Cam Followers
- Thread starter rvich
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rvich
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I think the right thing to do is fix that follower, otherwise I wouldn't have started this thread. I think checking the hardness on the cam is wise as well.
But before we get carried away, I have to remember I live in a remote location and can spend a lot of money mailing bits back and forth. This is why I need to give this a bit of thought. This is one small piece of a bigger puzzle.
In the meantime, I have my 750 on the road.
I have two major goals on my 850:
1.) Enjoy the process
2.) Not build a monument the size of Mount Rushmore. Not to say I might not go over the top in what I eventually do with this build, but I don't want to start thinking of any of it as permanent.
If I stay run aground here in Southeast Alaska it might take me the rest of my life to wear out that cam, but if I decide to hit the road with HenryUK, I might be sorry I didn't fix that follower!
Russ
But before we get carried away, I have to remember I live in a remote location and can spend a lot of money mailing bits back and forth. This is why I need to give this a bit of thought. This is one small piece of a bigger puzzle.
In the meantime, I have my 750 on the road.
I have two major goals on my 850:
1.) Enjoy the process
2.) Not build a monument the size of Mount Rushmore. Not to say I might not go over the top in what I eventually do with this build, but I don't want to start thinking of any of it as permanent.
If I stay run aground here in Southeast Alaska it might take me the rest of my life to wear out that cam, but if I decide to hit the road with HenryUK, I might be sorry I didn't fix that follower!
Russ
rvich
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The best thing the USPS ever did for Alaska was the flat rate priority mail boxes. Yes, they work here. I could throw the cam and the lifters into a box and send them off, if that is what you are thinking.
I still need to take a good look at the head. I have been lax in finding or making a tool to compress the springs. It needs to be cleaned up and examined. It might need some work on the exhaust threads. It is the next event. Hopefully in the next couple of days I will round up something to use on the springs.
This thread is going to turn into a build thread if I am not careful!
PS-The head did not fair as well as the lower end during the long slumber as none of the oil retired there.
I still need to take a good look at the head. I have been lax in finding or making a tool to compress the springs. It needs to be cleaned up and examined. It might need some work on the exhaust threads. It is the next event. Hopefully in the next couple of days I will round up something to use on the springs.
This thread is going to turn into a build thread if I am not careful!
PS-The head did not fair as well as the lower end during the long slumber as none of the oil retired there.
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rvich said:I would like the experts to chime in here. The cam followers on my 850 look great in that the wear on the surface is very mild. When I put a straight edge across the face and shine a light from behind I cannot see any gap at all. However, I can see from the wear pattern that one of the followers (it would be the left side intake) doesn't contact the cam lobe across the entire surface.
The cam shows a similar wear pattern. Should I be concerned about this? Obviously 100% contact would be better but for all I know they are all like this to a degree.
While we are at it, what is acceptable end play on the cam?
Thanks
Russ
You wondered why your lifter was worn on one side. Here is why. The first few passes with the dresser only touched one side. Obviously the guy that ground it at the factory was having an off day. Jim
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Pushrods are easy to shorten. Just pull the end off -cut the tube and push the end back on with a bit of JB weld.
Geometry changes with head or barrel cuts, valve regrinds, cam regrinds as well as lifter grinds. To make the geometry "correct" it needs to be checked and adjusted on an individual basis but the geometry is pretty forgiving and not usually a big issue on a streetbike. Jim[/quote]
Easy for you maybe to pull off the end of the pushrod. Mine don't want to let go. What's the secret?
Geometry changes with head or barrel cuts, valve regrinds, cam regrinds as well as lifter grinds. To make the geometry "correct" it needs to be checked and adjusted on an individual basis but the geometry is pretty forgiving and not usually a big issue on a streetbike. Jim[/quote]
Easy for you maybe to pull off the end of the pushrod. Mine don't want to let go. What's the secret?
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illf8ed said:
Easy for you maybe to pull off the end of the pushrod. Mine don't want to let go. What's the secret?[/quote]
Take two pieces of aluminum at least 1/2 inch thick and put them in a vise with a piece of cereal box cardboard sandwiched between them. Use a 3/8 bit and drill through on the parting line. Now use the aluminum to hold your pushrod in a drill press vice and clamp the end you want to remove in the chuck. A sharp upward smack on the quill handle will pull it right off. If you have trouble with the pushrod slipping in your pushrod holding tool -smear a little valve lapping compound on the shaft before you clamp it. Jim
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I will come up to Alaska to fish with your son while you work on engine. Problem solved.
