What’s the best none Norton Norton ?

Stephen_Spencer said:
Riding buddy of mine wrote off two bikes (including a Duc V4), at the same junction, in the same manner, in the same year! Lightning anybody!

He’s just bought one of these, which is definitely in the ‘eye of the beholder’ but promises to be loadsa fun - feels so light you could pick it up and tuck it under your arm.

What’s got me flabbergasted (although I’d heard talk before) is the ‘pay for performance’ model KTM has going on now (I think they’re calling it demo mode)! Not a scam, but commercially corrupt you could argue.

He gets all of the fancy tech included when he buys it, as a taster, but at 1500 Km ‘poof’ the ECU switches some tech off and you have to pay (a lot) for your stealer to switch it back on!! It includes cruise control, which already has a dedicated button on the dash (I think), that he’s paid for! This is not a cheap bike.

Technology offered as an accessory:oops:? It‘d be like hiring a ‘lady of the night’ to find that she’s wearing a chastity belt - either way, you’re getting screwed! But only if you pay again!!! Or is it the way of the future.

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Is that the 990 ?
 
I bet the other big bike makers are all watching eagerly to see how this KTM Demo Mode goes down with buyers.
This could be the future!!:(:(
 
BritTwit said:
When your buddy bought the bike, was the fact that some tech would be turned off in the future revealed to him by the dealer?
If this was in the contract, and your buddy signed it, too bad for him.
If not, sounds like "bait and switch" to me, and that is Illegal in the states.
On a completely different topic, not enough brightly colored, angular plastic bits on that KTM, far too conservative.😀
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Not sure BT. I’ll be out stretching the Norton’s legs on Sunday, so I’ll quiz him. We only talked about it briefly on the last ride - could have sworn he said that he had to pay at the first service to get the tech not retain it. May have it wrong.

Either way it’ll be contentious. Let’s face it, if all of that development work has been done to get the bike to a point where you can switch tech on or off with a simple feed, then you’ve paid for that tech whether you take it or not.

Agreed, it looks a bit like it’s strayed from the transformer mates with wheelie bin family. Probably not a bad thing😄!
 
TonyA said:
Is that the 990 ?
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890 Duke R Tony. A little missile from what I can see - should be super flickable and awesome fun in the twisties.

I imagine it would be a weapon on the track as well. In the less weight = more fun sort of way.
 
robs ss said:
I bet the other big bike makers are all watching eagerly to see how this KTM Demo Mode goes down with buyers.
This could be the future!!:(:(
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No doubt Rob,

If there’s kickback though, KTM will change this approach pretty quickly I would think. Let’s face it, bikers are not a daft bunch and work pretty hard for their play money - well the vast majority anyway.

Good luck marketing this as increasing rider choice, as opposed to increasing marque revenue.
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
Not sure BT. I’ll be out stretching the Norton’s legs on Sunday, so I’ll quiz him. We only talked about it briefly on the last ride - could have sworn he said that he had to pay at the first service to get the tech not retain it. May have it wrong.

Either way it’ll be contentious. Let’s face it, if all of that development work has been done to get the bike to a point where you can switch tech on or off with a simple feed, then you’ve paid for that tech whether you take it or not.

Agreed, it looks a bit like it’s strayed from the transformer mates with wheelie bin family. Probably not a bad thing😄!
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I would not buy a bike where the operability of the machine can be controlled by some remote entity.
Then again, I am a dinosaur, only playing LPs & CDs - MP3s in the car - but no streaming.
 
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Stephen_Spencer said:
Riding buddy of mine wrote off two bikes (including a Duc V4), at the same junction, in the same manner, in the same year! Lightning anybody!

He’s just bought one of these, which is definitely in the ‘eye of the beholder’ but promises to be loadsa fun - feels so light you could pick it up and tuck it under your arm.

What’s got me flabbergasted (although I’d heard talk before) is the ‘pay for performance’ model KTM has going on now (I think they’re calling it demo mode)! Not a scam, but commercially corrupt you could argue.

He gets all of the fancy tech included when he buys it, as a taster, but at 1500 Km ‘poof’ the ECU switches some tech off and you have to pay (a lot) for your stealer to switch it back on!! It includes cruise control, which already has a dedicated button on the dash (I think), that he’s paid for! This is not a cheap bike.

