and a new main shaft waiting in the wings (when the weather degrades). The last time I was in the gear box, I noticed the ridge developing.
That being said, with everything perfect and in good condition, due to the nature of this mass hanging out there, there will always be, if only slightly negligible, some wobble.
 
Weebles wobble but they don't fall down. :roll: Just grap the basket with both hands and push forwards-backwards. If the Triplex chain rises or falls it's rebuild time.
 
Stillreel said:
rx7171 said:
What exactly is "poor clutch performance"?
Slipping?
Dragging?
Hard pull?
Slipping and dragging usually cured with a good cleaning of plates.
Hard pull usually fixed with added spacer plate in clutch stack.
Was the clutch hub badly notched since that will affect clutch function?
Click to expand...

The inside of the clutch basket looks okay.

It's an easy pull but there's slipping AND dragging, which is making me think Hobot has hit the nail on the head.

$217 for a bushing kit from Old Britts. Might be time to call it a season and start the winter project.
Click to expand...

Actually both slip and drag can be caused by oiled plates. You didn't mention what they looked like when you took it apart.
If needed a clean you may want to reassemble and see what happens.
Issue of wobble of course not related to slip or drag.
 
The bearing in the basket is fairly easy and cheap to replace. And as for mentioned earlier clean plates. And while your in there you mide as well add a Dino Dave clutch rod seal, and replace the small circlip behind the basket. ( clean threads well, toss locking tab to the wind, use parts cleaner on threads, dry. Dab of blue loc tite Torque 40 ftlbs, then dab of blue loc tite and install clutch rod seal. ) Upon reassembly as mentioned earlier, check stack height and shim accordingly.
Barring any gearbox issues, I think your going to have a pie eating grin on your face again.
 
Cleaning the plates was the first thing I did. Looks like a gear box re-build. Sounds expensive.
 
Here's the other little oddity:

The new push rod appears to be spinning inside the shaft as evidenced by the dimple forming at the ball bearing end. Perhaps the bush where is causing the shaft to press against the push rod adding yet more grief to the issue?

BC
 
Who knows with the list of things from the clutch nut all the way to the opposite side main shaft nut what is the wobble source if not all of em adding their part. I've checked mine after rebuilt tranny guts and some at rallys so assure ya the "normal" state of clutch is more solid from deflection by hand force than tugging on Z plates, though its very "common" to find some wobble that ain't normal, just common state of wear. Basket must be pretty darn stable to run a belt primary or walks right off the basket in a short time and make a mess in the primary as I found out knowing some wobble was ok for the chain. There is also possibility the main shaft is bent from an over tight chain sometime in the past which would make clutch wobble in use even if no deflection felt when tugged on still. A bent main shaft will also tend to eat up bushes and bearing so wobble too soon onsets again till things straightened out. Shaft OD worn away adds its slackness too. Outrigger can help stifle wobbles onset after the guts up to snuff.
 
The push rod should move free in the shaft. It has to as the out clutch basket spins with the engine but the inner with the gearbox so when stationary with clutch slipping waiting to set off they are a greatly different speed. Also the inner end of the push rod is against the ball bearing that is not able to revolve because of pressure on it by actuating arm.
Sometimes the rod maybe refitted the opposite way to the way it was removed so you will see dimples at each end.

Remove all clutch plates and primary chain then try to move just the inner basket. if it moves but is tight on the main shaft then the sleeve gear bush needs replacing.
If the inner doesn't move then moves to the out basket this can move 1/16" measured at the chain teeth. Even new bearing may move that much but more than that replace the bearing and that is rocking any other movement or if it doesn't spin smoothly and freely replace it
 
Dimple on pushrod end normal stuff. Unlikely clutch basket BIG bearing shot enough to cause weeble-wobbles. 1. Shot sleeve gear bushes. 2. Crushed circlip . 3. Mainshaft nut secretly loose ,crummy bend-over retainer washer just hiding that observation. 4. The basket wobbles a tad anyways. :|
 
Holy Carp! I got the sleeve gear bushings out today and its no wonder why I was having trouble shifting. The inner bush was well out of round and 1/8" short than the outer bush, having drifted onto the main shaft 3rd gear splines. The outer bush also very worn. It actually surprising the thing ran at all.

So that's hopefully the shifting/clutch issue resolved (once the new parts are in).

Suggestions on shimming the clutch basket would be appreciated and what (TF) are the grooves in the fork selector spindle good for except leaking oil onto the sprocket, down to the chain, around the fender and onto my backside??

On to the carbs ......

The saga continues.
 
Shim the clutch to match the crank sprocket at the faces of the teeth where the triplex chain rides.
 
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