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I am with Commoz, clean things and put the motor back together with new rings and bearing shells, and you might want to lightly kiss the valves and valve seats with a grinder while it is apart and check your spring length.
If the bike had run another x-number of hours, that one lifter might have bedded in all the way across and you might never have noticed this at all. If the motor was taken apart with less miles on it, there may have been other lifters that looked the same?
I recently looked at a Norton crankcase that had a cylinder deck that was .007" crooked from side to side. It is a big if that anything else in the engine was square when it was new, so it's lifters were probably all crooked on the cam and eventually wore in to full contact. If I did nothing else to the engine but ground the lifters and put them back in, then they would have to start the process all over again, working their way to full contact starting from one end, and I would probably have done more harm than good, should have just thrown the motor back together.
The 850 Norton engines run with the spin-on filter had great crank journal life compared to the older bikes without the filter. I have two old 850 cranks here out of bikes I junked and the journals on them mic out perfect and they are as clean as a whistle inside, not the case with most old Dommy and 750 Commando engines I have disassembled.
One of the 850s I junked, a 74', thought the crank was perfect in it, had a cam with one lifter wore all the way down to nothing. I attribute this to too long between oil changes. Sure they did put soft cams in the bikes, but with regular maintenance they last. In the late seventies and early eighties GM put a lot of soft cams into it's v8 passenger cars. The cams went flat on a LOT of cars, some mine and some my friends, but not in the ones we had changed the oil on with any regularity.
I saved the oil filter setups off those junked 850's to throw onto older dommies etc.....
Those on a small budget can ride many tens of thousands of miles just fixing the sole reason the engine quit or won't run, and leaving the rest of the sleeping dogs lie.
If the bike had run another x-number of hours, that one lifter might have bedded in all the way across and you might never have noticed this at all. If the motor was taken apart with less miles on it, there may have been other lifters that looked the same?
I recently looked at a Norton crankcase that had a cylinder deck that was .007" crooked from side to side. It is a big if that anything else in the engine was square when it was new, so it's lifters were probably all crooked on the cam and eventually wore in to full contact. If I did nothing else to the engine but ground the lifters and put them back in, then they would have to start the process all over again, working their way to full contact starting from one end, and I would probably have done more harm than good, should have just thrown the motor back together.
The 850 Norton engines run with the spin-on filter had great crank journal life compared to the older bikes without the filter. I have two old 850 cranks here out of bikes I junked and the journals on them mic out perfect and they are as clean as a whistle inside, not the case with most old Dommy and 750 Commando engines I have disassembled.
One of the 850s I junked, a 74', thought the crank was perfect in it, had a cam with one lifter wore all the way down to nothing. I attribute this to too long between oil changes. Sure they did put soft cams in the bikes, but with regular maintenance they last. In the late seventies and early eighties GM put a lot of soft cams into it's v8 passenger cars. The cams went flat on a LOT of cars, some mine and some my friends, but not in the ones we had changed the oil on with any regularity.
I saved the oil filter setups off those junked 850's to throw onto older dommies etc.....
Those on a small budget can ride many tens of thousands of miles just fixing the sole reason the engine quit or won't run, and leaving the rest of the sleeping dogs lie.
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rvich said:Here are some photos of the cam.
Check this one out!
Engineering wise; well thats very poor,one lobe appears to have only 25% contact area, if these are "soft cams" they are holding up very well, Imagin if they had 100% contact, i would attempt to correct the "lack of contact" just hope it's a follower out-of square-ness.
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On some other motorcycles it is a common practice to make sure the lifters are square to the cam by using bluing on the lifter. People do this to the lifters on Vincents. I have used it on Triumphs and Vincents. Then on a fine stone or wet and dry paper on a very flat surface you correct the angle until when you turn the cam it scrapes the bluing off evenly. Once you have done this the follower is likely more accurately square to the cam than by any other method. It corrects for all the other errors there may be in squareness of one part to another. On a Vincent there are many different reasons why the cam and lifter can be out, probably more than on a Norton.
It is hard to tell in the picture but it looks like your cam might already be worn though.
It is hard to tell in the picture but it looks like your cam might already be worn though.
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A good fitting dowl will not require any glue, if it needs glueing its to loose! and a oversize is required. or re-reaming and new dowel.comnoz said:
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