Norvarna for the "Gravel".
- Thread starter Snorton74
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I like it too
Now if you can do that to a P11 to keep the weight down to about 325lbs. Then that would be a hoot.
CNN
Now if you can do that to a P11 to keep the weight down to about 325lbs. Then that would be a hoot.
CNN
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If hobot was 1st to present or praise such a interesting hybrid I'd expect it to get laughed off list and classed with funny long fork choppers with meaty squat rear tire. Long miles of Graveled commutes definitely teaches stuff to the boney core and this one teaches me what range of suspension excess is still workable in chain travel clearance and that its still delightful handy on hwy to boot. I'd be real alert pensive to try to dice it up with this dude on that capable a Commando no matter the surfaces but would give a nut to try to live though that adventure. Its real Commando as frame and isolastics retained.
Jim I've tried a couple of KTM type bikes in rough stuff and didn't like as much as my road going Peel, 'cept for the high centering snags upsets. You all do know High centering don't always hit and lift on both frame rails at once for an unresistable force up over and down, if not striking something big bad and vertical in the flight path first. Being able to lift assist front over objects alleviates some need of fork travel. Serious hill climbs and trial scrambles is definitely stuff I want to try on Peel so will find out pecking order in what ever way I can. I have an very capable 4wd PU with lugged mudder tires ice spiked for rock slabs to boot but by golly Peel could out do it by far, except in mud of course. Please try to get some video from the maniac that Maney torque monster is going to power rear way too much.
Jim I've tried a couple of KTM type bikes in rough stuff and didn't like as much as my road going Peel, 'cept for the high centering snags upsets. You all do know High centering don't always hit and lift on both frame rails at once for an unresistable force up over and down, if not striking something big bad and vertical in the flight path first. Being able to lift assist front over objects alleviates some need of fork travel. Serious hill climbs and trial scrambles is definitely stuff I want to try on Peel so will find out pecking order in what ever way I can. I have an very capable 4wd PU with lugged mudder tires ice spiked for rock slabs to boot but by golly Peel could out do it by far, except in mud of course. Please try to get some video from the maniac that Maney torque monster is going to power rear way too much.
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Figured you'd already have something like this kickin around.[/quote]
I have an N15 that I was in the middle of building into a dual sport thing when I had my shop disaster. It has long forks and a monoshock rear but it needs a lot of finishing. I would like to put it back to stock and find a rolling KTM chassis to do it right. Jim
I have an N15 that I was in the middle of building into a dual sport thing when I had my shop disaster. It has long forks and a monoshock rear but it needs a lot of finishing. I would like to put it back to stock and find a rolling KTM chassis to do it right. Jim
Nater_Potater
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The slab-sided float bowl looks to make it so.1up3down said:
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hehe jumping in and out of creeks and across fresh logged clearings and hill climbs an extended swing arm would help but for hauling ass over stuff below axle height this Norvarna is set up to take it. Looks about 11" frame clearance, cool. Note similar solution & location of the extended side stand.
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Revealing opinions and display from paved over limited builders. Drip pan under hangs up on stuff and collects THE Gravel thrown up by front and its counter productive to handling safety to bias weight forward or shorten wheel base by moving tranny forward like smooth secure road racers do. One thing going off on loose stuff develops a sense for is how much wobble/weave is tolerable before the positive feed back snaps ya down. If one could keep accelerating forever it'd stave off the take down wobbles forever too. The other thing loose surfaces teach is the rear rules the roost so extended chopper-ish front helps keep it out of fighting the rear vectoring. It leaves me tingling trembling with adrenalin off roading because of the need to seeming keep over doing throttle into-over-though rough stuff when every innate reflex sense is to back TF Off. If ya do then front plants too much and rudders the rear of bike around on its vertical CoG in a flash, Splat. My huge surprise i want to bother yo'all's restless sleep with is how much further over the lifted front allows on paved roads to prevent high side from the side G's developed on hook up > so can press G's even more than a regular low down road racer, till just steering off the rear controlled drift out, short of flat tracker slide off of paved road. Of course there are times/conditions better just barely creep with both feet down, if ya know what's ahead over the crest or around a bend, if not - going bizerk can save the ride with a sensation you'll never get out of your bones.
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302 lb is Dam noteworthy remarkable Ludwig and one of the best things to take off the paved paths. Now if ya had some extra suspension travel you might be sorely temped to short cut those spectacular switch backs for some extra thrills. With a heavier Maney big block and ITT tranny I don't think my project can match that even dry. I don't weigh 160 lb so do expect better power to mass reaction. Much as performance is always thought about in weight its also on my mind for ease to pick back up out of ditches and drag out of brushes hang ups while somewhat injured. Crash cage adds about 15-16 lb counting the frame hard points but adds a ton of protection for the shear thrill of it.
