Another point of view on oils, ect

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No reliable comprehensive information had been available for this capability comparison, until I began my dynamic motor oil testing, under load, at a representative operating temperature. I perform those Engineering Wear Protection Tests to find out where the motor oil film strength, load carrying capability, shear resistance “limits” are for each individual motor oil.
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Very full of himself, this was tested 7 days a week 365 days a year in the Glacier Bearings test labs using different oils. This was both for new materials development and also to feed data into the modeling software the application engineers used to check the design of the bearings being offered to the customer. This was able to show the effect of the oil holes being in different positions, on one engine the customer had specified a centre hole, when modelled it showed it created a break in the oil film at certain revs which would result in bearing failure. They disagreed (suited their block production line to keep the position), we made the bearings, fitted them to an engine and tested it with predictable results, they then agreed to change the position of the oil hole and reengineer the line. Other bearing makers did exactly the same.

This does not change the validity of his info, just the level of bullshit and his motivation ;)

PS Fuchs oils where always the best of those that were used.
 
Well I use Silkolene 10/60W fully synthetic in my 850 (fuchs use Silkolene as a brand), and I only mentioned Fuchs as that was the oil the test engineers found worked best but all the engines were water cooled auto engines. I found if you email them they always get back to you, last time was a query over o ring material compatibility with their fork oils.
 
kommando said:
Well I use Silkolene 10/60W fully synthetic in my 850 (fuchs use Silkolene as a brand), and I only mentioned Fuchs as that was the oil the test engineers found worked best but all the engines were water cooled auto engines. I found if you email them they always get back to you, last time was a query over o ring material compatibility with their fork oils.
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I would like to have seen his results using Silkolene - not that I am fully convinced of his test's validity.

I have been considering switching from Mobil 1, v-twin to Silkolene just to see what happens. After seeing his results with v-twin oil I think I will order up some Silkolene 10-60. Jim
 
It seems to me that multigrade oil is the way to go and Ive been using it for a long time. In fact when
airplanes went to it I figured it made sense. Oil needs to be thin for easy starting and fast circulation
when cold. It needs to have good strength when it gets hot. Straight weight seems to be less than
optimal.
Now which oil really is best, that is type and brand, I suppose we simply dont know.
 
I use Motul full syn 10w60 in the Guzzi .... seems to do the job plus I like the color ... would simplify things if I switched the Norton to that oil , would be interested to hear results of the 10w60 in Commandos .... Norton and Ducati share same K&N oil filters and Griso and Norton would share motor oil .... cool ...
Craig
 
Like a test for PHD in motor oil testing. Found what I have been using, Castrol 20/50 GTX at 96,514. That is all I need to know. I always thought that it was a bunch of crap regarding the zinc content of the oil. Nice to see confirmation from someone who knows way more than I do. Good read if you have a few days. Thanks for posting.
 
aceaceca said:
Like a test for PHD in motor oil testing. Found what I have been using, Castrol 20/50 GTX at 96,514. That is all I need to know. I always thought that it was a bunch of crap regarding the zinc content of the oil. Nice to see confirmation from someone who knows way more than I do. Good read if you have a few days. Thanks for posting.
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OK, but if you want to see the opposite view here is another opinion.


http://www.sportrider.com/oils-well-ends-well-part-1
 
comnoz said:
kommando said:
Well I use Silkolene 10/60W fully synthetic in my 850 (fuchs use Silkolene as a brand), and I only mentioned Fuchs as that was the oil the test engineers found worked best but all the engines were water cooled auto engines. I found if you email them they always get back to you, last time was a query over o ring material compatibility with their fork oils.
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I would like to have seen his results using Silkolene - not that I am fully convinced of his test's validity.

I have been considering switching from Mobil 1, v-twin to Silkolene just to see what happens. After seeing his results with v-twin oil I think I will order up some Silkolene 10-60. Jim
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Why? Wouldnt 10W60 simply be too thick?

Taking his recommendation only, 20W50 Castrol GTX would be the better choice?
 
comnoz said:
OK, but if you want to see the opposite view here is another opinion.
http://www.sportrider.com/oils-well-ends-well-part-1
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"This article originally appeared in the August, 2003 issue of Sport Rider."
Jim - I think the age of this article limits its usefulness.

Also considering switching from 20/50 V-twin to 5/30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability.
He makes a very good case for the thinner multi-grade oils.
Just concerned that the thinner oil will tend to 'migrate' to places that I do not want it - like my dry primary.

20/50 Castrol GTX looks like a better choice than V-twin (based on his tests) too.
 
Why? Wouldnt 10W60 simply be too thick?