Technology offered as an accessory:oops:? It‘d be like hiring a ‘lady of the night’ to find that she’s wearing a chastity belt - either way, you’re getting screwed! But only if you pay again!!! Or is it the way of the future.

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BMW cars tried the same type of thing on new car sales like a subscription for seat heaters for $18 a month, but they’ve stopped it, don’t know why. I thought it was a really dumb idea when I read the article. I’m surely wouldn’t buy a car or motorcycle with this type of options that I gotta pay for, so how much cheaper is going to be on the price of the product.
 
meanwhile, it seems some Nortons have special features that change the performance, and you have to pay to restore it, just saying..... and they were ahead, starting in 2009 approx!
TVS could try selling a retro performance mode, taking you back to the 2015 vibe....complete with clothing range to look cool at the roadside.
 
Many car manufacturers are now testing the market with subscription functions. I wish them all to go to hell. Many of the bullshit functions we never need nor want, but once they start pushing basic functions, there should be a proper uproar or market setback. Fundamentally, the principle of this idea is bizarre and evil, regardless of which function it is.
I was surprised to read that this is now starting to show up in motorcycles. I understand that KTM is a poor company on the verge of bankruptcy.
Of course, they will all parrot that they are doing it because they must make enough money to develop e-mobility so that they can more easily steal from you the last semblance of the freedom of movement.
 
74ok said:
www.ktm.com

2023 KTM 890 Duke R

www.ktm.com www.ktm.com
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There it is - well spotted 74. Already present tech, as a Powerpart option (nothing physical to add) - which is KTM’s accessory catalogue; for carbon parts, luggage and a sports exhaust! And now also wheelie control, launch control and an (already present) quick shifter!

I’m not sure that I can think of an outcome that is positive for the owner. What KTM is doing is playing on the truisms that, a biker will generally want the maximum out of their machine by way of performance/spec and that they generally love to accessorise.

Likely a rider would always be thinking - this is great, I wonder how much better it would be with that extra tech?

Methinks if it is there physically, or is now what might be called standard sportsbike fare, then it should be part of the purchase price.

No chastity belts thank you Mr KTM.

IMG_9156.jpeg
 
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robs ss said:
I would not buy a bike where the operability of the machine can be controlled by some remote entity.
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Well then, hold on!
The other day, the US congress passed a bill that will force auto manufacturers to build a "kill switch" into their autos.
This kill switch will be mandatory in 2026 vehicles, and accessible by the government.
How long before your country requires it?
EFI and Wi-Fi make all of this possible.
Don't look now, but big brother is watching.:mad:
 
If this is true, then I don´t understand why the public is so sheepish. Of all places, the US with its car culture!
You have demonstrations all over the place over much less serious issues.
Any such car or bike is unbuyable to me and you. But I can already hear all the other idiots saying that it doesn´t hurt them because they will never brake the law, so why worry!?
Frogs boiling.
 
BritTwit said:
Well then, hold on!
The other day, the US congress passed a bill that will force auto manufacturers to build a "kill switch" into their autos.
This kill switch will be mandatory in 2026 vehicles, and accessible by the government.
How long before your country requires it?
EFI and Wi-Fi make all of this possible.
Don't look now, but big brother is watching.:mad:
Click to expand...
I would seek out that function and disable it - after all it is my vehicle!
 
My opinion only but we should probably stick to bikes on here - the rest of this stuff can get pretty contentious - whilst our source, the internet, is often full of false information.

I’ll ride my mates KTM 890 when he’s run it in and let you guys know how it goes - no doubt it will be an absolute blast, as will the 990.

I’ve got one of those already though, and yes, I know, it‘s butt ugly to most🤣!

What’s the best none Norton Norton ?
 
Stephen_Spencer said:
My opinion only but we should probably stick to bikes on here - the rest of this stuff can get pretty contentious - whilst our source, the internet, is often full of false information.

I’ll ride my mates KTM 890 when he’s run it in and let you guys know how it goes - no doubt it will be an absolute blast, as will the 990.

I’ve got one of those already though, and yes, I know, it‘s butt ugly to most🤣!

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...yes, it's a hatful alright!!
 
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