Trouble at Mill

If Stuart Garner owns Spondon then why on earth would he contract out the Frame? Spondon have been going for years and have a great reputation so that bit doesn't sound right.

It doesn't, because Mr Garner is but a minority shareholder in Spondon, and I am certain Mr.Tiller, founder and majority shareholder of Spondon, will tell you exactly that. Tiller was probably prepared to tell you even more was he not currently in legal dispute with his minority shareholder.

Plus, Spondon is known for ally ("Deltabox") frames I believe, not for tubular steel frames.
 
Spondon builds all sorts of frames incuding some very nice Egli -Vincent Replica frames, much better than most of the originals which suffered from highly variable quality.

Glen
 
Vincent had an American rival for best/fastest in Crocker, perhaps if Garner had bought that name it would have been a more apt 'honesty in advertising' approach.. as in... crock...a...shit?
 
At this point it is all pretty suspicious despite the fact I wish to
believe. The bikes cost too much. There arent enough of them.
He just bought new machinery so where did the money come from?
...from the poor buggers that stumped up so far I fear.

Remember the Royal Enfield "not enough to go around". Swell
excuse for not being able to deliver. Maybe they should nick that
rap.
 
To be fair, Crocker never got going again post-war, but compared to a pre-war series-A 'plumbers-nightmare' HRD there is more of a contest.
 
Trouble at Mill


Trouble at Mill
 
Matt,

Love the second pic. The Aston and the Dino. From the late 60's TV show from England... in the US it was a Summer replacement show. We got it only for two seasons and the Britts 3, 4??? "The Persuaders" with Roger Moore (as Lord Brett Sinclair a debutante aristocrat from old money) and Tony Curtis (as Danny Wilde, an American entrepenuar playboy). Moore drove the Aston, and Tony drove the Dino ( tho he refered to it as a Ferrari). The scene was from their premier episode where the characters got a little antagonistic upon first meeting and resulted in a race through the Riviera ending at Monte Carlo... whereupon they got in a fist fight and destroyed a bar in the hotel before they were actually both summoned by a retired judge to put away the evil doers he couldn't while on the bench.

Remember the series fondly as that's what started my love for Ferrari... been hooked since :)

Thanks for the memory.

found a clip on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IldiTo2Z ... re=related

Same scene with the original music (warning.. very 60's / 70's ish):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=widKSdPc ... re=related

And Moore reuinited wit the aston in 2011:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7izUIEO ... re=related

edit: .... found the fight scene at the hotel after they checked in:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FZMaJ7W ... re=related

another edit... Found the intro to the show:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t99QQIXez4M

yet another edit.. how about a remake with Hugh Grant and George Clooney?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6nzQu4ysb8

JD
 
Anyone that can afford a new Commando should just save a few more bucks and get a CNW. Who in their right mind gives a start up company a huge deposit for a bike they have no track record building? It's not rocket surgery.
 
By all accounts, they have delivered quite a few bikes to UK customers.
Just how many would be interesting to know though, compared to how many deposits or paid-in-full....
 
ty it wasnt one ( Their Commando ) theyd entered in the I.o.M. , for a demo . It may well have raised a bit of support , if it didnt go BANG .
 
Agreed Matt, they could`ve put ol` Al Crashcart on one & sent him out to try & crack the ton -or die trying..
 
swooshdave said:
Nigel Griffiths told us that when his bike was in for servicing, the top end was removed for no apparent reason. His suspicion was that it was urgently needed to furnish another bike.⁸ It wouldn’t be a huge surprise, since Egli’s statement and the manager’s statement corroborate each other regarding the constant problems with supply of spares.

Really? He assumed that the top end was removed and used on another bike? With zero evidence? And then to use that speculation to support an apparent part shortage? Lame.

This is shoddy reporting dressed up with fancy footnotes. The bias is incredulous. :roll:



Griffiths had ample evidence for that suspicion. Remember, he was one of the parts suppliers having problems with Norton, and his bike was not due for top end removal. He had not requested it, and there was no mechanical reason for it. He saw the bike minus top end while it was there. No explanation was given. The manager told us that the spares situation was so bad parts were removed from customers bikes to complete new builds. Griffiths was actually more upset that his bike was stored in a machining room with no top end, no cover and the posssibility of contamination by swarf. Since that was such a minor allegation compared with the rest of the stuff, I left it out of the feature.

The article is supported by public domain accounting documents, independent statements, named sources, press reports including quotes from Garner himself. Fritz Egli and Brian Crighton are legendary figures in the European bike world. Egli had an awful lot more to say which again, I chose not to publish since the piece was full of factual material and I will be interviewing him again (Egli) in the next few weeks. I didn't even ask for Crighton to comment, his experience with Garner prompted him to do so. Maybe you should read his account.

