why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going 16?

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74ok

74ok

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why 19" when at the time practically everything else seemed to be 18"?

i've always preferred a big fat meaty look in a rear wheel tire and have seen the odd 16 incher on nortons,

any downside to going 16"? what is the max width or overall size?
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

The limit on width is interference with the chain. Most 120 width tires will fit, but you'll have trouble with some of the 130 width tires. Also depends a little on which chain you run, 530 or 520, regular or 0-ring.

No particular limit on running smaller diameter, except effect on ride geometry and ground clearance in corners. Pretty much just a matter of personal taste. I like the feel of a Commando on 19" tires, but I've run them on 19", 18", and 17" too.

Ken
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Yeah, the 19s seem to have a bit more stability, more gyro effect I suspect.
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

I've lined up 19"x130, 18"x120, 17"x120 and 16"x130 wheel-tires to see why TC runs a 16" fatso chopper rear on his 850 foot forward cruiser that's further traveled way longer than about anyone else I've ever heard of. TTI sprockets are limited to 520 size so 18"x130 tire clears X-ring chain in Peel by 1/4" or so. I snagged a billet 16" Harley rim to fit on Peel but must make up the center hub to hold bearings, sprocket and disc brake. With only 45 hp 19x120 size feels sluggish on Trixie Combat but past Peel with who know how much more power 120 was still easy to break free to spin some to ease turns so didn't notice sluiggish sense but more acceleration hook up before break free and better mileage and security on THE Gravel 'leans'. I'm finally done testing various combos to decide on ordinary Combat power to stick with 110 on both ends with front upright braking grip by far my main reason. Tri-linked extra spunky Peel could not use brakes for slowing on THE Gravel or chicanes in time so any real slowing was done flat tracker/supermotard style, using both tire edges to bleed speed one way while converting energy into another direction, quite breath taking suddenly. Be aware If ya fit a 16" rear better have the reputation and wits of TC to stand the laughing and put downs in public opinion forums like this one.
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

lcrken said:
The limit on width is interference with the chain. Most 120 width tires will fit, but you'll have trouble with some of the 130 width tires. Also depends a little on which chain you run, 530 or 520, regular or 0-ring.

No particular limit on running smaller diameter, except effect on ride geometry and ground clearance in corners. Pretty much just a matter of personal taste. I like the feel of a Commando on 19" tires, but I've run them on 19", 18", and 17" too.

Ken
Click to expand...

hmm interesting, the chain option you mention, does this part come into it?
http://coloradonortonworks.com/part-categories/drive/

Up to 1974 X-ring conversion kits
Special spacer to move the sprocket away from the transmission case for better alignment
Click to expand...
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Another thing to keep in mind if you're of the sort to enjoy any spirited lean antics, is that, as the rear tire gets wider than the front, the bike begins to take on a "nose down" attitude the farther it leans. 'Not a big player, but it can alter the steering geometry none-the-less.

Nathan
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

hobot said:
I snagged a billet 16" Harley rim to fit on Peel but must make up the center hub to hold bearings, sprocket and disc brake.
Click to expand...
i've only seen a few nortons with mag/cast wheels, mighta been or looked like lesters,

dunno what the story is with nortons and mag wheel options though guessing prob not a big deal getting one at the front with a fork conversion, of which i've seen a few,

i'll start another thread if this post interferes too much with the the original topic
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Wider rear tires have lower profile so tend to give more rear squat front hi sense when pitching over, which I like. 18" with 100 to 120 fitted in 90 or 80 profile are not quite 1/2" smaller OD than 19" and similar to the slightly lower height difference of 16" tires back there too.

To fit 520 chain old school way, can buy off the shelf Atlas tranny sprocket, no spacer needed then buy CNW drum or have your drum teeth thinned on LH/DS. To gain ~1/8" more space out sprocket and mill drum teeth on DS/RH. To gain 1/4" more Cangaa and & others have milled off isolastics to move whole power unit over.

If I did this again I'd have the sprocket and drum cryogenic tempered to extend the teeth life, especially if reason is to enjoy more of the Commando throttle with lighter spinning & slinging final drive. I could not feel chain mass difference on Peel until going all out so pretty stupid [if memorable] to appreciate in public. I could not feel 520 chain difference on SV650 either till going all out to run into modern corner crippleness but did feel extra cost of new sprockets over ~ 1 & 1/2 rear tire changes.
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

xbacksideslider said:
Yeah, the 19s seem to have a bit more stability, more gyro effect I suspect.
Click to expand...
I would think there's less gyroscopic effect with the larger diameter rim, because it is spinning at lower rpm for the same road speed. The rotational speed will have more effect than the slight change in mass of the rim and tyre.
It will take more energy to stop and start a smaller wheel, if you take it to the same road speed.
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

