Are the parts people just getting older and grumpier?

Yesterday I tried to order some parts from Old Britts. I had a long list of little bits including Dave Comeau's clutch pushrod seals, one each for Commando and Dommie. I see that his seals are available at a number of Norton parts suppliers, including Norvil and Walridge, so I thought that with Old Britts being a fairly comprehensive and progressive type supplier, they might have them as well. Since I thought I needed some of their ground clutch spacer plates, (I'll make my own instead) Old Britts seemed the logical company to call on.
I spoke with the lady there, and she suggested I call Dave Comeau directly for the seals then added " I don't know why you are calling us when we don't have it"
Nice.
Because you are a Norton parts supplier and this is a rather neat little part for Nortons, one that Norvil and Walridge have seen fit to give a Norton like part number to! Why make the customer pay for shipping from two sources when it woukd be easy enough to stock this tiny item and chuck it in with the main order?
I got out of that conversation and called Walridge. No problem, they have the seals and had all the other parts, but when reading the order back to me, I had to correct the parts lady. I asked for a parts book for a 1975 Mk3 and she had entered a parts book for a 1973 Commando instead. Yes, I have been getting by using Norvils search feature, I am one of those morally decrepit types who think they can own a Commando without springing for the parts book. But I am trying to change my ways!
Maybe that is why I was in the doghouse so easily.
When I corrected her, she was quite irritated and claimed I had told her 1973. I'm easily confused on many issues and might sometimes forget important dates, but know the model year of my bike with absolute certainty.
So we parted unhappy with one another. I did place the order tho, because at the end of the day, I need the parts!

Happily, the Venhill lady in the UK was cheery as could be. She was completely tolerant and helpful with my lack of knowledge regarding their products.

Glen

Yeah, might be you. :mrgreen:

Ella is one of the nicest people in the world. Old Britts has a comprehensive website that not only includes part numbers but inventory. If you had just looked you would have seen that they don't carry it. :|

Seemed obvious to her that if Dave Comeau sells it why wouldn't you just buy it from him. :mrgreen:

in answer to your question - maybe, but I'd also add that the riders/owners of nortons are getting older, more senile, and grumpier (if thats possible) too

I've dealt with Ella/old britts for at least 15 years and always found them to be great - but i also don't expect them to have everything under the sun that's not an "official" norvil part just like i don't expect Phil at fairspares to carry everything either. You like walridge, great order from them why complain here?

also i am willing to bet they continually get people calling that have no parts numbers and a convoluted hobot description of the item wanted, in addition to complaining about the cost of the new parts -

just go ride your bike glen, have a beer - chill out!

The thing is, I have been senile for years, but up until now most everyone tolerated it! :mrgreen:

Dave, I did not realize that they only have what is shown online. In dealing with Walridge, it is quite the opposite, their catalogue shows about three thousand items plus they have another three thousand or so that are not in the catalogue.
So my fault for not understanding their system I guess. And really, why not have the whole inventory online (the Old Britts way)
With the Walridge method, they encourage you to ask about parts that are not shown in the catalogue, which just takes more lookup time for them.
Yeah, I have dealt with Ella in the past and it went well, maybe it's just me.
Don't know about the Walridge lady though, it seems that I just have a special way of irritating her.

It's like my friend with the Bakery Equipment business says, "I would have a great business if it wasn't for having to deal with all of these customers!

Glen

worntorn said:

It's like my friend with the Bakery Equipment business says, "I would have a great business if it wasn't for having to deal with all of these customers!

Glen

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That goes for any business!

Other peoples children, sheesh I tell ya.

I always do the online order from OldBritts, I have called a few times and they were always friendly. But everyone has bad days now and again.

She probably just got off the phone with a captain success, and didn't have time to reset for you.

The worst problem with this planet we are on is all the dam people :lol:

Basically you guys across the wrong side of the pond are spoilt. Here in the UK we expect to be treated like sh*t and we are only here to keep the supplier in business. Once you accept that then everything's fine.

RGM and Hemmings are good here but never buy from a man with a beard...

A good friend recently pointed out that in building my special I have angered the following:
1.Patrick Godet- initially happy to supply magnesium cases then suddenly refused to sell me anything since " his technology was only for his customers" I guess 10 k in cases and covers does not make one a customer!

