Swapping/Modding Switch Gear to Modern Standards

Some months ago I moved the left side handlebar Lucas switch box to the right side and right side to the left on my 850 Commando MKII. This gives me turn signal switch on the left, which is immensely easier, at least for me, to operate...too much going on already with right hand running throttle and brake. Moving the whole switch boxes as they are means inverting the boxes to have the cabling exit from the inner sides and not need lengthening etc. So, this means the buttons and the levers operate in opposite directions than stock positions. The Kill switch now lives upper left side position and horn upper right side.
Since I ride other modern bikes, I was not liking the horn in upper right...when I need to honk a dopey driver, I need it fast and trying to reach a thumb up over the headlight dip switch while controlling throttle and possibly needing to brake was too awkward.
So I set about planning to move horn function to unused now lower left button. I recalled that switch is actually soldered to wires at the handlebar end. The wiring diagram show WR line connected there which matches my recall of the switch casing inards. And I also found the far end WR female spade connector hanging loose near rear gusset of frame spine. Testing with meter showed this line gets 12v when unused button depressed. So I just ran an extension down to the horn negative terminal, displacing the purple stock connection. Worked perfectly. Yes, a cludge, but will suffice until I next have tank off to get full access to the multi bullet bundle where I can swap the horn button wire with the lower left unused button.

'Been considering that turn signal swap for the very reasons you discribe; I find myself blipping the throttle when trying to operate the signal switch.

Nathan

I actually first heard of this option while perusing one of the several pdf shop manuals for my bike. It mentioned in passing the switches can be fitted to either side of the bars...but no mention of the little issues this causes (inverted lever operation and button placements). Had also considered moving kill switch back to upper right as per modern bikes, but that switch is different internally than all other 3 button switches, as it is normally closed. To migrate it will need a fair bit of modding in the housings.

Me too, but I want to keep all the other switches where they are. I have a suspicion that some Triumphs were that way and I'm actively looking into that possibility, but otherwise it's going to be a major rework which I'm determined to do.


Cheers,

cliffa

I use only left side switch box ... horn is bottom button , lever is for headlight , centre is off , down for low beam , up for high beam .... top button is kill .... I use my arms for direction changes , seems folks notice the flailing arm routine more often than they see my turn indicators flashing on the modern bikes I ride .... who knew , eh .....

cliffa said:

Me too, but I want to keep all the other switches where they are. I have a suspicion that some Triumphs were that way...

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My '72 Triple had the turn signal switch on the left side, and I remember how annoying that it was opposite of my dad's Norton (now mine!). However, it's been so many years that I had the Triumph that I don't remember where the other switches were located. However, I think that some creative wire swapping and/or switch-swapping would land you the combo you're looking for.

Nathan

Craig said:

I use only left side switch box ... horn is bottom button , lever is for headlight , centre is off , down for low beam , up for high beam .... top button is kill .... I use my arms for direction changes , seems folks notice the flailing arm routine more often than they see my turn indicators flashing on the modern bikes I ride .... who knew , eh .....

Click to expand...

It’s probably the novelty of seeing hand signals in action !!

Nater_Potater said:

My '72 Triple had the turn signal switch on the left side, and I remember how annoying that it was opposite of my dad's Norton (now mine!). However, it's been so many years that I had the Triumph that I don't remember where the other switches were located. However, I think that some creative wire swapping and/or switch-swapping would land you the combo you're looking for.

Nathan

Click to expand...

Thanks for confirming Nathan. When I go ahead I’ll create a new thread.

Cheers,

cliffa.

Problem I have with hand signals is that the left hand is busy working clutch like when standing at a light/stop sign etc. or when approaching a rolling turn so at best you can only give a brief wave and hope others see it/understand it. I ride in an urban environment and need to signal my intent very frequently and for decent durations. Hand signals just can't achieve this.

cliffa said:

Me too, but I want to keep all the other switches where they are. I have a suspicion that some Triumphs were that way and I'm actively looking into that possibility, but otherwise it's going to be a major rework which I'm determined to do.


Cheers,

cliffa

Click to expand...

It may be possible with minimal changes to the stock lever operations. I replaced my headlight dip lever with a fresh one b/c DPO had snapped off most the extended flipper end. I discovered the difference between the half-throw dip lever and the full throw turn signal lever is a change in the plastic moulding of the lever's base. The underlying switch internal mechanisms are identical on both left/right sides. So swapping/changing a couple of the cable connections and swapping levers should be sufficient to get left side turns with all other functions same as stock. Note you might need/might not need to source a new dip switch as these half throw levers do come "handed"....if you require high beam to be lever toggled up vs lever toggled down....etc. FYI, I sourced my replacement dip lever from EuroJumbalya....they sell these individually unlike others where you need to buy a complete set of buttons, springs etc.

