Hey Guys, I have a 1976 commando which I converted to Boyer electronic ignition, Accel coil (140403s) and electronic regulator. I have had this change over for about seven years and have had no problems with the bike, however out of the blue the bike will only run for about ten to fifteen minutes and it stops as if the ignition was shut off and no spark to the plugs. Leave the bike sit for a while and it starts up and runs as smooth as glass for another ten minutes. I thought something getting hot and shutting off, cools and works again.The first thing I thought of was the Boyer black box. I replaceed the black box and the coils at the points conversion. Didn,t help so I called the Accel people and they said it could be the coil so I replaced it and it still does the same thing. I also swapped out the electronic regulator which I didn,t think would be the problem and it wasn,t. Could it be the electronic ignition unit mounted beside the battery?? When it does stop I do have power to the black box. Does anybody have any suggestions as what could be doing this. Thanks Hershey
runs but not long
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Sounds like the battery is good (holds a load for 10 min. or so and then recovers when off) but perhaps not charging. Get out the multimeter and check for charging at and above 2000 rpm.
Check the battery with key off, then with key on and then when the bike is running revving to 3 grand or so. Report results to forum.
What are you running for a regulator/rectifier? Stock or after market all in one like a Podtronic. It could be the voltage regulator or perhaps the stator if you show little to no charging.
Check the battery with key off, then with key on and then when the bike is running revving to 3 grand or so. Report results to forum.
What are you running for a regulator/rectifier? Stock or after market all in one like a Podtronic. It could be the voltage regulator or perhaps the stator if you show little to no charging.
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hershey said:
You said that you: "replaced the black box and the coils at the points conversion"
So it seems you replaced the Boyer box and the Boyer pickup plate, but then you said: "Could it be the electronic ignition unit mounted beside the battery?" But the Boyer box is the electronic ignition unit-so, I don't understand what "electronic ignition unit beside the battery" you mean? Do you mean the charge warning light assimilator unit (a small rectangular black plastic "box" with 5 male spade terminals)?
Did you also renew the wiring between the pickup plate and Boyer box when you replaced them?
I,am using the podtronic regulator and the bike is charging very well. Battery is still charged and turns the starter over very well after it quits running. I did replace the wireing from the boyer pick-up plate to the boyer black box but did not replace the magnetic plate on the camshaft. The electronic ignition unit I was refering to is the warning light assimilator unit which is mounted next to the battery . Don,t know if that would cause the problem. Has anyone had a Boyer failure? Do they quit firing never to fire again or could they give problems like I have? Maybe I have two black boxes that are not working . What I did do is replace the Boyer box and used the same Accel coil. Maybe the first coil did something to both Boyer boxes. What about unhooking the hot wire from the Boyer black box and running a wire direct from the battery to eliminate the wireing harness and try that?? Thanks for all your input!!! Hershey
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hershey said:
It's unlikely, but you could try disconnecting it, as it's only an electronic "light switch".
hershey said:
It does happen, however many intermittent cutting out problems are caused by bad wiring or bad ignition or kill switch connections which can often be identified by temorarily wiring the Boyer directly to the battery (both hot and ground side)-however the battery must be in good condition and fully charged.
hershey said:
What is the primary resistance of the Accel coil?[Edit: Apparently a 140403s coil should be 3 Ohms] A dual coil with a primary resistance of less than 3 Ohms could damage a Boyer box.
batrider
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It sounds like you mean the blue Lucas 2MC capacitor next to the battery. The warning light assimilator is usually under the tank. They are about the same size and both mounted on springs.
Also Hershey, I believe the 140403s are individual single tower coils of 3 ohms each so in series it is 6 ohms so no problem with that.
Russ
Also Hershey, I believe the 140403s are individual single tower coils of 3 ohms each so in series it is 6 ohms so no problem with that.
Russ
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batrider said:
But perhaps not on a "1976 Commando"? Presumably it's a late Mk3 model so the Mk3 type solid state assimilator is a rectangular black plastic item normally fixed to the battery tray.
batrider said:
A 140403s kit has a dual coil.
http://www.chrome-addiction.com/g-accel ... -27690.php
Yes mine has the small retangular solid state assimilator mounted to the lowest part of the battery compartment and foward of the battery. If I,am correct, you can disconnect this unit altogheher and the bike will still run, but not sure?? According to the accel people the accel 140403s coil has the correct oms as long as you use the silicon wires supplied with the kit. I think I,ll try the hot wires direct from the battery to eliminate the wiring harness. Maybe I,ll get a chance today. I,ll let you know how it turns out. When I do find the problem it will probably be something simple but hard to find for this bike has only six thousand miles and is in extremely good condition. If I could figure out how to post a picture I,ll do so. Thanks for your help Hershey
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I am going thru same problem on my 1975 mk3, had been running great then after about year since upgrading it started dying. Little different setup, am using tri-spark ignition with supplied wiring and accel coil. I am highly suspecious of the kill switch which I will take apart for examination. Will post after exam.
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Your fuel filter is semi -clogged up.
Well I hooked the boyer black box up direct to the battery and the bike still did the same thing, ten minutes or so and it shut off. No fire to the plugs!! Allmost positive it is the black box. When wired direct to the battery the problem has to be either the black box or the coil. brand new coil so it has to be the black box again, but what is causing the black boxes to short out??? Could it be the first Accel coil shorted out both black boxes before I replaced it or am I that unlucky to get a second black box that is doing the same thing??? What do you guys think, any ideas!! This is getting a little expensive not knowing what exactly to replace!!! Can the Boyer black box be replaced without buying the kit?? Thanks for your help, Hershey
Took apart kill switch, cleaned the terminals and all wires sound but not the problem. Called colorado norton works re: problem and they recomended testing the accel coil when it dies for 3ohms across terminals.Carb has been taken apart cleaned with compressed air, fuel flow is ok. Have been going around the block so many times to stay close, people used to wave they are now flipping the bird, guess I will have to find a diff route. Thanks for any advise RDK
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rogika said:
It seems too consistent which is probably why it seems like the coil might be a likely suspect. Whereas the Boyer Black Box would be expected to work or not, although a capacitor or something inside could be heating up and failing.
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O.K. ,so you cleaned the fuel filter ,now check your ground wire(s) to the frame for any oxidation - crud. El. igns. demand a good ground.
I'm going out on a limb, here, and suggest that it might be fuel related. Unlikely as it may sound in an old Norton, the symptoms are very similar to what happens when gas stops flowing because of vacuum lock in the tank. If the vent in the tank cap is blocked, fuel will flow until the pressure in the tank is negative enough to stop the flow. After a few minutes, air seeps back into the tank and it'll flow just fine. As a test, try riding around your neighbourhood with the fuel tank cap unlocked - if it is the cause, she should keep on running.
Paul.
Paul.
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