Factory visit April 1st 2022

Clive

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Ok I have to say that despite it being April the First this is not an April Fools Day joke, unlike the assembly process of Old New Norton. Thank you New New Norton for the hospitality and factory visit I have just returned from; last time it was to see the new facilities waiting to be used but now there are real people making real parts and it is £$** impressive. I mean REALLY £$** impressive. The investment in equipment has been massive and most of it seems to be test and measuring equipment. Like probe scanners which can scan a complete frame and a whole clean room full of brand new test kit. A big new dyno. An environmentally sealed engine build area. Vacuum fluid fill station it just goes on and on. There are V4 parts everywhere. A test station where piles of con-rods have been passed and failed. Racks with beautiful polished frames and swingarms. Engines in stages of assembly. The procedures for sample testing that would make you cry - if I remember correctly one in ten beautiful frames are taken for destructive weld testing. QR codes etched onto components for traceability which is recorded down to bolt torque readings. The assembly jigs are also sent through test procedures to validate them against reference frames. A sample finished bike is taken and completely retested with remedial processes in place to ensure that there should be no faults on a bike delivered to a customer. And these V4s are absolutely stunning - like the 961 it is a bike to stand and look at to admire the detail. My Ducati piggy bank has had been replaced with a Norton one! Currently orders and 'expressions on interest' are being taken.

To answer questions in another thread a lot of time has been taken to test ALL components inherited from Old New Norton. And there is a big container of parts ready to be scrapped. And no: there is no way round the legal liabilities so they will be scrapped. An Atlas was sitting in the Norty corner 'as an example of how not to do it' which is destined for a very sad fate. No future plans for the Atlas/Nomad/ superlight.

They have not yet shipped out the build of 961s yet - they are still testing and validating 961 components, remedying faults and buying in new parts. They basically brought in a few owners and compiled a list of known faults. These faults were allocated individually to engineers to fix; eg there is a new output sprocket tab washer which will not fall apart. They also extensively road and track tested the 961 to establish its weaknesses. Their recent emails to customers about not supporting the 961 with spares and servicing is because they found so many variances in parts that they could not guarantee a new validated part would fit a customer's bike. And as soon as they touch a bike they are legally liable. So yes they are buying parts in and working with suppliers and there will be spares on the shelves (5 spares ordered for every 50 bikes built) but they are not validated to fit anything other than their 'new' 961s. So why all this effort for a model which is popular with lots more potential customers especially in a 'fixed' state but about to end? Draw your own conclusions.... Nothing 100% definite but if you really want a new 961 you might want to cancel the taxi to the Triumph dealership.

This is a flagship company for TVS which leverages TVS's buying power so anything produced will swarmed over by inspection rather than bean-counters, which is good for their customers. The current factory is not a temporary 5 year unit but a long term motorcycle industry for Solihull. Yeahhh!

Lots more bits which I will remember over the next few days - Did I mention EVs? Not exactly a headline that a progressive Bike company is looking at EV development. Nothing to see yet though.

Hope this might be useful and interesting and encouraging to Norton brand-loyal customers to learn that the future for Norton looks pretty good. Sorry no pics at moment 'cos lots of secret development work going on. And if this filters through; thanks to Chris and Jason for their valuable time - they are very representative of the great people I have met so far there.
 
Ok I have to say that despite it being April the First this is not an April Fools Day joke, unlike the assembly process of Old New Norton. Thank you New New Norton for the hospitality and factory visit I have just returned from; last time it was to see the new facilities waiting to be used but now there are real people making real parts and it is £$** impressive. I mean REALLY £$** impressive. The investment in equipment has been massive and most of it seems to be test and measuring equipment. Like probe scanners which can scan a complete frame and a whole clean room full of brand new test kit. A big new dyno. An environmentally sealed engine build area. Vacuum fluid fill station it just goes on and on. There are V4 parts everywhere. A test station where piles of con-rods have been passed and failed. Racks with beautiful polished frames and swingarms. Engines in stages of assembly. The procedures for sample testing that would make you cry - if I remember correctly one in ten beautiful frames are taken for destructive weld testing. QR codes etched onto components for traceability which is recorded down to bolt torque readings. The assembly jigs are also sent through test procedures to validate them against reference frames. A sample finished bike is taken and completely retested with remedial processes in place to ensure that there should be no faults on a bike delivered to a customer. And these V4s are absolutely stunning - like the 961 it is a bike to stand and look at to admire the detail. My Ducati piggy bank has had been replaced with a Norton one! Currently orders and 'expressions on interest' are being taken.

