Tesla AI Kills Two Motorcyclists

gortnipper

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As Fortnine says in the video calling it Autopilot when its functionality falls far short of that is an issue, especially when that label is taken literally.
Having taken delivery of a Model 3 just 2 weeks ago (i don't and won't use auotpilot) i can say that the adaptive cruise control on the VW Passat i was driving previously, while not fault free, was considerably less prone to random braking etc than the Tesla is proving to be.
Adaptive cruise control is so variable, since they all use such different HW and algorithms.

In my wife's 2016 Ford Ranger, it is downright dangerous as you approach another vehicle - it shuts off as you are approaching and the truck actually accelerates towards a stopped vehicle!

My 2016 Mercedes is excellent. Follows from motorway speeds down to a dead stop without fail. On a non-motorway situation, there can be some braking irregularities. For instance, on a curve with a turn lane at the apex - the system "sees" the car in the turn lane dead ahead, but it is in another lane, so will brake. So, it is not to be mis-used really as an auto-speed pilot. There is a speed-limiter function for that...
 

robs ss

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Adaptive cruise control is so variable, since they all use such different HW and algorithms.

In my wife's 2016 Ford Ranger, it is downright dangerous as you approach another vehicle - it shuts off as you are approaching and the truck actually accelerates towards a stopped vehicle!

My 2016 Mercedes is excellent. Follows from motorway speeds down to a dead stop without fail. On a non-motorway situation, there can be some braking irregularities. For instance, on a curve with a turn lane at the apex - the system "sees" the car in the turn lane dead ahead, but it is in another lane, so will brake. So, it is not to be mis-used really as an auto-speed pilot. There is a speed-limiter function for that...
True - but I believe it comes down to being cautious as you get to know the behaviour under adaptive cruise.
There also circumstances where it should never be used.
Sort of like a gun - a great tool until it's misused.
Cheers

PS: My car also has autonomous braking (apparently!). I have tested adaptive cruise down to a stop in various circumstances. Without looking for the inevitable inane answers, how can I do a test to determine if/how my autonomous brakes function works (if at all)?
 

robs ss

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As a slight aside (WARNING WILL ROBINSON! DERAIL! DERAIL!)
My car also has very smart LED headlights that use the radar to determine where other vehicles are (oncoming and those I'm travelling behind) and creates "dark spots" to prevent dazzling them, obviating the need to dip lights.
I was reticent to trust it for a while, so kept on dipping, but tried it out and found that no-one flashed me so now trust it.
Ain't technology marvellous?
 

gortnipper

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True - but I believe it comes down to being cautious as you get to know the behaviour under adaptive cruise.
There also circumstances where it should never be used.
Sort of like a gun - a great tool until it's misused.
Cheers

PS: My car also has autonomous braking (apparently!). I have tested adaptive cruise down to a stop in various circumstances. Without looking for the inevitable inane answers, how can I do a test to determine if/how my autonomous brakes function works (if at all)?


 

Fast Eddie

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My Merc has auto headlights and they do work well except for the fact that they take too long to return to main after an oncoming vehicle has passed.
It’s a non issue most of the time, but when ‘pressing on a bit’ (well it is an AMG) on an unlit road it is quite disconcerting… I want the main beam NOW… not when the car has decided it’s ok!
 
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He said do away with ABS and auto braking
Do away with airbags and traction control etc
I remember when commuting to and from work in Birmingham that the car to avoid at junctions was a Volvo, drivers knew they were immune from personal injury at 30 to 40 mph so just pulled out at junctions.
 

baz

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I remember when commuting to and from work in Birmingham that the car to avoid at junctions was a Volvo, drivers knew they were immune from personal injury at 30 to 40 mph so just pulled out at junctions.
Indeed
It was a bit easier to spot back then!!
You'd always be careful around Volvo driver's and keep well away
If the driver had a hat on it'd be best to pull over and wait until they'd gone
If they had a hat on and smoking a pipe you'd get up onto the pavement (side walk) until the danger had passed !!!!
 
