Why the 750 - 4 didn't handle as well as the Norton.

When I was 17 all my mates brought Honda 750 4s, I went against the trend and brought my new Norton, man did they put sh it on me, they leak oil, very unreliable etc etc, well everything they said I proved them all wrong and I ran circles around them and always beat them in a race around out local street circuit and the funny thing I still own my Norton, it don't leak oil and it starts first kick every time and even funnier is I still ride mine, well I did till I lost my lower leg and none of my mate who brought Honda 4 don't still have them, well one still has one but it's not his original one, but it's been pulled down many years ago because they broke down on it, and when I met up with the old Honda 4 boys at a mates mum funeral 10 months back they still had a hide to have a say about my old Norton, and I let them have their gig at me without saying a word till they all finished laughing, I just turned around and said "where are all your Honda 4s now, as my old Noron is still going" then I walked away laughing.

Honda 4s they don't have the thump of the 360 swing and a lovely sound from the exhaust pipes like a Norton twin, they are heavy fu ckers and they handle like a heavy brick on wheels and are so top heavy, yes I rode one once, only once, never again, I think I made the right choice when I was 17, but I do love my Honda dirt bikes have always owned on since I was 15 years old, I still own one but think my dirt days are over, but then who knows how things will go.

Ashley

baz said:

You beat Porsche 911s on a 750 honda
Blimey what model did you have?
I used to thrash cb750s on my t140 bonnie

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Baz, perhaps at 18 excess bravery - or foolhardiness - had something to do with it, but I found you could really Rev it and after the modifications it was really quite stable and predictable. I also fitted twin discs on the front.

dave M said:

Baz, perhaps at 18 excess bravery - or foolhardiness - had something to do with it, but I found you could really Rev it and after the modifications it was really quite stable and predictable. I also fitted twin discs on the front.

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Yes but you had to modify it to do so, a stock Commando would run circles around a stock Honda 4 any day or night.

ashman said:

Yes but you had to modify it to do so, a stock Commando would run circles around a stock Honda 4 any day or night.

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You're preaching to the converted here, Ash. I've owned 9 Commandos but only one CB750. My point is that the Honda wasn't a bad bike at all and had 'good bones'. It was a good 50Lbs heavier than the Norton and slower, but it was technically advanced for it's day and the design has stood the test of time. I consider it a worthy classic.

MexicoMike said:

When I was young I chose a motorcycle in whatever size/price range I could afford because it was faster/handled "better"/won more races than some other brand. Eventually, I figured out that being faster/handled better/won more races had very little in common with riding a motorcycle every day on the street. But I will admit that realizing that fact doesn't completely eliminate my interest in such bikes. Every time I sit on a Panigale I find myself thinking, "I should buy one of these." Fortunately, so far I've been able to come to my senses!

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I've ridden Panigales and I wouldnt buy one for the street. They handle poorly at everyday and city speeds, and need to rev too high before anything fun kicks in.

Their V4 is a fantastic motor... for the track.

The riding position is fantastic... for the track.

My 848 EVO was actually much more streetable. Its V2 had more usable low end torque, and it wasn't as heavy feeling at lower speeds.

My Norton does everything just as well, save the blisteringly dangerous for the street acceleration.

I have a friend with a V4 that I've ridden a fair bit. He recently sold it because it had "only" 207 HP while the current model is available with around 230HP!
My last Ducati sport bike had around 160HP - heck, my wife's favorite bike, her Ducati Diavel, has 165!

The Norton is more comfortable for me nowadays to ride for an extended period but when I get on the Panigale (or another other serious sport bike), I do find myself saying, "This is MY kind of motorcycle!" Then, I reluctantly recognize my limitations - both physical and reaction-wise compared to my younger self and conclude that it USED to be my kind of motorcycle.

I agree that for all practical purposes, a sorted Commando is a much better street bike

MexicoMike said:

I have a friend with a V4 that I've ridden a fair bit. He recently sold it because it had "only" 207 HP while the current model is available with around 230HP!
My last Ducati sport bike had around 160HP - heck, my wife's favorite bike, her Ducati Diavel, has 165!