I'm sorry that you feel the bias is incredulous despite the fact that you were not able to substantiate that. The truth is that the facts speak for themselves: bias was simply not needed. Even if I accept that the Griffiths top end paragraph could have been made clearer, that still leaves an awful lot of evidence from other people. The footnotes are simply statements of fact, as is the solicitor's statement.

Believe what you want to believe, but don't shoot the messenger.
 
Brian Crighton says:

August 19, 2012 at 8:48 pm

I was one of the three original people involved in the new Norton project instigated by Stuart Garner. I had several meetings with Garner explaining that he needed huge amounts of money to be able to produce good quality motorcycles. At the time the only motorcycle that we could make was a copy of the NRV588 Rotary which I had built for the National Motorcycle Museum of a bike I designed for the 1994 race season. I said to him that I needed a proper test bed facility and all the necessary equipment to achieve this. He said there was no problem at all with financing this and I questioned him as to whether he had sufficient funds to finance this and the Norton factory start up. He always maintained that the money was no issue. I therefore agreed to take on the role of Technical Director of Norton Racing which was the only Norton company at the time. In my contract it stated that I was to receive 10% shares of the company for my expert involvement.

After starting, it became obvious to me that the guy was just full of bullshit and I didn’t get any testbed or any facilities for building the two NRV588 Rotary’s. I said for the bikes to be reliable I needed to develop new rotor bearings which were the weak link in the engine. There weren’t even ramps in the so-called workshop so I built the bikes in my own workshop at home. Garner kept asking me when was I going to go to the unit at Donington to work on the bikes and I told him that if he thought I was going to crawl about on the floor to build bikes he must be joking. Eventually he agreed to get me some ramps and some equipment but I didn’t find out until later on that because he had no money Bob Holt who had now also been conned into working for Norton with all the bullshit, had actually financed this out of his own pocket and it took him over four months to get his money back.

Now we’ll talk about the Isle of Man TT. The first I heard about it was when I’d arranged to do some testing at Donington Park with Lee Dickinson to ride the bike. When I arrived in the garage I was introduced to Michael Dunlop and told that he had come to test the bike as he was riding it at the TT. I was obviously very unhappy about this as the bike was never designed for the TT circuit and was a lightweight quick turning short circuit bike completely wrong for the TT. I also said that the rotor bearings would not stand the long straights etc of the TT circuit due to overheating. I had several meetings with Garner telling him in no uncertain terms that if we go to the TT we would be made to look a laughing stock as the engine would break but as usual he would not listen to somebody that knew what they were talking about. Consequently Spondon Engineering had to rush and make two more chassis with bigger oil tanks and geometry to suit the TT Course. Due to this, the bikes were still being built up when we arrived at the I-o-M. The rest is history about this saga as everything happened the way I said it would and the engine failed in practice. Garnder said in MCN etc that every engine we had blew up at the I-o-M in fact, we only ever had two engines and only one blew up twice. Once at Jurby and once on the practice lap.

Now for the 961 which came as a protype from Kenny Dryer of America. I said that it would need a lot of redesign and extensive testing before it ever went on sale. But again, Garner thought he knew better and basically copied the bike and put it into production. Although according to MCN reports etc, obviously bullshit from Garner again, the bike was supposedly completely redesigned. This was untrue and the bikes have been very unreliable.

Because of the overwhelming bullshit attitude of Garner who didn’t have the sufficent funds to finance Norton properly – just conning people to put drips and drabs in which I don’t believe any of them will see any of it back – I felt that I didn’t want my good name dragged down by this person, I resigned. Obviously the 10% shareholding I signed for in the contract never materialised – just more of Garner’s bullshit to get me to work there.

Lots of well known people in the motorcycle industry, have also been conned into joining Norton but all left very shortly after when they found out it was all lies and most of these people never got paid properly, including myself.

I feel very sorry for the people that have paid upfront in full for their bikes and have not received them and I know that some of the few bikes that he has made have been sold to new people who are paying the full amount on delivery just to keep money coming in.

Look at all the promises that have been made by Garner regarding a new 700cc Rotary that he says in the comics has been made and is ready to test on the dyno – what dyno. All bullshit. What about the MotoGP bike he said they were building. All bullshit again. The new TT bike that they said had been designed inhouse was in fact a road Aprillia engine put into a sawn off NRV frame – not a Norton at all and how lucky was Garner that the Senior Race was cancelled.

I think MCN have been bullshitted by Garner into printing all sorts of claims about how many bikes they’re building a week etc because I have spoken to the Chief Editor of MCN and asked why were they putting all this bullshit in about Norton, which was totally untrue and was told that all they’re interested in is selling the extra papers when Norton’s on the front cover. I asked if they weren’t interested in the real truth and to my astonishment he replied that no he wasn’t interested in the truth he just wants to sell newspapers.

Obviously I have kept quiet about all of this, and more, hoping that someone who was owed lots of money would close the company as it is trading illegally as it is insolvent. Because of this site, I think it’s now time to tell the truth about Garner and his fraudulent companies.

Brian Crighton
 
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