Avon Roadrider Universal vs dedicated rear fitment

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Fast Eddie said:
I extracted this tyre discussion from the Comnoz valve spring thread, so as not to derail his thread!

The conversation was regarding the fact that using a dedicated rear will increase tyre miles by a 3rd when compared to a Universal tyre. Given the fact that rear tyre wear can be rapid and therefore an issue, this seems important (to me at least).

Question from Mr Rick was:

“And is there a dedicated 19" rear tyre you can recommend?”

Not from the Roadrider range unfortunately.

That’s why I use an 18” rear. It allows me to use a dedicated rear 18” and a front universal 19” that have exactly the same rolling radius, thus maintaining the intended geometry, providing great handling, and giving the best possible tyre life.

Works for me !
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So, why are you worried about tyre life when, by your own admission, you don't ride enough to wear a tyre out before it's due for replacement because of old age? For most Commando owners, tyre life isn't an issue because they simply don't do enough miles, yet here are people asking about budget tyres! Is it just me?
 
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I’m not worried about it Ken, my set up with the Avon’s works perfectly for me, even if I was exaggerating a tad about not wearing them out!

I used to run Universal Super Venoms, and rear tyre life was an issue then.

It’s not only high mileage highway use that uses up tyre life BTW, they get pretty badly chewed up, as apposed to worn out, in track use.
 
Be interesting to see if Avon replace the roadrunner (no longer lited for the Commando) with a 19'' radial, seemingly slow to catch on in Norton world, but they are getting very good press with other marques, and the roadrider has been plagued with issues when fitted to some bikes, I think the tyre is on it's forth update since it was launched. The early tyres I could get on with hands, the later ones are a lot more stiff.

There are no budget tyres on sale in the UK at 19'' that fit a Commando, the only one near budget is the roadrider.

A new tyre every 8 weeks is not good value, between the drive for more grip and and ever increasing poor road services, maybe 3K miles out of a tyre is the norm here.

Even Avon were suprised at the wear rate, they have come up with some suggestions, we'll see what happens.
 
Madnorton said:
Be interesting to see if Avon replace the roadrunner (no longer lited for the Commando) with a 19'' radial, seemingly slow to catch on in Norton world, but they are getting very good press with other marques, and the roadrider has been plagued with issues when fitted to some bikes, I think the tyre is on it's forth update since it was launched. The early tyres I could get on with hands, the later ones are a lot more stiff.

There are no budget tyres on sale in the UK at 19'' that fit a Commando, the only one near budget is the roadrider.

A new tyre every 8 weeks is not good value, between the drive for more grip and and ever increasing poor road services, maybe 3K miles out of a tyre is the norm here.

Even Avon were suprised at the wear rate, they have come up with some suggestions, we'll see what happens.
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What issues would they be?
I've had close to 25 19" Roadriders now and I certainly get more than 3000 miles out of them. A lot of experience there.
 
Fullauto said:
What issues would they be?
I've had close to 25 19" Roadriders now and I certainly get more than 3000 miles out of them. A lot of experience there.
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I will second that.
I get more than 3000 Miles for sure. I run them till the wear bar is gone.
Thomas
 
Even Avon were suprised at the wear rate, they have come up with some suggestions, we'll see what happens.

Wouldn’t the simple solution be to either make a dedicated rear with a deeper tread, or change their universal so it has a deeper tread?
 
Deets55 said:
Even Avon were suprised at the wear rate, they have come up with some suggestions, we'll see what happens.

Wouldn’t the simple solution be to either make a dedicated rear with a deeper tread, or change their universal so it has a deeper tread?
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As I understand it, the reason Universal tyres have less tread than rear tyres is, because they are Universal, they have to be applicable for front tyre fitment. Front tyres have less tread because a too deep tread will affect stability (the tread pattern will allow squirming / movement).

So, IMHO I think your other suggestion is the way Avon should go; make a dedicated 19”rear.
 
Fast Eddie said:
As I understand it, the reason Universal tyres have less tread than rear tyres is, because they are Universal, they have to be applicable for front tyre fitment. Front tyres have less tread because a too deep tread will affect stability (the tread pattern will allow squirming / movement).

So, IMHO I think your other suggestion is the way Avon should go; make a dedicated 19”rear.
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They did, but dropped it a couple of years ago. A 4.00 x 19.
 
I don’t know that Ken. Wonder why they dropped it? Lack of demand I guess? But then again, they clearly didn’t communicate very well to the market.
 