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Ludwig, what does your bike weigh? I think you said once but I couldn't find it. Jim[/quote]
My Commando is 137 kg ( 302 lbs ) with new tires , oil , battery , freshly packed muflers , but no fuel ..[/quote]
That's really good for a streetbike. It takes a lot of work to get there.
The roadracer above weighed just under 280 dry plus the engine and trans sit a lot closer to the front wheel.
No street legalities to add weight and a lighweight chromoly frame with lots of Ti and magnesium were needed to get there.
I still have that frame and trans. With a pair of 50 mm Marzocchies [on the shelf] and a different swingarm it could be a fun dual sport. Jim
My Commando is 137 kg ( 302 lbs ) with new tires , oil , battery , freshly packed muflers , but no fuel ..[/quote]
That's really good for a streetbike. It takes a lot of work to get there.
The roadracer above weighed just under 280 dry plus the engine and trans sit a lot closer to the front wheel.
No street legalities to add weight and a lighweight chromoly frame with lots of Ti and magnesium were needed to get there.
I still have that frame and trans. With a pair of 50 mm Marzocchies [on the shelf] and a different swingarm it could be a fun dual sport. Jim
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Yes I mentioned this Norvarna educating me on what could be gotten away with in swing arm and chain function. I get laughed at on showing Peel leaned on a tree showing her extra tall stance and swing arm down angle. Peel should have 5.5 inches rear and 6" front travel and will need both a chain tensioner and a swing arm rub plate for chain control. My scab together pride in this rear area is not the extra range but getting the bulbous alloy swing arm air tank front tube to miss the factory placed oil filter, my rump rod link, air fitting tap and hoses and air station submarine. You and Jim and others have such world class accomplishments I fully admire and learn from but not that applicable to me d/t all the compromises Peel needs to expand her flights into fantasy envelope.
Up to point I had very rural machinist finish the last front link I'd not done what I consider real off road, just bumpy pastures like Steve McQueen and THE Gravel paths, mostly pretty groomed like prior to paving. I did hit a gropher hole on hi slope in my pasture at about 60 mph once with hobot Roadholders that hit my helment on bars as it bottomed and blasted clouds of sod clods and dust like an explosion but heard-felt no bottoming sound or solid hit so landed again fine to carry on faster than I could get an emotional horror response I'd bend the fork. Peel got like 4 ft in the air before slam down so approaching what MX do, though quite unintended at the time.
The real off road test stuff done intentionally occurred at the machinist severe back yard course to match anything you've seen in crazy events like stumps and tires and jumps or hill climbs or going off edge of Mt paths no way to stop fall to bottoms, which need power accelerating faster than gravity to have a change to make it up far side wall, which just means back on raw wooded leaf covered rock strewn 30-45' Mt side slope back into what ya just got out of >> so still in tire spin leaning and drifting to steer off angle around tree/limb and not hi side or low side all the way down again the bad way.
Freaked me out as didn't expect their course was that rugged and I'm not experienced rider, till suddenly into horrors and no way back. This is not the trail riding terrain like Jim's showed us in Co Mt. Its like the insane scrambles with bowling balls, log piles and tree stumps that hang up the Mx'rs and trap good riders all avoiding the 2 ft tall stumps, but with good tractor tire Peel would just climb the dam stump to hop off and carry on.
Road racing in public scares the crap out of me but Only d/t the hazards not losing control anymore like other cycles. On pavement Peel was **totally** under my thumb especially after the rugged shocking learning curves on 1st time on full tri linkage. Flabbergasting Fabulous after the couple moderns I learned on. If Peel was only neck and neck in handling pavement like modern racers then I'd not bothered to over power her to hit 160+ in opens and break free at will over the ton. I was told time and time again that anything I did to improve off road would hurt the paved racing but I found exactly opposite, to point road racing is not on my mind that much but for proving pecking order that most can relate too. ho hum mere refreshment warm up to Peel. Coming home after tangling with very upset sports riders I still didn't get adrenalin trembles so would leap off my drive way culvert into creek bed 4 ft down and run its bowling ball rocks and foot tall ledges then try to get back out on steep slope diagonally on wet tire and muddy leaves loose gravel and actually do it about every time!