I have a problem with using a spring loaded switch for a kill switch on a Norton. After a wreck I once had I pushed the kill button but the bike started back up when I let go of it. I have rigged a Honda switch, for the kill, that doesn't look too bad.

Yes, I've noted that...you need to hold the kill down a good second or two to ensure the inertial rotation of engine has stopped to be sure. Not a great "emergency" button...but that's why modern bikes have toggles for this function. Those also have their downsides...I know of quite a few "new-ish" riders that post on forums complaining the bike refuses to start only to find out later they had accidentally toggled the kill to kill position....

I don't think I have ever used a kill switch to turn off a motorcycle and frankly, never understood (still don't) why it is there! But clearly other folks have a different view. As far as swapping switches, I have done that - in fact, I have gone back and forth with the Lucas switches a couple of times and also, for a while after purchasing the CNW/Brembo master cylinder, I used the switch set they sold for that purpose - basically a Honda set as I recall. That worked well but looked terrible, IMO. I was very pleased when they came out with the adapter to use the Brembo with the Lucas switchgear.

I agree that the OEM turn signal switch design is awkward with the Sw on the right. In fact, I used to reach across with my left hand to activate/deactivate the TS, which I found easier than using my right hand. The solution for me was simple: I removed the turn signals! I always thought they were a kludge appearance-wise anyway. Heck, my original '71 back in the day didn't come with turn signals at all. So who the heck needs all this modern crap? (Says the guy who installed an Alton E-start five years ago)

I believe the actual value of the kill switch is during the aftermath of a tip-over....rider away from bike or disabled, engine running and bike still in gear. The kill switch is meant to be an easy to reach shut off for a bystander rather than having to located the ignition switch and key.

That said, I use the kill on my Bonneville all the time as it is the primary shutdown method on the bike since I installed a Keyless ignition system.

Tornado said:

It may be possible with minimal changes to the stock lever operations. I replaced my headlight dip lever with a fresh one b/c DPO had snapped off most the extended flipper end. I discovered the difference between the half-throw dip lever and the full throw turn signal lever is a change in the plastic moulding of the lever's base. The underlying switch internal mechanisms are identical on both left/right sides. So swapping/changing a couple of the cable connections and swapping levers should be sufficient to get left side turns with all other functions same as stock. Note you might need/might not need to source a new dip switch as these half throw levers do come "handed"....if you require high beam to be lever toggled up vs lever toggled down....etc. FYI, I sourced my replacement dip lever from EuroJumbalya....they sell these individually unlike others where you need to buy a complete set of buttons, springs etc.

Click to expand...

Thanks Tornado. Of course I don't want to make it too easy for myself, I also want to keep the colour codes correct, but i don't think it's possible to withdraw the individual cables from the grey sleeve, so i'll have to look for something which looks the same.

Cheers,

cliffa.

I know of quite a few "new-ish" riders that post on forums complaining the bike refuses to start only to find out later they had accidentally toggled the kill to kill position....
You would be surprised how fast one can exhaust one's self when trying to kick start a bike with the switch in the kill position!
said the not so "new-ish" rider

A favorite trick of an old friend of mine (RIP) was to ride along side you and flip the kill switch

I had a friend who jumped on my newly purchased 76 and agressively played with all the switches . Later that eve. after he went home all boozed up , when I had to move it , (parking rules) it would not start . Sweaty and tired I finally saw the switch to the side position. I've never touched a kill switch in my life. Notice I said HAD a friend.

cliffa said:

Thanks Tornado. Of course I don't want to make it too easy for myself, I also want to keep the colour codes correct, but i don't think it's possible to withdraw the individual cables from the grey sleeve, so i'll have to look for something which looks the same.

Cheers,

cliffa.

Click to expand...

Well, to keep all wiring codes correct then moving switch casings to opposite sides gets that, but then buttons are not stock locations and rewiring them to correct functions,
again gets you incorrect colour coding...plus kill switch cannot move other switch casing as it is the odd fish in the set (normally closed).
Seems a lot of folks completely make up new wiring harnesses from no stock colour coded wires...I guess they just paste in their new schematic and colour codes into their workshop manuals.

I recently disconnected the kill switch. I didn't like the skinny wires through the old switch and back to the Boyer. I heard too many stories of this circuit creating problems.
I didn't measure the voltage drop before I disconnected the kill switch, but it seems to me the Boyer is now getting a "better" source of power. Bike seems to start and idle better.

Stephen Hill