Norton newby

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Hi Im a newby on this site and have only just got into this forum stuff ( passes time at work) :D
I belong to old school performance anyway Im currently building two commandos
One is an Interstate the other is a modded one
My question is has anyone put a bike together useing a different system other than the isolastics
Any help would be appreciated
 
If you were to change the balance factor I guess you could get away without, You might want to look into Jim Schmidt's pistons and rods if that is the route you want to take. But if you were to solid mount a stock Commando engine I think you might vibrate it to pieces in short order. Chuck. http://users.gotsky.com/jimschmidt/nortonrods.html
 
Hortons Norton said:
If you were to change the balance factor I guess you could get away without, You might want to look into Jim Schmidt's pistons and rods if that is the route you want to take. But if you were to solid mount a stock Commando engine I think you might vibrate it to pieces in short order. Chuck. http://users.gotsky.com/jimschmidt/nortonrods.html

My guess is that the lightweight pistons and rods would make a featherbed Commando tolerable. In a Commando frame you might be able to cinch up the Isos pretty tight.

The best alternative (or addition) I've seen is the various Heim/Rose/spherical rod links either on the headsteady or in some cases at each engine/frame mounting point.
 
Why not go with a combination of these control rods to limit side to side play. One is made by Keith, one by Jim and the other one by Bob. As far as I know, no one has put rose joints at all three points.

Norton newby

Norton newby

Norton newby


I'm pretty sure the Harleys use a similar arrangment to limit the transmission of vibration from their paint shaker engine to the frame and ultimately to your dental fillings. With rose joints at three points, there would be negligible side to side movement and no more up, down, back and forth movement than the regular isolastics.

Jean
 
Jeandr said:
Why not go with a combination of these control rods to limit side to side play. One is made by Keith, one by Jim and the other one by Bob. As far as I know, no one has put rose joints at all three points.
Jean

I thought that's what I said... :mrgreen:

Even with the joints I think you need the Isos just to support the drivetrain.
 
Welcome to the forum oldman! There are lots of commando engines rigidly mounted in featherbed frames. It should be just like any other bike although as others have pointed out you should alter the balance factor. Rebalancing the crank is cheap or if you are running a 750 you can use an atlas crank as I understand.

Got any photos? It's a good idea to get before photos for that day when you have completed the work.
 
swooshdave said:
Jeandr said:
Why not go with a combination of these control rods to limit side to side play. One is made by Keith, one by Jim and the other one by Bob. As far as I know, no one has put rose joints at all three points.
Jean

I thought that's what I said... :mrgreen:

Even with the joints I think you need the Isos just to support the drivetrain.

I just provided pictures to get a better idea of what you said :wink:

And right you are, you still need the ISOs to both support the engine and to let it shake like it wants to do keeeping the vibration away from sensitive body parts :mrgreen:

Jean
 
I don't know if the design was changed after I left the company - I didn't keep in touch.

In the original concept, side-to-side movement of the engine/transmission cradle was supposed to be limited by the polyurethane spacers between the isolastics and the attachment points to the frame. One design flaw that was fixed was the tendency of the spacer tube between isos on the same spindle from going bell-mouth shaped if the spindle nuts were cinched down too hard. There was a specified clearance between the frame and the spacers, so that movement in the plane of the engine was relatively free-moving but rocking in the cross-frame direction was inhibited.

I found that particular glitch when doing some fairly fast motoring on regular roads on the first prototype and discovered that our much acclaimed handling had gone to hell in a handbasket. On the high-speed banked oval track, we hadn't noticed it. A tear-down back at base uncovered the distortion in the spacer tubes. I believe the final fix was a washer, welded to each end of the spacer tube to give a bearing surface that would resist over-tightening.

The isolastic engine mounting system was the prime reason for developing the Commando. You can get equivalent handling for a rigidly mounted engine in the older Featherbed frame. My recommendation would be, if you want a rigid engine installation, sell your Commandos to someone who wants the isolastic system and go out and buy an Atlas or 650SS (but buy some good medical insurance for kidney-related complaints and lay in a good supply of headlamp bulbs).
 
Frank,

Always nice to hear was going on at the factory at the time. By using rose joints to locate the engine and transmission, there would be no side to side movement, the Teflon washers and adjustment washers can then be dispensed with leaving the rubber isolastics to do their job of isolating the engine's vibration from reaching the frame. I am sure the way the adjustable (by shims or threaded) isolastics were made in the end was mainly due to costs constraints, after all a few machined washers are a lot cheaper than spherical joints.

It's always time to rectify the design :wink:

Jean
 
Thanks for the replies I will stick with Isolastic but I do like the look of the head steady :)

I will post some pics when I can talk wifey into it,as long as I dont get abuse about modded bike. :oops:
 
Jean
Not to put too fine a point on it, but what is the difference between a "rose" joint and a regular "heim" joint?
 
sidreilley said:
Jean
Not to put too fine a point on it, but what is the difference between a "rose" joint and a regular "heim" joint?

a trip across the pond :mrgreen:
 
sidreilley said:
Jean
Not to put too fine a point on it, but what is the difference between a "rose" joint and a regular "heim" joint?

There's no difference. Both are trade names of rod end bearings, what you call them depends a lot on where you come from and who grabbed the market first.
 
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