The last time Peel was in her prime was a cold day I'd started at home level and descended into creek bed run and very touchy throttle traction controlled lean-spin-slide-drift-bounce slip back up to pasture then into my shed, maybe 1.5 min warm up prior to going out and hunting new age fatso craft, when her throttle stuck WOT 1st time ever... so maybe ya don't know what ya missing out on and hope to demo it in spades someday. I'm not that good but Peel sure was. Might break under 300 # wet in her minimalist configuration and 350# in full dressor bagger caged in fairing cargo touring set up.
Up to point I had very rural machinist finish the last front link I'd not done what I consider real off road, just bumpy pastures like Steve McQueen and THE Gravel paths, mostly pretty groomed like prior to paving. I did hit a gropher hole on hi slope in my pasture at about 60 mph once with hobot Roadholders that hit my helment on bars as it bottomed and blasted clouds of sod clods and dust like an explosion but heard-felt no bottoming sound or solid hit so landed again fine to carry on faster than I could get an emotional horror response I'd bend the fork. Peel got like 4 ft in the air before slam down so approaching what MX do, though quite unintended at the time.
The real off road test stuff done intentionally occurred at the machinist severe back yard course to match anything you've seen in crazy events like stumps and tires and jumps or hill climbs or going off edge of Mt paths no way to stop fall to bottoms, which need power accelerating faster than gravity to have a change to make it up far side wall, which just means back on raw wooded leaf covered rock strewn 30-45' Mt side slope back into what ya just got out of >> so still in tire spin leaning and drifting to steer off angle around tree/limb and not hi side or low side all the way down again the bad way.
Freaked me out as didn't expect their course was that rugged and I'm not experienced rider, till suddenly into horrors and no way back. This is not the trail riding terrain like Jim's showed us in Co Mt. Its like the insane scrambles with bowling balls, log piles and tree stumps that hang up the Mx'rs and trap good riders all avoiding the 2 ft tall stumps, but with good tractor tire Peel would just climb the dam stump to hop off and carry on.
Road racing in public scares the crap out of me but Only d/t the hazards not losing control anymore like other cycles. On pavement Peel was **totally** under my thumb especially after the rugged shocking learning curves on 1st time on full tri linkage. Flabbergasting Fabulous after the couple moderns I learned on. If Peel was only neck and neck in handling pavement like modern racers then I'd not bothered to over power her to hit 160+ in opens and break free at will over the ton. I was told time and time again that anything I did to improve off road would hurt the paved racing but I found exactly opposite, to point road racing is not on my mind that much but for proving pecking order that most can relate too. ho hum mere refreshment warm up to Peel. Coming home after tangling with very upset sports riders I still didn't get adrenalin trembles so would leap off my drive way culvert into creek bed 4 ft down and run its bowling ball rocks and foot tall ledges then try to get back out on steep slope diagonally on wet tire and muddy leaves loose gravel and actually do it about every time!
The last time Peel was in her prime was a cold day I'd started at home level and descended into creek bed run and very touchy throttle traction controlled lean-spin-slide-drift-bounce slip back up to pasture then into my shed, maybe 1.5 min warm up prior to going out and hunting new age fatso craft, when her throttle stuck WOT 1st time ever... so maybe ya don't know what ya missing out on and hope to demo it in spades someday. I'm not that good but Peel sure was. Might break under 300 # wet in her minimalist configuration and 350# in full dressor bagger caged in fairing cargo touring set up.
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Real off road is freaking dangerous and crazy scary. It takes a lot of standing on pegs at good speed. There are hard slam downs and launches, some holes some lumps, but also going from levelish onto embankment sideways, all can slam head onto bars or even chest into tank. Squaty soft aired rear, extended fork and tall wide bars are required features for this and not thought of as helpful on pavement but supermotards tend to be this way. Blower may be over kill for touchy rough stuff so would sport just single carb 920 with the Qualife gear box so no need of cage to protect blower. Rear sprocket is changable to compensate for the AMC ratios. No charging system no cage, no air station, no water tank, no Drouin no mirrors no lights and half the oil mass may be my favorite version.
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I have a set of "right side up" Hausaberg forks that I plan to put on a long travel bike. Hausaberg builds a nice long travel frame that I think might be easier to adapt to a Norton engine than a KTM frame. What I like about that Norvana though is that it is somewhat of a "could have been" bike with parts that were not too far removed from the Norton production years. A build like that would be a good platform for your "twingle engine", Jim.
One thing that I think would be an absolute blast would be to enter a Norton powered bike into a race like the Dakar! With the 1007cc that Jim has been testing, add some serious cooling mods and a really good rider I think it would get world wide attention.
One thing that I think would be an absolute blast would be to enter a Norton powered bike into a race like the Dakar! With the 1007cc that Jim has been testing, add some serious cooling mods and a really good rider I think it would get world wide attention.
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