The Norton is more comfortable for me nowadays to ride for an extended period but when I get on the Panigale (or another other serious sport bike), I do find myself saying, "This is MY kind of motorcycle!" Then, I reluctantly recognize my limitations - both physical and reaction-wise compared to my younger self and conclude that it USED to be my kind of motorcycle.

I agree that for all practical purposes, a sorted Commando is a much better street bike

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The older I get the faster I was!

MexicoMike said:

I have a friend with a V4 that I've ridden a fair bit. He recently sold it because it had "only" 207 HP while the current model is available with around 230HP!
My last Ducati sport bike had around 160HP - heck, my wife's favorite bike, her Ducati Diavel, has 165!

The Norton is more comfortable for me nowadays to ride for an extended period but when I get on the Panigale (or another other serious sport bike), I do find myself saying, "This is MY kind of motorcycle!" Then, I reluctantly recognize my limitations - both physical and reaction-wise compared to my younger self and conclude that it USED to be my kind of motorcycle.

I agree that for all practical purposes, a sorted Commando is a much better street bike

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Dude… Your wife rides a Diavel? Does she have a sister?

This American flag was a party favor handout at a rippin big Fourth of July party I went to in Newton, NH in 1978. I stuck it on the back of my Harley Super Glide that day and it rode with me the rest of the summer, and a few more. It's been in my toolbox ever since.

concours said:

Dude… Your wife rides a Diavel? View attachment 125444Does she have a sister?

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She does...but the sister doesn't own a motorcycle ALTHOUGH when she (sister) was 8 months pregnant she requested that I take her out on the back of my Ducati 916 and "do the ton!" Her husband was totally freaked out and told her, "I refuse to allow you to do that!!!" You can probably guess the results of his objection. The daughter that resulted loved motorcycles from an infant and owns/rides one now and does her own maintenance. We all think it was due to that desmodromic twin vibration at high RPM filtering into the womb.

And yes, my currently max HP moto is my BMW R1200RS with 120HP so my wife on her Diavel can leave me looking at taillights pretty much any time. Sometimes I'm sorry I taught her to ride...

Happiness is a bike that you like. It doesn't matter what it is. It doesn't matter how fast it runs, how fast it stops, or how much it is worth. A person may be totally happy and satisfied with a Honda Grom, a 1928 101 Indian Scout, a Norton Commando or a brand new touring BMW. There is no accounting for taste, and the important thing is whether or not your ride makes you happy.

All about 2 wheels for me, but I am a British bike nut or a Honda dirt bikes all been my life since I was 15 when I left school and got a job to buy my first new dirt bike, have had more new bikes than second hard ones as I worked hard and saved sometime with a bit of credit to get what I wanted, life on 2 wheels is been good to me except for the last 6 months but wasn't the bikes fault, them bloody Rab 4s they bite hard sadly.

Ashley

nortonmargie said:

Happiness is a bike that you like. It doesn't matter what it is. It doesn't matter how fast it runs, how fast it stops, or how much it is worth. A person may be totally happy and satisfied with a Honda Grom, a 1928 101 Indian Scout, a Norton Commando or a brand new touring BMW. There is no accounting for taste, and the important thing is whether or not your ride makes you happy.

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Yup. It's all about smiles per hour, not how far or how fast, and being able to stop in time.

ashman said:

All about 2 wheels for me, but I am a British bike nut or a Honda dirt bikes all been my life since I was 15 when I left school and got a job to buy my first new dirt bike, have had more new bikes than second hard ones as I worked hard and saved sometime with a bit of credit to get what I wanted, life on 2 wheels is been good to me except for the last 6 months but wasn't the bikes fault, them bloody Rab 4s they bite hard sadly.

Ashley

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You still taking pain medication for that bite?

