tips and tricks for kickstarting a Commando (2014)

dear All,
starting a Commando is part of the experience and I guess everyone has a different story, and few tricks and tips to follow..

how much are you tickling the carbs?
what do you do when you find the 'hard' kick?
do you kickstart with the centre stand?
do you use the throttle?
how many times you kick before starting the engine?
...?

I guess that your stories will help in improving the style and effectiveness of the process..

I do it on the centerstand. I know a lot of people say not to. However, when I rebuilt my engine the compression was so high I about had to.
Mine has the chokes so those are on for a cold start. I usually only tickle one carb, the tickler on the other one has a tendancy to stick. Do it until gas runs out. Keep the throttle closed, or just barely open. This is important as you need the increased vacuum to draw gas through the idle circuit for a rich start condition. Push gently down on the kickstart until you feel resistance, generally about the 9 o'clock position, then give it a smooth power stoke through.
Occaasionally, if if doesn't start after a few kicks you may have flooded it with gas. Take the chokes off, don't tickle it and hold the throttle at least half open. This will clear the excess gas out and they often start when doing it.
Warm start you don't need the choke and if it hasn't sat too long maybe not even tickling.
All of them are a little different, but a properly tuned Brit bike should if not start on the first kick at least fire and then start on the second. If it doesn't do that most of the time you need to do the basic ignition, carb, valves tuneup.

It should not matter how high the compression ratio might be. If you press on the kick starter with your foot and wait until most of the compression has leaked away, a quick flick over TDC is usually sufficient to start the bike. If you bounce the piston off the compression and the motor fires and you've taken the pressure off the kick starter, you can get badly bitten. When you are starting your bike, you should be able to approach it with confidence, knowing it will start without biting you. Even if it has a comp. ratio of 13 to 1 and a capacity of 500cc per cylinder, you should be able to start it easily and safely even if the ignition timing is fully advanced. If the motor fires as you push the piston slowly towards TDC, you should be able to hold the kick-back, however never leave any slack when you are pushing the piston up - do it steadily.

acotrel said:

It should not matter how high the compression ratio might be. If you press on the kick starter with your foot and wait until most of the compression has leaked away, a quick flick over TDC is usually sufficient to start the bike. If you bounce the piston off the compression and the motor fires and you've taken the pressure off the kick starter, you can get badly bitten. When you are starting your bike, you should be able to approach it with confidence, knowing it will start without biting you. Even if it has a comp. ratio of 13 to 1 and a capacity of 500cc per cylinder, you should be able to start it easily and safely even if the ignition timing is fully advanced. If the motor fires as you push the piston slowly towards TDC, you should be able to hold the kick-back, however never leave any slack when you are pushing the piston up - do it steadily.

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I assume this advice is from a man who runs a racing Commando... sans kick starter...?!

Whether or not you have to use the stand will largely depend on your experience. Many people do use the stand, but then again, many side stands 'sag' and many centre stands break. So I'd say it is definitely good practice to not use the stand... But only when you're comfortable doing so.

If its a stock ish engine, it really isn't a big deal, provided you've got no underlying health issues (dodgy knees / ankles / etc).

My 850 is over 10:1 cr. if I waited I til I'd eased it over compression, starting would take ages! I like to get in on compression, not over, then let the kick start return all the way to the top, then give it a good long swing, putting my whole body weight into it. You don't really 'kick' a bike like this, like say a DT175, you swing on the kicker starter to push the engine over.

By getting it on compression, then giving it a good swing, you put inertia / momentum into the crank that will spin it nicely and, hopefully, start it easily.

If you've got stock Amals, you should just have to keep you tickler pressed down until fuel appears there (there is not need to press it up and down continually).

As to how much throttle to use, whether or not to use the chokes, this will vary bike to bike, so practice, and learning is the best way.

Don't be frightened to experiment. Mine has got FCR carbs that need a handful of throttle just as the kick starter gets to the bottom of its swing. It usually starts first time. This seems very counter intuitive to me and i only 'found out' by experimenting with it. If I tried that with Amals it would never start!

Well this usually works for me!


Eddie did you just say cracking the throttle with amals and it would never start? Cos if you did you are mistaken.

J

Authoritatively. :lol:

auldblue said:

Well this usually works for me!

Eddie did you just say cracking the throttle with amals and it would never start? Cos if you did you are mistaken.

J

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No, I mean that with the FCRs it needs 'a handful' of throttle, which with the super quick action throttle supplied by CNW, is not far off of wide open!

Doing that with Amals, when starting a cold engine, in my experience at least, would make it 'gasp' and die.

Fast Eddie said:

auldblue said:

Well this usually works for me!

Eddie did you just say cracking the throttle with amals and it would never start? Cos if you did you are mistaken.

J

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No, I mean that with the FCRs it needs 'a handful' of throttle, which with the super quick action throttle supplied by CNW, is not far off of wide open!

