Are full face helmets really safer than open face helmets

I was just reading a thread this morning and someone commented on about reconstruction of riders face because they wear open face helmets, well I have been riding for over 45 years now and have always mostly ride with my open face helmets, yes I do have a full face motorcross helmet for riding my powerful dirt bike and I have a flip top helmet for traveling and rainy days and I have had full face helmets that don't flip up, but I just love my open face helmet, its only been the last few years that I travel with the fliptop helmet.
I have been down the road a few times on my Norton with my open face helmet in the 43 years of owning it, once at 70 mph in a corner and the front wheel spat out from grave and ended up in a ditch and a few other slower incounters but my face is still ugly and have servived each encounter, had more injuries to the body, arms and knee, my last incounter with the road was about 5 or 6 years ago when the Norton orginal front brakes decided to lock up and throw me over the handle bars with my open face, the face servived but frautured my left arm and broken left thumb, so far haven't been down with the flip face and of course always coming off on the dirt bike, just from doing silly things on it.
But one night my best mate was killed riding a friends bike and pushing it to fast through a S bend just about 500 meters from my place, he was wearing a full face helmet, he always worn a open face helmet on his old AJS 500 single so was not normal for him to be wearing a fullface helmet, but there was no injuries to be found on his body but what got him was the front chin guard of the full face hit his chest which corused his neck to break killing him instantly.
Why I like wearing my open face over all my other helmets is I have better vision, able to turn my head side ways more than I can with a full face, hear things better, don't feel like I am trapped in side a closed space and cooler in our hot summers, I am sure I have other reasons as well.
So are open face more dangerous than a full face helmet, a serious accident is going to kill you whether wearing a full face or open face and wearing my open face I see more things that are going around me more so than the full face, but wearing a open face in heavy rain is not so great thats why I travel with the full face as if I run into rain it don't stop me when traveling only to put my wet weather gear on of course.
We all have our faviorte helmets of course and of course we all think one is safer than the other, but to me having a well fit helmet and of course getting the right helmet is hard these days as you really don't get a really good idea trying them on in a bikes shop and having them wear into your head shape after wearing them for a few days and there are so many to choose from these days and even with my new Triumph Thruxton 1200S I still perfer riding with my open face and good pair of sunnies for the reasons I have given, but really are full face really safer than open face, but the best thing is not to crash at all, but think about it first and not just say full face are safer, are they really.

Ashley

Riding with a pal many years ago, approaching a traffic signal - maybe 20 mph - he lost the front wheel in radiator coolant some car left there. Open face helmet, not real dramatic - but he contacted the road with his cheek bone. Many bones broken - eye socket - he was a mess for two years after that "small" get-off.
Over a certain speed whatever style helmet you wear matters less - the helmet is wearing you.
I wear a full face helmet when I ride.

Back in the early '70s I crashed wearing an open face Bell helmet in a race at Sears Point Raceway (California) and ground my chin down to the bone. I went with a full face for the replacement, and have been using them ever since. I've thought about going back to an open face helmet, for all the reasons Ashley mentions above, but keep remembering the bloody mess, and can't bring myself to do it.

I suspect the injury and survival statistics are better for the full face helmet, and I assume that's the reason all the road race organizations (at least all that I know of) require them.

Still, for the road, it is a personal choice, and it's clear that for many riders the positive aspects of the open face helmets outweigh the increased risk.

Ken

The first time I raced, I fell off at the end of the front straight at Calder Raceway in front of my two young sons - when I locked the front brake in the wet, however I rolled a bit before I slid. I had my arms tucked in, in front of me - however my fist was still driven into my face, giving me a fat lip and I copped a very deep bruise to my fore-arm. Also - at Winton Raceway, I once saw another rider face-down in the mud with his full face helmet full of it, with the visor missing. To get killed while road-racing - once you are past your crash and burn stage, you have to be very unlucky, because most of the risks are minimised to a tolerable level. The first few rides are the most dangerous, so if you are smart, you force yourself to go slow at first and work up. - I did not do that, because I thought I could ride a motorcycle.
The good thing about falling off in front of your kids, is you never have to watch them road-racing.

I don't ride on public roads because it is far more dangerous than road-racing. In road-racing the drivers of the other vehicles are not texting on their mobile phones - they are too busy concentrating on not crashing.