To answer questions in another thread a lot of time has been taken to test ALL components inherited from Old New Norton. And there is a big container of parts ready to be scrapped. And no: there is no way round the legal liabilities so they will be scrapped. An Atlas was sitting in the Norty corner 'as an example of how not to do it' which is destined for a very sad fate. No future plans for the Atlas/Nomad/ superlight.

They have not yet shipped out the build of 961s yet - they are still testing and validating 961 components, remedying faults and buying in new parts. They basically brought in a few owners and compiled a list of known faults. These faults were allocated individually to engineers to fix; eg there is a new output sprocket tab washer which will not fall apart. They also extensively road and track tested the 961 to establish its weaknesses. Their recent emails to customers about not supporting the 961 with spares and servicing is because they found so many variances in parts that they could not guarantee a new validated part would fit a customer's bike. And as soon as they touch a bike they are legally liable. So yes they are buying parts in and working with suppliers and there will be spares on the shelves (5 spares ordered for every 50 bikes built) but they are not validated to fit anything other than their 'new' 961s. So why all this effort for a model which is popular with lots more potential customers especially in a 'fixed' state but about to end? Draw your own conclusions.... Nothing 100% definite but if you really want a new 961 you might want to cancel the taxi to the Triumph dealership.

This is a flagship company for TVS which leverages TVS's buying power so anything produced will swarmed over by inspection rather than bean-counters, which is good for their customers. The current factory is not a temporary 5 year unit but a long term motorcycle industry for Solihull. Yeahhh!

Lots more bits which I will remember over the next few days - Did I mention EVs? Not exactly a headline that a progressive Bike company is looking at EV development. Nothing to see yet though.

Hope this might be useful and interesting and encouraging to Norton brand-loyal customers to learn that the future for Norton looks pretty good. Sorry no pics at moment 'cos lots of secret development work going on. And if this filters through; thanks to Chris and Jason for their valuable time - they are very representative of the great people I have met so far there.
Sounds very encouraging.
 
Ok I have to say that despite it being April the First this is not an April Fools Day joke, unlike the assembly process of Old New Norton. Thank you New New Norton for the hospitality and factory visit I have just returned from; last time it was to see the new facilities waiting to be used but now there are real people making real parts and it is £$** impressive. I mean REALLY £$** impressive. The investment in equipment has been massive and most of it seems to be test and measuring equipment. Like probe scanners which can scan a complete frame and a whole clean room full of brand new test kit. A big new dyno. An environmentally sealed engine build area. Vacuum fluid fill station it just goes on and on. There are V4 parts everywhere. A test station where piles of con-rods have been passed and failed. Racks with beautiful polished frames and swingarms. Engines in stages of assembly. The procedures for sample testing that would make you cry - if I remember correctly one in ten beautiful frames are taken for destructive weld testing. QR codes etched onto components for traceability which is recorded down to bolt torque readings. The assembly jigs are also sent through test procedures to validate them against reference frames. A sample finished bike is taken and completely retested with remedial processes in place to ensure that there should be no faults on a bike delivered to a customer. And these V4s are absolutely stunning - like the 961 it is a bike to stand and look at to admire the detail. My Ducati piggy bank has had been replaced with a Norton one! Currently orders and 'expressions on interest' are being taken.

To answer questions in another thread a lot of time has been taken to test ALL components inherited from Old New Norton. And there is a big container of parts ready to be scrapped. And no: there is no way round the legal liabilities so they will be scrapped. An Atlas was sitting in the Norty corner 'as an example of how not to do it' which is destined for a very sad fate. No future plans for the Atlas/Nomad/ superlight.

