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Norton from Australia
- Thread starter Jeandr
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Jeandr said:
Well, either fullauto is involved or there's two Aussies recreating the Norton head which is a real PITA in terms of casting.
For me the interesting bit is that - as Steve Maney - this guy went though the pain of a full redesign of the bottom end but kept the twin main bearing design. The 127bhp/l claim places this air-cooled two-valve engine in the region of water-cooled four- and five-valve sports cars like the Ferrari 458. Sorry, I don't believe this. On top there is a bit of the usual bashing of the others like Hemmings, Quaife and Maney. Hm.
Tim
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i'd like to hear testimonials before i shitcan what looks to be a pretty neat machine. i say good on em for going for it. i don't like the seat or headlight but i'd love to check it out, and if the torque, bhp and top speed isn't bulldust they've achieved something pretty special.
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I love to see people spend more on bikes than a nice (small) house. My kind of riding speed would never be able to use that much power, thats why I sold my bmw k1200. Just had a kid on a rocket killed in our area this past Sunday. I love to hear the sound of old britt bikes but not at 100mph plus. Be safe guys. Does look cool though! I guess I'm just getting old.
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15073jrmd said:
I think the phrase "Sounds too good to be true" might come into play here. But there are plenty of examples of people with too much money and some "crazy idea". :mrgreen:
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Somewhere I read that Steve Maney was getting 100 hp from a 920 but that's for racing with limited mileage. Mind you he doesn't use titanium rods and the Village cases look even thicker in some places. Village cranks are similar to a German tuner currently building some special performance parts in that they use bolt on balance weights. That HP figure is getting into drag race engine territory with methanol. Wasn't Hogslayer around 150hp per 850 but blown and running on Nitro as well. Certainly nice stuff and testimony to Australian engineering. Wonder if Fullauto had any discussions, like you say two newly tooled Norton heads from Oz, amazing, though FA's are for improved stock use and I assume Villages's are designed to go with their own parts as a package (pistons etc)?
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Keith1069 said:
The bike there is road registered. And roughly 108hp/l as Maney claims is already quite a lot for a two valve air cooled engine. IMHO that's just whishful thinking or the use of an engine dyno with a slightly flattering read-out.
I especially don't like sentences like this: "it is Totally redesigned with the latest engine technology as to the power claims." No, it's not. A bolt-up inline-twin crankshaft with two main bearings is antique. It was already antique when the Commando was introduced and we all know the reason why Norton continued to use antique technology.
Well, because there is no need to use Titanium for Con rods, steel is a very good material for these items - especially if you use the material properties nicely to get rid of the small end bushing like JS does. I don't agree with all the things on JS' homepage - he should especially pay attention to piston wear, it's not a particularly good idea to run turned pistons - but this part I can fully agree with and that's the best way to design a conrod and piston.
Hartmut does it in a better way as he places the counterweights as close as possible to the mains and uses the flywheel as inertia mainly and not for balancing - both reduces the stress on the cranktrain and cases.
http://www.britishclassicbikes.de/image ... C03643.JPG
Makes far more sense then the village bike which is more like applying better production methods on better material to produce a better version of the original - and not by a proper redesign as he claims.
Don't get me wrong though, it's some nice work on details and a nice bike and certainly better than a 70ies Commando but far from being the one and only answer to all our Norton prayers. What I don't like is the bragging and disrespect to what others have achieved - and the boring claim of "latest engine technology". E.g. he claims that he finishes the pistons himself. If that's done on a std lathe as JS pistons are obviously done they're far from applying "latest engine technology".
Tim
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"And roughly 108hp/l as Maney claims is already quite a lot for a two valve air cooled engine. IMHO that's just whishful thinking or the use of an engine dyno with a slightly flattering read-out."
trust me, that's not a flattering dyno read out!!
You have to see Steve's 1007 in action. Our 930 Tridents are just on 100 bhp, and Steve's Commando is definitely quicker, top end, drive out of corners, everywhere!! I can get my 750 commando off the line quicker in the wet because I can get all my power down, Steve's just spins the wheel.....but halfway down the back straight at Snetterton it's just like a missile coming past!
trust me, that's not a flattering dyno read out!!
You have to see Steve's 1007 in action. Our 930 Tridents are just on 100 bhp, and Steve's Commando is definitely quicker, top end, drive out of corners, everywhere!! I can get my 750 commando off the line quicker in the wet because I can get all my power down, Steve's just spins the wheel.....but halfway down the back straight at Snetterton it's just like a missile coming past!
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Seeley920 said:
Sorry, that was abit misleading: That was meant to refer to the 127bhp/l of the Village people - and that claim is allmost a massive 20% higher than Maney's. Given the fact that his numbers are from a full race engine with probably a rather short live I think that this is possible even if it might be a bit on the high side. As you've put engines on dynos you know the game, correction factors can be and are used in favor of your marketing claims. However the 127hp/l for a Roadster - no, I don't believe it.
Tim
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Are they talking at the crank or at the rear wheel. That might account for the difference.
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Maneys would be at the wheel! 20+ HP loss through the drivetrain would be a hell of a loss.....John Player Norton's lost 8bhp, I've had mine on a Bosch dyno and measured 7bhp transmission loss....belt drives are a little bit more efficient than the old triplex chains!
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Seeley920 said:
What I meant to say is "some of the loss".
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