84ok said:
hobot said:
I snagged a billet 16" Harley rim to fit on Peel but must make up the center hub to hold bearings, sprocket and disc brake.
Click to expand...
i've only seen a few nortons with mag/cast wheels, mighta been or looked like lesters,

dunno what the story is with nortons and mag wheel options though guessing prob not a big deal getting one at the front with a fork conversion, of which i've seen a few,

i'll start another thread if this post interferes too much with the the original topic
Click to expand...
I've been running mags on my Commando for many years. The front is a piece of cake using an RD400 Yamaha wheel which has the same size axle as the Norton so only simple spacers required. The rear was a bit more difficult using an SR500 wheel which required a bit of machining but has a cush drive. Nice to have a one piece rear axle and a good disc brake too.
why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going 16?
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

84ok said:
lcrken said:
The limit on width is interference with the chain. Most 120 width tires will fit, but you'll have trouble with some of the 130 width tires. Also depends a little on which chain you run, 530 or 520, regular or 0-ring.

No particular limit on running smaller diameter, except effect on ride geometry and ground clearance in corners. Pretty much just a matter of personal taste. I like the feel of a Commando on 19" tires, but I've run them on 19", 18", and 17" too.

Ken
Click to expand...

hmm interesting, the chain option you mention, does this part come into it?
http://coloradonortonworks.com/part-categories/drive/

Up to 1974 X-ring conversion kits
Special spacer to move the sprocket away from the transmission case for better alignment
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Very nice stuff, but I'm afraid I've never used any of it. All my experiences with the tire sizes mentioned above were before there was a CNW. To accommodate the wider 18" and 17" slicks, I did have to move the gearbox over by .200" in the Commando cradle, and modify the clutch spacers, but it was pretty easy with a belt drive primary and 520 rear chain. Nowdays I've got 19" tires on my street Commando, and 18" on the featherbed race bike.

Ken
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

5.00 x 16 rear. 3.00 x 19 front.

Don't know how it rides. I bought it as a barn find that hasn't run since 1986. Taking it back to standard. I'm sure it would have been interesting....
 

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Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Aw man Dean that is one sweatie pie chopperish Commando to my eyes and a look and stable stance I want to mimic on my Ms Peel for extra advantage and comfort while spanking sport bikes silly. There may not be many on this and other forums that will accept you as Commando comrade, out of ignorance or stuck up sense of style so will take a bit more man hood sense to put up with the put downs and sneers till ya convert back to ordinary, but keep in mind that one of the most famous fastest Nortoneers of all time TC Christensen Hog Slayer rides an 850 with 16"x5" rear tire across the USofA ahead of the van transporting his now 3 engine show piece. Your Commando photos should also go in the Commando Choppers Please thread to be easy to find a long time.

I would trade you my factory Combat for the better set up Commando you have, but for the time/distance/cost or ability to talk ya into it.
commando-choppers-please-t6850.html
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

hmmmm, lotsa stuff out there, wasn't aware of this ~ keep it original deal and it is certainly not a big deal with other makes, in fact , individuality
along with almost anything goes is encouraged
http://www.ngwclub.com/gallery3/index.php/
http://www.ngwclub.com/gallery3/index.p ... -the-Month

https://www.google.ca/search?q=custom+c ... CAYQ_AUoAQ

https://www.google.ca/search?q=chopper+ ... d=0CBwQsAQ

any pix out there of tc's street ride?
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Norton probably used a 19" rear wheel for the same reason several are changing now. Likely that was the tire size available in the performance desired.
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

Dean said:
5.00 x 16 rear. 3.00 x 19 front.

Don't know how it rides. I bought it as a barn find that hasn't run since 1986. Taking it back to standard. I'm sure it would have been interesting....
Click to expand...


Exactly what was this before all the "customizing"?
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

'been reading up and ran across this related info

wm3-wm4-t20345.html

wm3-wm4-t20345.html#p262974

I use a 120/19 18 tyre on a wm4 rim on the back of my seeley, and a 100/80 18 on a wm3 on the front. However the steering geometry is radically different to that of a near standard commando. You have to remember that if the larger tyre alters the trail, the steering can become quicker or slower. With isolastics and the potential for tank slappers, it might be safer to stay close to originality
Click to expand...
 
Re: why was a 19" sized rear wheel selected? huge deal going

There are 3 main reasons I call all other modern cycles corner cripples, 1. the frame is too rigid to take up conflicting tire vectors of counter steering, 2. the fork stem angle [and thereby the critical front axle plane to frame plane] is too steep [d/t the effort fat tires or wide rims create] so set up to induce almost uncontrollable hi sides, 3. the with of the 17" tires does bad unpredictable things when power pressing far over leans. I do not yet know what tire size/rim/profile will work best on next Peel but will get back when I do but pretty sure it won't follow the wisdom of tire manufactures or racers. Now if only going mostly in upright bee lines then best tire for that is flat widest slick ya can fit. If sensitive enough one can detect the slight sluggish hindrance of more metal in wider rims and rubber mass surrounding it. Most important is soft compound which costs more and lasts less but shoot the extra thrills can last a life time.
 
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