Race only tyre street warning

Just wondering why the race tyres come with warning in side wall
Not For Street Use?

Race tires are vital for me to have half a chance to make it to tarmac.
I've tried all variety of tires on The Gravel, tractor cleated to
dual purpose to hi mileage on both Commando and SV650.
Best tire on surfaces you can't dig down into, tarmac and hard
tack with loose pebble layer is a compound so soft, dead cold
still grips stones to embed strong enough fender don't
scrap many of them off. Can judge compound by how loud
they are, both fender scratching and pebble flinging,
just rolling at leisure rates. Hehe, when I return to THE Grit from
tarmac they are so soft pebbles can't stay embedded
so only the spray of pebble heard. Either way they start
out with more grip than standard street tire to me.

I could not afford to keep tires on my SV if not for used
race tires that just have some melt on the very edges,
almost new centers. These are $250 tires at $50 bux a pop average,
got 5 on hand now, but may never use them once a Commando
operational soon. No side tread left and center cords showing
at ~4000 mile even taking care not to load center. Only
reason I change them is get so thin pebble edge make
whole tire surface leak when soapy water applied.
Too bad for me vintage racers can fit them to their street bikes too.

I have so many flats on cars and bike I'm known as tire shampoo'r guy.

hobot

I run Pirelli Supercorsa SC2's on my tard. 60 honest HP at the rear wheel and 280 lbs wet. I burn through a set in 1000 miles. Gone, toast, shagged, completely trashed.
I buy all the race takeoff's I can find.

I remember the local hooligans having a 'thing' about cut slicks a few years ago...they kept falling off!

In the er...'temperate' climate here in Lancashire there was no way to get any heat into them.

I had Michy Hi-sports on my 851 and the sides were totally gone in 1500 miles (including running in).
A GSXR owner looked it over when I was selling it and said he thought the mileage was suspect as the same tyres on his bike had done over 2000miles and had plenty of tread left.
I didn't get offended by the assertion about the mileage - I'd had the bike from new, so WTF would I want to do fiddling the mileage?
I did want to ask him if he was gay though :mrgreen:

Yeah Man pbmw, Pirellia Diablo's are one of my favorites.
I bought a new set for SV650, only 70 hp, 370 lb to test on
THE Gravel, after tarmac ride wore off the mold release I
tried a couple of Gravel turns on spun up rear, first one
at 80 w/o much cross up, 2nd one over 90 crossed up
and drifting some yards wide, that weakened me from
adrenalin, so just tooled on home easy but pleased rest the way
Checked rear to see at least 1/3 = $100 bux worth
of rubber gone. ugh could show cords in about 5-6 miles.

I rarely accelerate upright, nil engine braking drag and
about never use rear brake plus I weave as much as
I can on straights only giving throttle at apexes
to save the frequency of tire changes on my own
corner cripple fat tire modern buzzy utility appliance.

So you-I know race only tires are a sweet deal on any bike,
so why the warning against street use?

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2584250 ... 1179jBUupU
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2622312 ... 1179WIJFAy
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2550339 ... 1179hIrXPO
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2812755 ... 1179wdUPNP

hobot

Years ago I took a set of AM22/23 race take-offs and put them on my RZ350 streetbike. Not good. I could not get enough heat into the tires and the rubber cold-tore off the tires instead of beading off as it was supposed to.

Anyone who can ride their streetbike hard enough to get race tires to heat cycle propoerly is more man than I.

hobot said:

So you-I know race only tires are a sweet deal on any bike,
so why the warning against street use?
hobot

Click to expand...

Because they aren't meant for the street?

Ok Northern, insightful comment about chipping bits off cold race tire
vs melt beading. I'm a close tire snooper to learn the signs
of what's pilots being doing or not doing to them.

Ozark highways are designed to allow good tire heating w/o
getting crazy or loose, 10 miles - 9 minutes on tarmac I can't leave
hand on tires. Heck they are mostly warm and chaffed to
fuzzy by time I reach tarmac just trying to make it safely.
I'd judge about 160'F is average non racer riding temp.

I can feel the race or other tires feel softer ride & slightly stickier
sense after about 5 miles, so don't press on them much till
then and only creep up on loads till first hint of let go
as obvious limit to cross or not cross according to my state of mind
and need to show up some where intact.

On all other bikes skip outs re-verbs though chassis and pilot
with a change in lean and fork aim that must be countered,
if not automatically the way you wanted. With tri linked Peel,
she just steps out a bit wider radius, same lean same aim till backing off,
as no other action or thought needed by pilot.

Yet to try real full street tires on Peel, only 80/20 on/off raod
dual purpose chunky tread, so don't know
what even more traction might provide in G forces
before traction decreases.

