New Norton Villiers Triumph Book

L.A.B.

L.A.B.

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http://www.bsa1971.com/

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Norton-V...orcycle-book-Brad-Jones-BSA-AJS-/153790930908

"Commanding little interest since its premature demise in 1978, the Norton Villiers Triumph story is nevertheless a compelling one, finding at its core Trade Union militancy at its most destructive, political policy reversals and inadequate project budgets – not to mention some memorable motorcycles and the impressive John Player Norton racing team.


With the assistance of a host of BSA & NVT documents, period reports, and inside information on certain aspects of the company, the course of the events that shaped NVT’s destiny are presented within this book accompanied by approximately 150 images.

Hardback
147 Pages
150gsm paper

Bikes covered include:
•Norton Commando
•Isolastic & Speedway B50 prototypes
•Triumph Trident & 750 twins
•NVT Easy-Rider, Rambler, BSA Tracker, Brigand, etc
•Wulf stepped piston & Norton 76 prototypes
•AJS Stormer
•John Player Norton racers
•Cosworth Challenge"
 
Interesting - has anybody read it? Joe Seifert (ZFD here) was commenting on a hoard of documents he has from the remains of NVT. Is this book worth buying Joe?
 
I've ordered a copy.

I've also read "Whatever Happened" etc by Bert Hopwood but I think that also needs to be read alongside Neale Shilton's "A Million Miles Ago" for some perspective.
 
What usually seems to be missing from these accounts of whatever happened are the Dockers ... Lord and Lady . Lord Docker was ceo of BSA and they were always being splashed in the papers with their gold plated and panelled top of the Range Daimler cars and other expensive trinkets.. So no funds for capital investment. Consequence out of date machine tooling and astronomical costs for machining trident and rocket three cases.. .
Which would help explain in part why the threes were so expensive and never competed with the Japanese ..
 
oldmikew said:
So no funds for capital investment. Consequence out of date machine tooling and astronomical costs for machining trident and rocket three cases ... Which would help explain in part why the threes were so expensive and never competed with the Japanese ..
Click to expand...

An american management consulting firm, the Boston Group, was charged by the Department of Industry in 1975 to review the british motorcycle industry remains. As for NVT, they found that "its Wolverhampton workers, because of the plant's old machinery, are less than a quarter as productive as those of Honda, Japan's leading motorcycle producer".

https://www.nytimes.com/1975/08/20/...dustry-sputtering-1500-workers-refuse-to.html

The situation may not have been quite as bad at Small Heath and Meriden.

-Knut
 
What grates is that BSA were a major manufacturer of machine tooling yet never sought to re equipe their motorcycle division . In fact they seem to have been the joker in the pack. In an attempt to stay profitable they took over the smaller Triumph and Ariel concerns which
may well have otherwise survived .
 
I happened to pass by the BSA Regal place in Southampton yesterday. Looked up on internet and they are now a buildings maintenance company (electrical, plumbing etc) and precision engineering company. Newly painted in white with original BSA sign proudly above all. So somebody owns the trade mark and iconic sign. Rather sad no longer used for motorcycles
 
oldmikew said:
What grates is that BSA were a major manufacturer of machine tooling yet never sought to re equipe their motorcycle division . In fact they seem to have been the joker in the pack. In an attempt to stay profitable they took over the smaller Triumph and Ariel concerns which
may well have otherwise survived .
Click to expand...

It is not enough just to install new machine tools. In the later half of the fifties AMC spent several millions with Alfred Herbert, the largest machine tool maker in Britain, fitting out their machine shops with new capstan lathes, milling machines & drill presses etc, & then continued to make the same old components they had been making for years!
On the subject of the new NVT book; this has just arrived & I had only got to page 10 before I started to read the same old nonsense about bloody Superblend bearings having & I quote: barrel shaped rollers (known as a spherical roller bearing) rather than a cylindrical one shaped one.....ARGHHHH!! Will this cobblers never end.
I do hope the rest of the book isn't full of misinformation. Watch this space.
 
Matchless said:
On the subject of the new NVT book; this has just arrived & I had only got to page 10 before I started to read the same old nonsense about bloody Superblend bearings having & I quote: barrel shaped rollers (known as a spherical roller bearing) rather than a cylindrical one shaped one.....ARGHHHH!! Will this cobblers never end.
Click to expand...

My copy arrived today and I thought exactly the same!
 
Cooperatives do not necessarily mean that workgroups are self-managed. It is difficult to get workers to self-manage if they have insufficient information. For most companies ISO9000 type management systems are just window dressing. However if they are written around national standards and concentrate on operational risk, they can be used for training purposes and enable worker participation.
The British invented quality management systems, but they don't seem to believe their own bullshit.
 
Matchless said:
It is not enough just to install new machine tools. In the later half of the fifties AMC spent several millions with Alfred Herbert, the largest machine tool maker in Britain, fitting out their machine shops with new capstan lathes, milling machines & drill presses etc, & then continued to make the same old components they had been making for years!
On the subject of the new NVT book; this has just arrived & I had only got to page 10 before I started to read the same old nonsense about bloody Superblend bearings having & I quote: barrel shaped rollers (known as a spherical roller bearing) rather than a cylindrical one shaped one.....ARGHHHH!! Will this cobblers never end.
I do hope the rest of the book isn't full of misinformation. Watch this space.
Click to expand...

No its not enough of itself toinstall new machine tools and it is astonishing to me to visit working at amc website and see just how uptodate their kit was ,but it was said that it cost BSA and then NVT more to machine a set of Trident cases than it did to make a complete Ford engine.I assume that some capital investment in machine tooling would have made dramatic improvement .
 
Last edited by a moderator:
A lot has to do with mindset. Australia is similar to the UK. In 1948 when Menzies was elected, he had all the war industries on which to build. Since then we have lost the lot because the conservatives never saw the need to do better than the norm. I worked in a few of those old war-time factories and know what their capabilities were. With the wrong mindset, there is no way forward. Most Australian politicians could not lead a blow-fly to a sheep's backside. And our academics are not much better.
The joke is, our academics are now teaching Chinese students to become engineers. We even teach the Chinese military to fly aeroplanes.
 
Look up Federated Investment Trust and Corporation who resided at 1, Love Lane - remember that address? then look at the archive information about the directors and their assocaited companies and all of a sudden the BSA, Meriden and other events all make sense. Seems like it was at the office in the morning and sat in the House during the afternoon.
 
Dommie Nator said:
I've ordered a copy.

I've also read "Whatever Happened" etc by Bert Hopwood but I think that also needs to be read alongside Neale Shilton's "A Million Miles Ago" for some perspective.
Click to expand...
I have and read both books several times. Both are very good and very interesting insight into the British motorcycle industry.
 
This new one brings a few things together into one book. Living very close to the Triumph at Meriden (not that the factory was there, it was more Allesley) I knew quite a few people that "worked" there during the blockade and the Co-op times. One of the wives of one of the blockaders worked where I did at the time and was caught with her fingers in the till and was sacked on the spot.

I must add that the quality of the paper is excellent.
 

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