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AS with all these 'driver aids' no matter how minor, isn't there the risk of reliance through over familiarity? What happens when you jump in another vehicle devoid of those features?
More to the point, what price will the 'wake up call' be?
Driving should demand 100% concentration and involvement IMHO, I can't see these encouraging anything but laziness and laxity.

Yours (on horseback... in a cave :) )
 

MikeG

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AI is coming. Big government loves it.
There will be more to come.
What needs to be done are some kind of transmitter fitted to undersize vehicles, IE motorcycles, scooters, Spyders etc.
If Big Government has their way there won't be any more motorcycles, scooters or spyders anymore. IMHO .
 
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I believe Eddie Izzard had a great solution to improve road safety....fit a giant spike to the steering wheel, an inch away from and pointed right between the driver's eyes..... ;-)
Credited to an economist called Gordon Tullock and called the Tullock Spike.

Tesla AI Kills Two Motorcyclists
 

Lineslinger

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I have a 2022 Honda, er, my wife does.
I have that thing set up to turn OFF all the automatic "safety" and "self driving" BS as well as any other system in the automobile that circumvents my control when I am allowed to drive it. Seems I am too heavy on the accelerator for her liking.

I am still trying to understand what is the advantage of a personal autonomous vehicle.

Have you ever seen anyone trust the automatic parallel parking feature in their new car having said feature?
I haven't.
Not once.
 
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I'm not a fully paid up tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist, but it wouldn't be hard to construe a link to removing free will and freedom of choice by subjugating yourself to the machine..
Drove past a large secondary school yesterday as it was filling up, frightening the number of young people walking neck bent, totally engrossed in the phone and seemingly oblivious to the world around them....
 

Lineslinger

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I'm not a fully paid up tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist, but it wouldn't be hard to construe a link to removing free will and freedom of choice by subjugating yourself to the machine..
Drove past a large secondary school yesterday as it was filling up, frightening the number of young people walking neck bent, totally engrossed in the phone and seemingly oblivious to the world around them....
Yup...damn sad.

I almost hit a new coed a while back when she meandered into the street with her nose buried deep in her phone. Then she got angry with me for honking and scaring her.
It was my fault she spilled her coffee.
 

Fast Eddie

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I live in Oxford which is a big university city with international students.

We see it ALL THE TIME… young students just walk into the road, face in their phone, headphones on. Almost cut off from the world around them!

Here‘s the real problem IMO… instead of addressing this, government will protect against it. So, as AI gets better, it will be seen as the solution to protect. And human drivers will therefore be seen as the problem that causes the danger (rather than the brain dead phone droids). And that will become part of the ‘reason’ for autonomous vehicles…

I prefer Darwinism… allow things to continue for long enough and the phone droid gene will become eradicated naturally (via RTAs), thus greatly improving the human gene pool …
 
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Tornado

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There are technological methods to prevent phone use while in a moving vehicle. As we have all seen, on a daily basis, drivers using phones while underway, this seems an obvious thing for governments to deal with in more effective ways than just having enforcement campaigns. Force all phone manufacturers and/or corporate sellers to implement restrictions for use while in a moving vehicle. My phone knows if I'm hand holding or carrying in my pocket and can disable the auto locking feature. Just a simple matter of a software mod to disable radio or screen use while in a car. Problem solved, millions of $$$ saved in insurance claims, lives saved.

EDIT: and of course there are already solutions doing just this available:

So all we need now is the will of the government to require implementation by providers. We already require all sorts of things from providers, such as radio interference compliance etc.
 
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baz

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I'm not a fully paid up tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorist, but it wouldn't be hard to construe a link to removing free will and freedom of choice by subjugating yourself to the machine..
Drove past a large secondary school yesterday as it was filling up, frightening the number of young people walking neck bent, totally engrossed in the phone and seemingly oblivious to the world around them....
Tesla cars and I believe all electric cars can be turned off wherever they are in the world?
The future could bring a time when our dear government could have control of your electric vehicle
Could there be say an environmental issue that they decide to turn all cars off on a Saturday night for example?
Where's your foil hat! :oops:
 
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