Fast Eddie said:
I don’t know that Ken. Wonder why they dropped it? Lack of demand I guess? But then again, they clearly didn’t communicate very well to the market.
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It had something like 7mm of tread instead of 4mm. I always meant to try one but I'm very happy with my setup. And then, they were gone.
 
Looking back on my notes for my Interstate, I am getting about 6000 miles per tire change out from beginning of life on the front wheel to end of life on the rear where the wear bars are gone. I even got that with a Super Venom which I wanted to burn up because of the date of manufacture on the tire was over 5 years. I just used it on the rear only from new and got 6102 miles as a rear tire mount. It got quite squirmy in the rain at end of life. I don't know what your roads are like in the UK Madnorton but 3000 miles? Is your paved road that much more aggressive a compound ? I'm a 180 lbs and with leathers and helmet= 200# added to the sprung weight of the bike. That is my average mileage per tire. As a matter of fact I am changing out my front tire right now this weekend. I have seen posted pictures of rubber separation from Avon Roadriders but never ever experienced this first hand on any of the tires I have installed or removed.
cheers,
Thomas
 
Thomas, so that's 6000 miles for a tire that spends the first three or four thousand miles on the front?
Probably equates to about 4000 on rear only, which is what my current tire managed.
The other option besides moving front to rear is just fit a new rear. It looks like 2 rear tires will nicely wear out one front.
Same cost overall either way, but a little less tire changing.


Glen
 
worntorn said:
Thomas, so that's 6000 miles for a tire that spends the first three or four thousand miles on the front?
Probably equates to about 4000 on rear only, which is what my current tire managed.
The other option besides moving front to rear is just fit a new rear. It looks like 2 rear tires will nicely wear out one front.
Same cost overall either way, but a little less tire changing.


Glen
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Glen,
You want the tread on the front, which is more important. I would not want to ride to the wear bar point with the Avons on a front. What I am doing is maximizing the AM26 universals for what they are good for which is good handling. Yes the universals are a compromise tire which has it's good points and bad. They are soft and the tread depth is shallow for a rear. If Avon made a dedicated rear tire in 19" then I would be one to test them for the classic bikes.
I spent this long weekend afternoon changing my tires and doing an oil change and filter change. Nothing interfered with my life's time being too short. I could have just mowed the f@cking lawn. One of the things that I have noticed in Access Norton forum is that there is about 10-12 Norton commando owners who actually put serious mileage on their bikes. Others I wonder if they put 200 per year. Looking at another thread about a bent rim, I am almost certain that tire on that rim is a Super Venom which was discontinued 10 years ago. Its not even close the to wear bar.
All the best.
Cheers,
Thomas
 
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Fast Eddie said:
It’s not only high mileage highway use that uses up tyre life BTW, they get pretty badly chewed up, as apposed to worn out, in track use.
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You probably live life more in a dozen laps of the track on your Commando than droning down a highway for 1000's of miles in a near straight line.

The Contenental's look interesting.
 
Time Warp,
you have not been to Deal's Gap have you?
Smoky mountains, Blue ridge PW. The roads are there some very technical. You don't have to be on a race track....but it is much safer. the traffic is all moving in the same direction.
IMHO.
I was also interested in the Continentals
Cheers,
Thomas
 
Thomas, I am from the Shaky Isles, where Deals Gap would be regarded as the direct route.

If you google 19 inch tyres there are a reasonable amount available if you want to bend the rules (fronts on rear etc)
Only Continental seem to do dedicated pairs in close to modern technology, if the Avon's (street) cease production maybe they (Continental) will put more development into their range (even though 19" rears have to be a small market share)

http://www.motorcycletyresplus.com..../front/continental-classic-attack-front-rear/
 
Time Warp said:
Thomas, I am from the Shaky Isles, where Deals Gap would be regarded as the direct route.

If you google 19 inch tyres there are a reasonable amount available if you want to bend the rules (fronts on rear etc)
Only Continental seem to do dedicated pairs in close to modern technology, if the Avon's (street) cease production maybe they (Continental) will put more development into their range (even though 19" rears have to be a small market share)

http://www.motorcycletyresplus.com..../front/continental-classic-attack-front-rear/
Click to expand...
Sorry Time Warp,
Its a place in the U S and the road is know as the Dragon,s Tail or tail of the dragon. 318 curves in 11 miles. You tube it and you will get the drift.
Very technical road.
Cheers, Thomas.
 
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