They have not yet shipped out the build of 961s yet - they are still testing and validating 961 components, remedying faults and buying in new parts. They basically brought in a few owners and compiled a list of known faults. These faults were allocated individually to engineers to fix; eg there is a new output sprocket tab washer which will not fall apart. They also extensively road and track tested the 961 to establish its weaknesses. Their recent emails to customers about not supporting the 961 with spares and servicing is because they found so many variances in parts that they could not guarantee a new validated part would fit a customer's bike. And as soon as they touch a bike they are legally liable. So yes they are buying parts in and working with suppliers and there will be spares on the shelves (5 spares ordered for every 50 bikes built) but they are not validated to fit anything other than their 'new' 961s. So why all this effort for a model which is popular with lots more potential customers especially in a 'fixed' state but about to end? Draw your own conclusions.... Nothing 100% definite but if you really want a new 961 you might want to cancel the taxi to the Triumph dealership.

This is a flagship company for TVS which leverages TVS's buying power so anything produced will swarmed over by inspection rather than bean-counters, which is good for their customers. The current factory is not a temporary 5 year unit but a long term motorcycle industry for Solihull. Yeahhh!

Lots more bits which I will remember over the next few days - Did I mention EVs? Not exactly a headline that a progressive Bike company is looking at EV development. Nothing to see yet though.

Hope this might be useful and interesting and encouraging to Norton brand-loyal customers to learn that the future for Norton looks pretty good. Sorry no pics at moment 'cos lots of secret development work going on. And if this filters through; thanks to Chris and Jason for their valuable time - they are very representative of the great people I have met so far there.
 
Good to see the new Norton are doing things properly.
It is difficult to appreciate how long it takes to produce a new model from conception.
Having spent nearly 40 years in the motor industry, including new model launch, I can appreciate it, but I still found it hard to believe that BMW spent three years developing the S1000R from the S1000RR which was already fully proven, before they were happy to release it.
An example of how long things can take if you do things properly.
As Clive infers, you are not going to go to all that trouble producing quality components and a quality product unless you want too sell a few more 961’s.
We need to be patient.
 
Ok I have to say that despite it being April the First this is not an April Fools Day joke, unlike the assembly process of Old New Norton. Thank you New New Norton for the hospitality and factory visit I have just returned from; last time it was to see the new facilities waiting to be used but now there are real people making real parts and it is £$** impressive. I mean REALLY £$** impressive. The investment in equipment has been massive and most of it seems to be test and measuring equipment. Like probe scanners which can scan a complete frame and a whole clean room full of brand new test kit. A big new dyno. An environmentally sealed engine build area. Vacuum fluid fill station it just goes on and on. There are V4 parts everywhere. A test station where piles of con-rods have been passed and failed. Racks with beautiful polished frames and swingarms. Engines in stages of assembly. The procedures for sample testing that would make you cry - if I remember correctly one in ten beautiful frames are taken for destructive weld testing. QR codes etched onto components for traceability which is recorded down to bolt torque readings. The assembly jigs are also sent through test procedures to validate them against reference frames. A sample finished bike is taken and completely retested with remedial processes in place to ensure that there should be no faults on a bike delivered to a customer. And these V4s are absolutely stunning - like the 961 it is a bike to stand and look at to admire the detail. My Ducati piggy bank has had been replaced with a Norton one! Currently orders and 'expressions on interest' are being taken.

To answer questions in another thread a lot of time has been taken to test ALL components inherited from Old New Norton. And there is a big container of parts ready to be scrapped. And no: there is no way round the legal liabilities so they will be scrapped. An Atlas was sitting in the Norty corner 'as an example of how not to do it' which is destined for a very sad fate. No future plans for the Atlas/Nomad/ superlight.