2. Bob Newby. Bob gave me a quote of 485 gbp for his belt drive. A year late I ordered it, he built it ( a one off ) but said there was a small price increase. Final price was 625 gbp. I pointed out that this was a 25% increase and the war began. He wanted to keep his clutch, but in the end we worked it out ( I paid in full and blessed the ground he walks on )
3. Andy Molnar of Molnar Manx. He supplied the cases. Unfortunately a series of mistakes by others resulted in him sending me the cases, then learning that the bank draft I sent had been cancelled by my bank. OOPS. He is easily annoyed so this caused a real explosion, can't say I blame him. Got it sorted though. Don't know if I would go there again, but probably would, it's a great product.
4. Mildly annoyed Terry Prince by questioning his recommended valve guide clearances for his supplied heads with Colsibro guides. Were are OK tho, I am still a customer!

There may be others and I'm not done yet! :mrgreen:

Glen

worntorn said:

A good friend recently pointed out that in building my special I have angered the following:
1.Patrick Godet- initially happy to supply magnesium cases then suddenly refused to sell me anything since " his technology was only for his customers" I guess 10 k in cases and covers does not make one a customer!

2. Bob Newby. Bob gave me a quote of 485 gbp for his belt drive. A year late I ordered it, he built it ( a one off ) but said there was a small price increase. Final price was 625 gbp. I pointed out that this was a 25% increase and the war began. He wanted to keep his clutch, but in the end we worked it out ( I paid in full and blessed the ground he walks on )
3. Andy Molnar of Molnar Manx. He supplied the cases. Unfortunately a series of mistakes by others resulted in him sending me the cases, then learning that the bank draft I sent had been cancelled by my bank. OOPS. He is easily annoyed so this caused a real explosion, can't say I blame him. Got it sorted though. Don't know if I would go there again, but probably would, it's a great product.
4. Mildly annoyed Terry Prince by questioning his recommended valve guide clearances for his supplied heads with Colsibro guides. Were are OK tho, I am still a customer!

There may be others and I'm not done yet! :mrgreen:

Glen

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I'm seeing a trend...

Ella is golden in my book! I bought a parts book and have never had a problem with Old Britts. As for everybody else, that's a different story.... Poor accounting, deadlines missed by weeks or months, quality control issues, lack of communication, and yes grumpy people occasionally. Still waiting to hear back from Clubmen???? Lucky for you Glen, you've got 3 Vincent's and a sweet 650ss to take your frustrations out on.

Sun is coming out and the temps are mild, some poor old bike is going to get a thrashing over this!

Glen

"Ella is golden in my book! I bought a parts book and have never had a problem with Old Britts."

Concur re Old Bitts - often I don't even use a parts book. I just send an email saying I need the XYZ parts for a 73 Commando and the parts all show up quickly and that's that. If something isn't right, they will immediately send a replacement or offer to sort through parts and ensure one with the proper specs is sent. Once I recieved a new set of piston rings that would not gap to specs; Fred offered to go through sets of rings until he found a set that would gap to specs in my bores.

Other suppliers just tell you that somehow it is your fault. Yeah - like the piston rings supplied for a specific bore won't gap properly in that size bore and that's MY Fault? I totally agree with the comment that some suppliers act as if I exist to keep them in business. Ok, I can feel a rant coming on so I'll stop now.

This story reminds me of a parable:

An old man is tending his orchard on the side of a road. As he's working, a traveler passes and stops to ask a question:

"Old man, what can you tell me about the town up ahead? What are the people like?"

Old Man replies, "What were the people like were you came from?"

Traveler says, "They were a sorry lot: petty, selfish and nosy. I couldn't wait to get away from them."

Old man replies, "I'm sorry to say you'll find the same in the town up ahead."

Muttering, the traveler trudges ahead.

A short while later, another traveler passes and stops.

"Pardon me, grandfather. Can you tell me what the people are like in the town just ahead?"

Old man replies,"What were the people like where you came from, my boy?"

Traveler replies,"They were wonderful: generous, caring, and helpful. I hope my travels bring me back there someday."

Old man replies, "I'm happy to say you'll find the same here!"

Moral: You get what you give

Sometimes, sometimes not.

Patrick Godet had no problem with me when I was building a Special of some sort. He was happy to take my money. He changed his mind after I sent him a progress photo. My bike, tho different in a hundred ways from his product, does have some similarities, they are both based on the original Egli. His is a near replica, mine is a mile off, but still could be considered competition, so that was that, I was no longer a customer.

Andy Molnar became enraged at me when my local post office screwed up by weighing my UK bound envelope containing bank draft, charging me postage on same, then dropping the letter into their system without ever stamping it post paid! About a month later it showed up in my mailbox, and Andy was on the warpath.


Bob Newby did not like being questioned on a 25% price jump. I reserve the right to question that size of single increase, my Government keeps telling me annual inflation is hovering around 2%.