Is my comment too harsh? I've been sampling my pain meds for a busted back I got riding a CZ off road in the 70's. 100 proof Kentuky Bourbon. It makes me type things I shouldn't. lol

nortonmargie said:

Happiness is a bike that you like. It doesn't matter what it is. It doesn't matter how fast it runs, how fast it stops, or how much it is worth. A person may be totally happy and satisfied with a Honda Grom, a 1928 101 Indian Scout, a Norton Commando or a brand new touring BMW. There is no accounting for taste, and the important thing is whether or not your ride makes you happy.

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That’s so on point Margie.

I realised that some time ago, as a yoof we’d argue about power, handling, braking, etc, etc, to defend our choice of bike when really, all along, we were just riding what we liked !

This really dawned on me more recently when I dug my humble old T140 out of long term storage and since doing so it’s been the bike I’ve ridden the most of all!

I wouldn’t try and justify this by arguing it’s physical attributes with anyone… the reason is much more simple… it’s coz I like it!!

baz said:

You beat Porsche 911s on a 750 honda
Blimey what model did you have?
I used to thrash cb750s on my t140 bonnie

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Me too. I could never figure out why the big Japanese bikes had such a reputation for speed. My T140 (only mods being no silencers or air filters, carbs re-jetted to suit) would easily out accelerate and reach greater top speeds than any Jap 750 apart from H2s, and it wasn't far behind even those. I once bought a 750-4 Honda, on a whim. I found it so slow I took it to a friend who was the chief mechanic at the local Honda dealer, for him to tell me what was wrong with it. He test rode it and returned saying it was a good one - he couldn't see what my problem was. I sold it at the next auction - lardy, gutless lump, like riding a self propelled sofa.

Tigernut said:

Me too. I could never figure out why the big Japanese bikes had such a reputation for speed. My T140 (only mods being no silencers or air filters, carbs re-jetted to suit) would easily out accelerate and reach greater top speeds than any Jap 750 apart from H2s, and it wasn't far behind even those. I once bought a 750-4 Honda, on a whim. I found it so slow I took it to a friend who was the chief mechanic at the local Honda dealer, for him to tell me what was wrong with it. He test rode it and returned saying it was a good one - he couldn't see what my problem was. I sold it at the next auction - lardy, gutless lump, like riding a self propelled sofa.

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Yep I've owned a couple
I had a 750k and an F1
Yes they are gutless and too heavy IMO with terrible brakes especially in the wet
I've also had a 500/4 and two 550 forks and they were as bad
500 was a bit better when I fitted a full Yoshi big bore 600 kit and race cam and exhaust but it made it extremely peaky and in the end the unsupported liners flexed too much

I think the comments are a little hard on Honda. The Honda 750 four essentially invented the idea of a large displacement motorcycle that wasn't temperamental, didn't leak oil, had reliable electrics, a disc brake and electric start. A design that basically became the standard for motorcycles for many years.

I suspect a lot of people (like me), who relied on a motorcycle as their primary transportation back then abandoned their britt bikes ('71 Commando in my case) and bought 750 Hondas...
I admit I found the (original) Honda 750 to be a bit ponderous compared to the Commando but that changed with the DOHC Honda 750 in '79 which was a great motorcycle.

MexicoMike said:

I think the comments are a little hard on Honda.

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Well… it is a Norton forum…!

So really, it’s uber positive !!

I have both. A '75 850mk3 and a '76 CB750K6. The Commando is the sportier bike. The Honda is smooth and plush by comparison. Both are more than quick enough. The Honda is easier to take apart.

I enjoy riding both and despite not being as sporty, I often choose the Honda over the Norton, I love riding it and enjoy the induction note. Having giv3n both Hagon rear shocks and front shock overhauls, I think the heavier handling of the Honda is inherent in it's weight distribution, a bit more top and front heavy. Goes where it's pointed though and doesn't wallow on new rear shocks and heavier fork oil.

They both look magnificent lined up next to each other in my garage. I still look back at them and feel very lucky!