They have not yet shipped out the build of 961s yet - they are still testing and validating 961 components, remedying faults and buying in new parts. They basically brought in a few owners and compiled a list of known faults. These faults were allocated individually to engineers to fix; eg there is a new output sprocket tab washer which will not fall apart. They also extensively road and track tested the 961 to establish its weaknesses. Their recent emails to customers about not supporting the 961 with spares and servicing is because they found so many variances in parts that they could not guarantee a new validated part would fit a customer's bike. And as soon as they touch a bike they are legally liable. So yes they are buying parts in and working with suppliers and there will be spares on the shelves (5 spares ordered for every 50 bikes built) but they are not validated to fit anything other than their 'new' 961s. So why all this effort for a model which is popular with lots more potential customers especially in a 'fixed' state but about to end? Draw your own conclusions.... Nothing 100% definite but if you really want a new 961 you might want to cancel the taxi to the Triumph dealership.

This is a flagship company for TVS which leverages TVS's buying power so anything produced will swarmed over by inspection rather than bean-counters, which is good for their customers. The current factory is not a temporary 5 year unit but a long term motorcycle industry for Solihull. Yeahhh!

Lots more bits which I will remember over the next few days - Did I mention EVs? Not exactly a headline that a progressive Bike company is looking at EV development. Nothing to see yet though.

Hope this might be useful and interesting and encouraging to Norton brand-loyal customers to learn that the future for Norton looks pretty good. Sorry no pics at moment 'cos lots of secret development work going on. And if this filters through; thanks to Chris and Jason for their valuable time - they are very representative of the great people I have met so far there.
Thanks for the info Clive it’s looking very positive for us 961 owners got to be patient.
 
If they sort the 961 out properly I’m certain they‘ll find a bigger market. Plus, they may even tempt back some previous owners…
 
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That DEFINITELY has to be on the ‘sorted’ list !!

Actually I really do think it has to be, for noise reduction (Euro whatever) purposes.
OK, now you got me started again, lets do a little redesign of the 961:

1. Balancer shaft should be driven from the timing side, not primary - redesign cases to make it happen.
2. Since we're redesigning the cases, ditch the whole dry sump drama, external oil tank, yada yada, go full wet sump w/oil level view glass in cases.
3. Hey we just went wet sump, right? Put the damn oil pump in the sump where it belongs, not hanging out on the right side case.
4. Gearbox redesign to put selector shaft behind gear clusters, allow shift shaft to go below and behind clutch. Add a sixth gear, and no more funky curved shift rods needed.
5. Gearbox redesign allows gearbox to move +2" forward in cases - shorter cases front to back, reduced mass/weight of engine.
6. Shorter cases, put swingarn pivot in rear of cases, reduced mass/weight of frame, longer swingarm but no increase in wheelbase.
7. That's enough, even God rested on the seventh day.
 
Since they appear to be
attempting to put the 20 new improved 961bikes together using " no 2 alike" rocker arms from China, a wait and see attitude might be best.
Or as the Politicians sometimes like to say " It's too early to adopt a wait and see attitude"
 
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Since they appear to be
attempting to put the 20 new improved 961bikes together using " no 2 alike" rocker arms from China, a wait and see attitude might be best.
Or as the Politicians sometimes like to say " It's too early to adopt a wait and see attitude"
Their mantra is most definitely that nothing leaves the factory if it is not right, ie it is made of parts which have been tested, approved or modified, then measured extensively at all stages of production. Everything that comes into stock is measured and tested - while I was there they were talking with the representative from the test equipment supplier (a 961 owner!) about new equipment to speed up testing. There is absolutely no comparison to be made whatsoever between the manufacturing and assembly at Old New Norton and New New Norton. If a fault is found on a bike leaving the factory then a representative of that component group has to find out why it happened and demonstrate that it cannot happen again within a set timescale. I saw those bikes months ago in a state that the Old New Norton would have been happy for them to leave the door. They would have started and ran so why not just ship them out, get the money in and deal with the consequences later...