So I think some of it at least is down to the old Grumpy problem. And if you don't believe people tend to get a bit short tempered as they age, pi$$ off! :mrgreen:


Glen

Duh DynoDaves seal is not exactly a china sourced mass produced item and is not really a world wide supplied Norton part and has no Norton part number to carry any more than Comstocks variety of special reed valves are. Dyno's seal is only like a decade old. Ella and Fred know their Nortons just can't carry every new specialty item so guess how the inquirer sounded to them. Waldridge is pretty good to go out their way to source a one in a row part form special limited sources over seas if need be but must expect delay and extra cost. This post will allow me to tease em on next order asking for a pair of Comeau's seals and Landownes forks and Comstock EFI to go with the chopper forks, which they might actually have on hand.

Duh, Dave's seal has indeed been given a Norton type part number and is available internationally (06-8833 for the Commando part at Norvil, RGM and Walridge) and is found at some other Norton Parts hangouts as well. From my reading I think he has sent something like 4000 of them out into the world now, both from his own sales and thru the usual Norton parts outlets. Maybe not china volume but a pretty substantial number and I'll bet there are a lot more to go.
Given the number of Norton parts suppliers that do carry it, I didn't think it was a dumb question to ask if Old Britts also carried it so that it could be added to my order there.
Now that I understand their online system, I see there is no point in calling about a part not listed online, they don't have it.

In the future I can just use their online ordering setup.

Glen

worntorn said:

Yesterday I tried to order some parts from Old Britts. I had a long list of little bits including Dave Comeau's clutch pushrod seals, one each for Commando and Dommie. I see...d of the day, I need the parts!

Happily, the Venhill lady in the UK was cheery as could be. She was completely tolerant and helpful with my lack of knowledge regarding their products.

Glen

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Glen,

It seems you've angered a few here for the unforgivable sin of speaking ill of OB. I'll agree that both Ella and Fred are normally very pleasant and helpful, but I've also seen each of them get a little testy at times for no good reason. Excuses can be made that maybe you didn't do enough homework before you called... maybe Ella was on the rag that day... maybe she was constipated, or maybe a box of pistons fell off the shelf on to her head right before you called... but that's what they are... excuses. If you have a mail order/phone in business you owe it to your customers to treat them in a polite manner every single time they call, even if they don't own a parts catalog and even if they didn't search the exploded diagram on your website properly before they made the call. If you had made this complaint about Mitch Klempf I would have thought I'd stepped into an alternate universe, as he is a guy who could be going through a bad IRS audit and a divorce at the precise time you called and would still treat you with patience and respect. However, I have to admit, hearing this about OB doesn't shock me. I still like them and will still order from them, but I don't like the idea that once in a blue moon I might get treated with less respect than I myself would give them were the roles reversed. I'll put my flak jacket on now and wait for the fall out from friends and fans of OB.

swooshdave said:

Yeah, might be you. :mrgreen:

Ella is one of the nicest people in the world. Old Britts has a comprehensive website that not only includes part numbers but inventory. If you had just looked you would have seen that they don't carry it. :|

Seemed obvious to her that if Dave Comeau sells it why wouldn't you just buy it from him. :mrgreen:

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+1. If you got under Ella's skin, you really musta worked at it. She's a MASTER AT HER CRAFT!

Nah, it wasn't that big of a deal, I just came away with the sense that I should not have bothered her, which given that the info is all on the site, is fair enough.
Then when the Walridge lady got shirty (Ella didn't really) I got thinking it is just like my Trade (woodwork, building) Most of the guys working at it are getting on and it shows. Young guys (and girls) seem to have gone into occupations that involve keyboards rather than toolbags. The work quality with us older guys is still good, but much of the good humour and tolerance of youth seems to have evaporated. Gotta try to hang onto that or get it back somehow.

It seems that the sales staff at Walridge are probably overworked. Everytime I call there they are up to their armpits in it and Mike has hundreds of email questions waiting to be answered. They do get the stuff out promptly and they have an incredible amount of stock, including all of the Dommie stuff that used to be so hard to find. If you happen to have a Beezer, a Triumph, or a Matchless/AJS, they have parts for those as well.

There to, the stuff can be ordered online, though only a fraction of the Dommie stuff is shown in their catalogue, so you are back to bothering them with phone calls for that, no way around it.

Glen

"maybe Ella was on the rag that day... maybe she was constipated, or maybe a box of pistons fell off the shelf on to her head right before you called... but that's what they are... excuses."

I think perhaps the point that you are less an Old Britts fan than many of us could have been made without the insulting personal comments...