what does 'p11' mean?

Rohan · Nov 8, 2011

Did we figure out where the P11 frames came from ?

Built in Plumstead ?
Brought in from outside somewhere ?

L.A.B. · Nov 8, 2011

Rohan said:
Does it say Norton Matchless Division or Norton Villiers on their paperwork ?

The parent company was Norton-Villiers end of story.

Rohan · Nov 8, 2011

The parent company was Manganese Bronze Holdings. ?

L.A.B. · Nov 8, 2011

Rohan · Nov 8, 2011

Is there a date on that booklet ?

Is Norton Matchless on any of the early Commando stuff ?
Something changed when the Commando came out, it was not the same company setup ?

L.A.B. · Nov 8, 2011

Rohan said:
The parent company was Manganese Bronze Holdings. ?

Manganese Bronze Holdings

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holding_company

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parent_company

Rohan · Nov 8, 2011

Dennis Poore seemed to have a fair hand in things. ?

And that name Norton Matchless disappeared for the Commando ?
They even then said Norton Villiers on the Commando tank badge....

Matt Spencer · Nov 8, 2011

Dennis Poore was the Chairman *, He'd driven Aston Martins about the same time shelby did ( around 1960 )
After the Govt had sunk NVT , via Meridan , he kept the rotary alive untill passed on to ' responsible ' hands .

The picture of him on a T 150 says a thousand words . http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgurl= ... CB8Q9QEwAA

( of Manganese Bronze Holdings ) *

Hobot · Nov 8, 2011

Can't view the 'ownership' relations as you would a business for profit but more a Marxist movement from the top down.

The essay will attempt to construct a narrative from archive and oral sources and seek to test Martin
Fairclough’s argument that Meriden was constituted as an industrial experiment and not as an agency for retaining a British motorcycle industry.

http://www.labour-history.org.uk/suppor ... riden2.PDF

Ron L · Nov 8, 2011

Rohan said:
And the tank said "Norton",

Unless it said "Matchless" :lol:

Rohan · Nov 9, 2011

[quote"]And the tank said "Norton", [/quote]

Ron L said:
Unless it said "Matchless" :lol:

Quite so. Or just "M"...
And even in some cases, AJS.
The Model 33 is a rare enough bird.

Wonder if there were any AJS P11's though ?
Not entirely sure I've even seen any advertising for them.

L.A.B. · Nov 9, 2011

Rohan said:
Wonder if there were any AJS P11's though ?
Not entirely sure I've even seen any advertising for them.

You wouldn't expect to see any "AJS" P11s or Matchless P11s either [Edit sorry-incorrect as there were Matchless badged P11s but not AJS].

Rohan · Nov 9, 2011

Norton Matchless Division turned out Nortons and Matchlesses, so there was a Matchless P11 - a P11A anyway...

http://webzoom.freewebs.com/ajsmatchles ... %20P11.jpg

Since I don't think that AJS is defunct yet, there will be an AJS version too. ?
Hence the question...

L.A.B. · Nov 9, 2011

Rohan said:
Norton Matchless Division turned out Nortons and Matchlesses, so there was a Matchless P11 - a P11A anyway...

I'd already noticed my error and corrected it. :wink:

Rohan said:
Since I don't think that AJS is defunct yet, there will be an AJS version too. ?

I don't think AJS models made in China count?

Rohan · Nov 9, 2011

I don't think we were talking about China.

There were AJS versions of the N15 etc and G15 etc versions, and even advertising of them is not easy to find. So that AJS P11 is not an impossibility ?

L.A.B. · Nov 9, 2011

Rohan said:
I don't think we were talking about China.

Well...the question-as asked ("I don't think that AJS is defunct yet, there will be an AJS version too. ?") made no sense.

Rohan said:
There were AJS versions of the N15 etc and G15 etc versions, and even advertising of them is not easy to find. So that AJS P11 is not an impossibility ?

Yes-here's one (A spoof AJS P11)! http://www.ajs-matchless.com/topic.asp? ... ral%2BTopi

Rohan · Nov 9, 2011

L.A.B. said:
Well...the question-as asked ("I don't think that AJS is defunct yet, there will be an AJS version too. ?") made no sense.

The context was that Norton Matchless were still going, at that point in history, so AJS machines were still being made.

Thanks for the spoof AJS P11, stranger things have turned out to be true.
Do the factory records for this period survive ?

BTW, we still haven't got to the bottom of when Norton Matchless disappeared, and Norton Villiers solely was mentioned. Seems to be circa 1970, judging by Commando advertising ?
So that means that someone is bound to have a Commando with Matchless badging on it ?!
(There is/was a James Commando, but an entirely different machine)

DogT · Nov 9, 2011

That Oriental P11 looks like it has the same prop stand as my 69? Probably.

Dave
69S

L.A.B. · Nov 9, 2011

DogT said:
That Oriental P11 looks like it has the same prop stand as my 69? Probably.

I don't think that one is an Oriental AJS?

As Rohan had successfully managed to jumble up his past/present/future tenses so his question made little sense I thought he was referring to the current range of Chinese AJS models.
http://www.ajsmotorcycles.co.uk/new_AJS/docs/main.htm

Rohan · Nov 9, 2011

Wonder if there were any AJS P11's though ?
Not entirely sure I've even seen any advertising for them.

What language do you want me to post in then ?
You had just posted that there were no Matchless P11s too.

what does 'p11' mean?

Rohan

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