FYI in case you are wondering I trained as a toolmaker with Lucas, qualified in electronics and systems and worked in various areas from press tool design, electrical assembly, CNC, implementing Kanban production, programming embedded test cells etc so I like to think that I have a bit of an idea of what I am looking at. And I have not been paid/bribed by Norton other than treated to a rather tasty Korean Crispy Chicken burger!
 
OK, now you got me started again, lets do a little redesign of the 961:

1. Balancer shaft should be driven from the timing side, not primary - redesign cases to make it happen.
2. Since we're redesigning the cases, ditch the whole dry sump drama, external oil tank, yada yada, go full wet sump w/oil level view glass in cases.
3. Hey we just went wet sump, right? Put the damn oil pump in the sump where it belongs, not hanging out on the right side case.
4. Gearbox redesign to put selector shaft behind gear clusters, allow shift shaft to go below and behind clutch. Add a sixth gear, and no more funky curved shift rods needed.
5. Gearbox redesign allows gearbox to move +2" forward in cases - shorter cases front to back, reduced mass/weight of engine.
6. Shorter cases, put swingarn pivot in rear of cases, reduced mass/weight of frame, longer swingarm but no increase in wheelbase.
7. That's enough, even God rested on the seventh day.
8. Buy a Ducati
 
And I have not been paid/bribed by Norton other than treated to a rather tasty Korean Crispy Chicken burger!
These emerging details are very telling.
The old Korean Crispy Chicken Burger Buy-off at play!

Glen
 
Handles better
More power
Faster
More dependable
Already has everything your dream list above asks for
But everybody has one! My gran has one, although she’s trading it in:rolleyes:!

Factory visit April 1st 2022


PS.
 
All looking very encouraging! It does sound like a lot of effort to go into for a bike allegedly not going into production. A few questions in my mind are:
When do they think they can release the current batch of 961’s? I assume they will be sva’d....but is that a long term solution if they chose to go into production?
What’s the situation on licensing on 961 engine? deemed suitably different to make it Norton’s?
Will they publish parts details so we can order parts....at our own risk of course?

I guess all will be revealed in the fullness of time. A factory meeting would be a cool event...sounds like they have catering sorted! Nice update from Clive, ‘our man on the inside’!
 
Handles better
More power
Faster
More dependable
Already has everything your dream list above asks for
True, but they are literally everywhere, can't hardly swing a dead cat without hitting a Duck these days.
I love Ducks, but today they have become like Jap bikes, ubiquitous.
When was the last time a Norton motored past your house, of course without you on it?
Seeing the rare Norton is like a breathe of fresh air, a treat for the eyes, something really special.
That's all I want, Oh yeah, I want it to start, idle, run and be reliable like all modern motorcycles.
This may be my search for the Holy Grail, dunno.
 
True, but they are literally everywhere, can't hardly swing a dead cat without hitting a Duck these days.
I love Ducks, but today they have become like Jap bikes, ubiquitous.
When was the last time a Norton motored past your house, of course without you on it?
Seeing the rare Norton is like a breathe of fresh air, a treat for the eyes, something really special.
That's all I want, Oh yeah, I want it to start, idle, run and be reliable like all modern motorcycles.
This may be my search for the Holy Grail, dunno.
Back on the road yesterday, 30 mile shake down blast, no probs. Out again today, coast road to Whitby and back the Moor road, running a dream. Ok there are mechanical sounds when ticking over at lights etc. but blasting through the gears up hill and down dale, magic!
 
But everybody has one! My gran has one, although she’s trading it in:rolleyes:!

View attachment 86216

PS.
Just imagine if Norton was included. Just imagine if Norton made as many bikes as all of the ones listed. I’m sure they would be at the top of that list. Everyone has a Harley or Honda.

The 961 only has 2 models and the issues are the same on the only 2 models they offer.

The brands you listed on that link literally make dozen of models and dozens of styles with many different engines and other offerings.

So if they have that kind of failed report what does that say about the 961 with only 2 bikes to choose from?
Let’s say Norton made 5000 961 bikes and Can am made 50000 bikes. Of the 5000 Nortons how many were trouble free? My guess would be probably 1% trouble free Nortons.
 
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