Taking his recommendation only, 20W50 Castrol GTX would be the better choice?[/quote]

I have used 10-60 Nanodrive from Miller oils before and it worked fine. Oil consumption was higher than the
Mobil 1 v-twin oil I had been using.
It is recommended for very high temperatures or where fuel contamination is present. It could have been nice when I rode over the San Rafael Swell in Utah on the way home from Quincy. The temp was around 115 degrees.

I ordered up some Silkolene 20-50 full synthetic to try. I have generally been pretty happy with Silkolene products in the past. Jim

PS, I think the thinner oils he recommends would be more applicable to water cooled engines where the oil temps are moderated. When I have tried thinner oils in the past in my Norton oil consumption was a problem.
 
OK, thanks. Here in NZ it never gets much hotter than 90F.

Maybe you should send a quart of the Siklolene to the guy to test? ;-)
 
I first came across 10/60 being used in classic Ford Escort MK1 rallying in Scotland, they were having major problems with finishing a rally with enough oil in the sump. The oil was disappearing into the combustion chamber as the eng temps rose, they had over tuned the engines and were not getting rid of the heat. Once they started using 10/60W the oil stayed in the engine, the thicker oil at high temps allowed the piston rings to do their job.

This was a Miller 10/60, I started using it 10 years ago, now on an oil change instead of a furry magnet there is nothing at all so engine wear is now insignificant, have now moved onto Silkolene and will see if that is as good. In use the oil at normal temp is thinner than a 20/50 so gets to the moving parts quicker, at high temps it does not thin out as much and stays thicker than a 20/50 at high temps when you need it.

Another point of view on oils, ect
 
For "normal" operation how hot does the Commando run? Perhaps 20-50 is a good middle ground.
A bit heavy for start up and perhaps a bit thin for max temp but OK for "normal".
Just as a point of interest, my 1940 Buick manual recommended straight 20w for all but very cold
operation. Most people used 30w back then but I suspect Buick was correct in knowing the lighter
oil was better for starting and short trips (long trips back then were not as common as today)
and the speed limit was generally lower anyway.
I run 15-40 Rotella in my Trident (1973,not the new one) and it does seem to use more oil
than 20-50 but it also has a oil cooler so I figure it is ok.
 
I tried some Valvoline VR1 racing oil straight 50 when I was in the Montana/Wyoming August heat a couple of years ago. The bike had some other brand 20-50 in it on the ride down. As the heat went up the oil consumption went up and I also realized it was due for an oil change anyway.
Consumption dropped dramatically with the straight 50 weight. I went from using a quart in 700 miles to a few ounces in a thousand miles.
Got home and read up on the VR1 racing oil.
It seemed to be right for the old engines, lots of zddp and tested well in a couple of oil tests. It's not overly expensive and readily available when out touring (Napa)
I've been running the same stuff in 20-50 at cooler temps. Will switch back to the straight 50 when going into that 100 degree heat again.

Glen
 
worntorn said:
I tried some Valvoline VR1 racing oil straight 50 when I was in the Montana/Wyoming August heat a couple of years ago. The bike had some other brand 20-50 in it on the ride down. As the heat went up the oil consumption went up and I also realized it was due for an oil change anyway.
Consumption dropped dramatically with the straight 50 weight. I went from using a quart in 700 miles to a few ounces in a thousand miles.
Got home and read up on the VR1 racing oil.
It seemed to be right for the old engines, lots of zddp and tested well in a couple of oil tests. It's not overly expensive and readily available when out touring (Napa)
I've been running the same stuff in 20-50 at cooler temps. Will switch back to the straight 50 when going into that 100 degree heat again.

Glen
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He rates the 10W30 VR1 really well, send him a bottle of the 20W50! ;-)
 
worntorn said:
I tried some Valvoline VR1 racing oil straight 50 when I was in the Montana/Wyoming August heat a couple of years ago. The bike had some other brand 20-50 in it on the ride down. As the heat went up the oil consumption went up and I also realized it was due for an oil change anyway.
Consumption dropped dramatically with the straight 50 weight. I went from using a quart in 700 miles to a few ounces in a thousand miles.
Got home and read up on the VR1 racing oil.
It seemed to be right for the old engines, lots of zddp and tested well in a couple of oil tests. It's not overly expensive and readily available when out touring (Napa)
I've been running the same stuff in 20-50 at cooler temps. Will switch back to the straight 50 when going into that 100 degree heat again.

Glen
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That would indicate to me that the multi-vis oil is not handling the temp well.

20 -50 and straight 50 should be the same viscosity at 100C. Jim
 
The 20/50 that was running thru the engine was a different brand,(I think Pennsoil) so it wasn't a perfect test.
I should try the same thing again starting out with VR1 20/50 then switching to the monograde VR1 50 weight.

Glen
 
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