Like I have said we all have our choose for what we feel safe in but my question is are full face really safer, yes the risk of getting your chin gashed up and other damage from the open face hitting the road, the chin gaurd from the full face could or will save your chin, but my best mate broke his neck and died from the chin part of the full face hitting his chest, would he have servived if he was wearing his open face, who knows as we will never know but it makes me think.
I do have a scar on my chin from going down on the road from my younger days and first time down on bitumen, but since that time and the few other times after that going down my first reaction is to turn my head so the side of my open face hits the road and not my chin.
A full face helmet goes completely around your neck, a open face goes around say just over half your neck and the open face at the back is slightly up a angle from the side, to me the risk of getting a snap neck wearing a full face compaired to a open face is more, but I am not going to find out lol but it makes me think about it.
I put this to a few mates while on our last monthly ride and stopped for breaky, my mates all ride with full face and most of the time I am in my open face, they all gave me the same reason full face is safer but after thinking about what I said put to them it gave them something to think about it.
I put this to a good mate I have known since school and he is a paramedic in the amulance service for over 30 years now and he told me most bike accidents where neck injuries was involved the riders were wearing full face helmets and the ones wearing open face had injuries other than neck, it has even now made him think about it as he never really thought about it before I asked him, he is also a motorcycle rider.
My point about this thread is not what you think is safer to wear but what is really safer with neck injuries, but of course not all accidents or death involve neck or head injuries from bike accidents, but this has been in my head for well over 30 years now.
I have been riding long enough to be aware what is happening around me at all times when out on the bike and the best thing the mates I ride with we been doing it together for over 45 years.

Ashley

There are definitely pros and cons to both, it’s been debated for years!

Many folk point to grazed fronts of their full face lids and say ‘that wudda been my face’. But this isn’t strictly true, the full face lid is heavier, so in a spill is gonna make you head move far more violently, and it sticks out more too.

The facial protection of a full face lid is a factor. Better visibility and less stress on the neck (as mentioned above) is a bennefit to the piss pot.

The majority of bodies do seem to side with full face lids though. As Ken says, many race bodies will not allow open faces any more.

Personally, I use both (no, not at the same time), I tend to use the open face most of the time for short runs, countryside rides, etc. But will don the full face if intending to go far or fast. Interestingly, it’s not really a ‘conscious’ decision, it’s more of a sub conscious thought process.

Not sayin’ it’s right, just that it is what it is !

Its all down to the accident you have, trouble is you cannot predict which type of crash you are going to have and to then pick the right helmet. On the basis the downsides of a open face override the upsides then I have picked full face. Like seat belts it improves overall survival rates but if the car sets fire and the belt buckle jams you will not survive.

Modern open face helmets are very thick and catch a lot of wind.

I find that full face helmets strain my neck less at speed and keep the weather off my face better.

ashman
Depends on the crash really. Comes down to personal preference for me, much better protection from bugs, windblown dust n dirt and the elements, far cosier on long rainy rides like a couple of Saturdays ago across Exmoor and down to South Devon in pouring rain throughout.
In Ieper, Flanders at the mo, the ride from Surrey yesterday was fine but blustery all the way with much leaf litter and matter blowing around, even with a full face got occasional bits in my eyes, open face would have been much worse.
I originally used open face helmets until my first full face around 1990, liked the extra protection especially in the winter and don,t intend going back. I,ve crashed wearing both types but survived unscathed.
My brother lost control of his Bonnie in the early eighties and was hit by a car, tore the chin part of his full face apart but chin and head intact. Didn,t help his broken pelvis where the car ran over him though...
Walks perfectly ever since at the present point in time.

you don't need to crash I hit a bird so hard it damaged the front of my full face flip up helmet I am sure that I would have been knocked out if I had been wearing an open face or worse yet a beany then I would have crashed as it was all that happened was that I killed the bird I will keep my full face thanks

ebyker said:

you don't need to crash I hit a bird so hard it damaged the front of my full face flip up helmet I am sure that I would have been knocked out if I had been wearing an open face or worse yet a beany then I would have crashed as it was all that happened was that I killed the bird I will keep my full face thanks

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You were lucky to be a Canadian, aussie ashman could hit an emu bird, might do more than knock him out whatever helmet he wore.

Riding for N-V's development team in the 1960's, full-face helmets were way in the future. In fact, helmets with any built-ins weren't around. I wore a "bone-dome" type, where the sides came down past my ears, but my visor was an add-on, as was my cold-weather face mask.

In development test riding, we didn't get to choose the good-weather days. It was 5 or 6 days a week, 8 hours a day. Initially, we rode a figure 8 route that kept us within 50 miles of the factory. As reliability improved we started going further afield. My favorites were North Wales and the Lake District. We aimed for 500 miles in 8 hours, but we usually missed the target by 50 or 60. There were no blanket speed limits then, other than 30 mph in towns. I'm still amazed that I survived almost 2 years! N-V died not long after I left.