First tire I'm fitting to Peel is a barely used rear vintage
Avon 23 in 130x18" V rated , donated by Ken Canaga.
Bike it was on broke before any leaning or much melting
heat cycle occurred. I've a ice and snow tire softener
spray that does soften but must de-grease before pressing.

hobot

DOT tires / wheels have to meet strength criteria for potholes, bricks, obstacles etc. that aren't encountered on the smooth, nice race track.

hi hobot,its all about tyre temperature,race tyers need to be fully warmed up to give their best,something thats hard to maintain on the street unless ur a complete nutter,suppose same goes for street tyers on the track,as they are designed to work best at lower temperature ,then theres the compound race tyers are softer and it dose,nt matter that you need a new set every season(on a vintage or classic racer)but it does on a street bike if you need a new set every 200 miles

hobot said:

Yeah Man pbmw, Pirellia Diablo's are one of my favorites.
I bought a new set for SV650, only 70 hp, 370 lb to test on
THE Gravel, after tarmac ride wore off the mold release I
tried a couple of Gravel turns on spun up rear, first one
at 80 w/o much cross up, 2nd one over 90 crossed up
and drifting some yards wide, that weakened me from
adrenalin, so just tooled on home easy but pleased rest the way
Checked rear to see at least 1/3 = $100 bux worth
of rubber gone. ugh could show cords in about 5-6 miles.

I rarely accelerate upright, nil engine braking drag and
about never use rear brake plus I weave as much as
I can on straights only giving throttle at apexes
to save the frequency of tire changes on my own
corner cripple fat tire modern buzzy utility appliance.

So you-I know race only tires are a sweet deal on any bike,
so why the warning against street use?

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2584250 ... 1179jBUupU
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2622312 ... 1179WIJFAy
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2550339 ... 1179hIrXPO
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2812755 ... 1179wdUPNP

hobot

Click to expand...

I went for a ride out to my favorite set of twisties last year. Turned right at an interstction and the back got a little squirly...
when I got home I found this...



I do back it into corners. Love this bike...
But the thing is, It weighs 280 or so wet. I run about 21 or 22lbs in the rear. 24 in the front. I guarantee I can get heat in the tire. No cold tearing. Just nice traction.

This tire had also just done a 500 mile day ride from my hose oustide Seattle to the Portland area down the coast. Kilt the center of the tire.

Hehe, good therapy to read i'm just so-so in world of motorcyclers
squeezing last life out of tires.

So, it just a legal CYA issue that tire makers put the warning in the race
tires. This would apply to any tire, ordinary street tires included,
"don't serve up cold -best eaten when hot".

I used to be pensive on non DOT race meats, but Jeeze Louise good
ones start out with more traction cold than most DOT street tires hot.

MichaelB has a point about the toughness for road hazards, as
race meats are scary thin stockings to examine. You can
see the bulge I knocked in one. But a hand full of tires ground to
the cords I find them no more failure or flat or blow out prone
than regular less grippy tires.

Pbmw, your lack of bike mass and cleaned tires to very edges
is not lost on me, way to go and hope you go a long time at it.

hobot

I'll say one thing about race takeoff's or DOT race tires. They aren't the hot ticket in the wet.
And...you need to have your tire pressures set correctly for you, your bike/suspension and conditions. Seriously.
We ride some pretty serious back roads here on occasion. I would never cosider doing that without proper setup and in the warm dry weather. But when setup properly, they heat quickly and are very consistant offering outstanding levles of traction and feedback.
Not for the novice though...
I've been considering cut slicks...

Yes sir, like taking psychedelics, its should be a self made choise
to risk the adventure and crash recovery seeking limits of
existence.

I tippy toe in wet in turns - no matter the type tires.
I also tippy toe when roads damp, or frost in shady spots
or when very dry but dusty layer.

I don't press luck testing tire traction, I work up to it
to KNOW exactly what will happen over powering or over
leaning or both at once.

Pulling off extreme of handling in public is like screwing
with other fellers wives, only takes a few now and then
to keep the juices flowing, but it ain't a life style one
can survive long if not picking and choosing the risk taking.

Two times that I really allow myself to enter tire spin
turns on or off road, when tires have most meat, then
when they have center cords showing but still some
flesh on the sides so will remove soon any way.

There is a good deal of corner traction lost between
18" x120 size and 150-170 x17" size, ignoring compound.
This is how I know Cdo narrow tires have advantage
over the fatso tires once past 45'.

It dangerous for me to hope on race shod SV650 after
a ride on my Combats with 110-120 rears. [usually d/t a flat]
Fat tires traction dissolves faster leaned than narrower tire.
Not many will lean over or power enough to feel the
difference. But I can't avoid this d/t the 4 miles of
Gravel paths to get to stable predictable surface like
pasture grass or tarmac.
If not leaned much the fat tire grips more but just
beyond this the narrow one is more predicable.

The Groomed Gravel paths are great training for which end
will let go first and how much a bike's CoG causes rear
to swing out, or whole bike just twists both ends around
its CoG. Its identical to best surface on best heated
race slicks, just happens at lower slower speed, power loads
to learn with a chance to save it or get back up to try
better next time. Its way easier on tarmac as the
slips stop fast on load let off, but Not On THE Gravel.

Don't know if luck or skill, but I've yet to ever crash
in a fast turn, but plenty in slow turns or braking
in emergency or just trotting along hitting series
of pot holes that resonate with suspension and bike
gets both end air borne a few inches but with some
un-even last tire torque to turn bike almost horizontal
before landing on ya and rear end swings around to
grind ya and bike parts off. Best luck to us all.

hobto