Doing that with Amals, when starting a cold engine, in my experience at least, would make it 'gasp' and die.

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But respect to the Harley gal (it's not you is it Auldblue!?) cos I couldn't kick start a bleedin moped with my left leg... Doing that on a Harley would probably end in a hospital trip...!

for 42 years I kick started my Nortons


as of four weeks ago I no longer have to, thanks to putting out big bucks for an Alton Estart for my 73 850

I take it out almost every day now, don't have to fight through the leg pain anymore

if you are old, your body hurts, and spending $2600 will not change your life then just do it

After flooding the Amals, I don't think I ever followed a special process to start my Roadster..
perhaps I used to give a slow first kick before giving the "real starting kicks"

as per the centre stand, I always try not to use it, but since I am not too tall, I always end up by putting the bike on the stand..

recently I learned to start an XT500 (one cylinder, 500 cc) using the decompression lever and without touching the throttle lever and now I am wondering if there's any related ritual also for my Commando..

Run a kick or 2 with the clutch pulled in, hold tickler down till I see some gas, push on hick start until I feel the most resistance, then ( on the center stand) kick it through and its usually a 1-2 kick event when cold. When warm or if I stall at a traffic light, a slight crack of the throttle and a push of the starter button (on my MK III) usually fires it right back up.
With the Atlas, pretty much the same deal (except the e-start portion). My balance and knees don't allow me to do a non- center stand start, which is a bit of work on the Atlas if I stall at a light.
If everything is close to being in tune, it's a non-issue. When shit's out of whack, different story altogether.

1up3down said:

for 42 years I kick started my Nortons


as of four weeks ago I no longer have to, thanks to putting out big bucks for an Alton Estart for my 73 850

I take it out almost every day now, don't have to fight through the leg pain anymore

if you are old, your body hurts, and spending $2600 will not change your life then just do it

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I have an Alton and agree its a joy to start. My bike was a one or two kick to start but i put most of that down to new pair of Amal's. As the slides are perfect fit in body so when closed best possible vacuum is created. My friend who owned it before me stopped using it as it was pig to start an only carbs have been replaced an even before they and ignition timing were set up properly i started in front of him with one kick from cold. That was definitely the best starting moment as he made me turn it off an start it another twice with one kick to prove it was no fluke. He then swore alot as i tried an failed not to be smug :lol:

Attitude. You have to approach the bike like you're in charge and remember that as you start it.

DogT is spot on and I agree with 1up3down. I wussed out and switched to a push button start pig. I rode it for 2 years enjoying the creature comforts. My poor old Norton has been very sad during this time. However, I have manned up again at 66 and unloaded the wuss police BMW. Sold it to a Highway Patrol young fellow accepted to motor school. Going back to my true love. Tickle her and kick her. Oh the joys in life.

Stock '74 850
Cold, with Amals:
Tickle both carbs until fuel just begins to weep,
Roll engine up to compression,
Bring kickstarter back to the top,
Press and hold kickstarter down against pawl,
Barely crack the throttle open (1/8")
Rise up, and all but lock you knee as you bring all of your weight down on the kickstarter

Hot, with Amals:
Same routine as cold, except,
No tickle (duh),
leave throttle closed, and,
As the kickstarter is reaching the end of the stroke, "blip" the throttle.

I never use the chokes, even in cold weather.

Nathan

I have a MK3 for 20 years and have only started it about 10 times with the electric starter.
the rest of the time I have kicked it to life.

2 kicks when it's cold - 1 when it's warmed up.

The secret ??????
Boyer, Mikuni, and a fully charged battery. Make sure it is tuned it up right - don't kick it like a pussy - and it will start.

Mark said:

don't kick it like a pussy - and it will start.

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Yep, not for the weak of heart. I'd submit that anyone with the right mind-set can start a Norton. That includes my 110 pound, 5' 4" missus. I'd better be careful to hid the keys, or I'll end up with a missing wife and bike!

Nathan

I'm 70 and can still get it going one or 2 strokes, Pazon and 20W50 helps too. I know some have health issues, but I've been lucky. It's still a chore to ride it however. It's a brute and always was. I'm sure there's older guys that still do it. Haven't you guys seen the Italian video where they all start it with their loafers? Heck, hobot and comnoz start it with their hand. I even started mine with my zorries once, but I injured my ankle. I probably had too many Margaritas.

I agree with most of the above. I have modified main stands on both my commandos so ZI always start on the stand if possible. Both are similar but different . I tickle both carbs on bot bikes. the 750 starts easily with a weeeee bit of throttle. The 850 wont start if throttle is used. As soon as they are kicked into life that's when I apply some throttle then rev for a wee while. I don't ever use the chokes on the 750, the 850 has no chokes. THEY ARE BOTH A BITCH TO START WITH FLAT BATTERIES THOUGH. Both have twin Amals.
As has been mentioned above, you will have to experiment with the above techniques because no 2 commandos are the same. [ probably ]
Dereck