We emigrated to Washington State to a job for me at Boeing in July '68. I put in almost 28 years there, with just a short break (2 1/2 years at NASA) after Boeing's big downturn in late 1970. It went from a workforce of 103,000 when I joined to 36,000 about 6 months after I got laid off. I got fed up of my heavy travel schedule over the final few years (almost 500,000 frequent flyer miles on 12 different airlines) and retired at the age of 58. I just passed the 20 years mark as a retiree last month.

Our Aussie birds are pretty smart and avoid being hit the ones we got to be worried about is Magpies in matting season they sneak up behind you, its Magpie season now, its the way of life this time of year and the other ones to look out for is kangaroos, I hit one of them in my younger days while racing another Norton riding mate, it missed my mate and got me at 105mph didn't come off but had a big wobble down the road before pulling up as for the kangaroo two leaps and it was gone it was a big red standing in the middle of the road they are about 7' standing, we just came over a rise and there he was, pulled up and had to clean out my pants lol, hit one of them straight on and no helmet will save you, just lucky he jumped me side on, no damage to the bike or myself, they have killed people in cars, thats why bull bars were invented in Australia.

Ashley

Crash stats
There is little doubt a full-face lid is safer in a crash. The Icon Airframe helmet even includes crash statistics printed on the shell to show the likelihood of that part of your head hitting the tar in a crash. The chin bar area hits the ground in 19.4% of crashes!

speirmoor said:

Crash stats
There is little doubt a full-face lid is safer in a crash. The Icon Airframe helmet even includes crash statistics printed on the shell to show the likelihood of that part of your head hitting the tar in a crash. The chin bar area hits the ground in 19.4% of crashes!

Click to expand...

Well if you want to use statistics and if you beleive a campany that is trying to sell their product, well I really like to know how many death or serous injuries to neck and spines and what helmets were involved, I say that most statistics will not have which helmets were involved, yes a full face will save your chin, but my interest is serous neck injuries to death, maybe I am thinking to much but its been in my head for so long, each helmet has its place as any safety gear we wear.
I have a few helmets for different purposes, I wear a heavy well made leather jacket, I wear leather high bike boots under my jeans, I don't like gloves as I like to feel my bike and when I do wear gloves they are fingerless even in winter I only wear woolly warm fingerless gloves, I sometimes in our very hot climate I might wear my leather vest instead of my heavy leather jacket but not on big rides.
I have been riding for 46 years now, I have been very lucky in that time but have had 3 left knee injuries from bikes and a cars hitting me, I still have my ugly face, all my fingers and legs, I have only had my first broken bone ever in the last 5 years when my Norton spat me over the handle bars, not bad for a soon to be 60 years old.
We all take risk riding our bikes its all part of the life style we live, I don't intend having a crash when out on the bikes, in fact I never think about it and the injuries I have suffered from accidents never involved my open face while wearing it at the time.
As for racing motorcycles yes they are riding at speeds that we would not do on our roads and of course safety standard are a lot more stricter in what a racer can wear these days.

Ashley

speirmoor said:

Crash stats
There is little doubt a full-face lid is safer in a crash. The Icon Airframe helmet even includes crash statistics printed on the shell to show the likelihood of that part of your head hitting the tar in a crash. The chin bar area hits the ground in 19.4% of crashes!

Click to expand...

Hmmm, the article says “The numbers you see on the helmet represent the crash statistics for that part of the helmet to be damaged in an accident”.

Really? In all my crashes, no one that I’m aware of has ever turned up to measure and record the damage on my helmet!

Seriously, what was their data source and how accurate is it (rhetorical question)?

Also, as I eluded to earlier, just because the chin piece touches the floor on a full face lid, does not mean your chin would have with an open face.

I’m in no way anti full face, but this helmet with statistics is clearly just a marketing gimmick.

I think racing gives an indication of the effectiveness of full face helmets. Head injuries are extremely rare nowadays as are neck injuries. Arai used to claim that nobody had suffered a serious head injury wearing one of their full face helmets. No idea if they still say that. Arai also won't make a flip front helmet as they don't think they are as safe as full face.

I'm now on my third Arai and am obviously a fan. I used to wear Bell full faces but they lost their way a bit sadly so I switched to Arai. I do have an open face but don't wear it often.

Ian

Nortoniggy said:

I think racing gives an indication of the effectiveness of full face helmets. Head injuries are extremely rare nowadays as are neck injuries.

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The problem with that statement is that it goes beyond the helmet discussion.

Modern top riders all have extremely high end one piece suits, humps on their back to prevent whiplash and airbags built into their suits.

THAT is why there are so few neck injuries.

And with the odd exception... I don't see many people riding thus equipped on the road. Least of all, anyone on vintage Norton's...!

Donning a Moto GP style helmet... with an old leather jacket and some Levis, ain't gonna give quite the same overall effect.